CONGRESSION.AL RECORD-SEN ATE. - Govinfo.gov

1914 .. CONGRESSION.AL RECORD-SEN ATE. 3021 By Mr. GRAHAM of Pennsylvania: Petitions of the Benefit

Society Vorwarts uncl sundry citizens ot Roscoe, Pa., protesting against national prohibition; to the Committee on the Judiciary.

By Mr. HAMMOND: Petition of the Arbeiter Unterstuetzung Verein, of New Ulm, Minn., protesting against national prohibition ; to the Committee on the Judiciary.

By Mr. KE~EDY of Rhode Island: Memorial of General Knox Branch of the American Continental League, of Providence, R. I., protesting against the " One hundred years of peace celebmtion"; to the Committee on Foreign A1Iairs.

By Mr. KINKAID of Nebraska: Petition of SUQ.dry citizens of Cozad, Nebr., favoring the passage of the Lindquist pure fabric and leather blli; to the Committee on Interstate and Foreign Commerce.

By Mr. LIEB : Memorial of the German Maennerchor of E\nnsville, Ind., protesting against national prohibition; to the Committee on the Judiciary.

Bv Ir. LONERGAN: Petition of the Switchmen's Union of North .America, of Buffalo, N. Y., favoring the passage of the Bartlett-Bacon anti-injunction bills; to the Committee on the Judiciary.

By Mr. J. I. NOLAN: Petitions d the San Francisco Typographical Un1on, No. 21, of San Francisco, CaL, and five other labor or,;;aniz.ations in the city of San Francisco, in behalf of the passage of the seamen's bill {S. 136); to the Committee on the Merchant M:n.rine and Fisheries.

By ~fr. O'SHAUNESSY : Petitions of ozganizutions of Provi- · deuce. R. I., protesting against the passage of bills restricting immigration; to the Committee on Immigration and Naturalization.

.Also, petition of the General Knox Branch of the American Continen~'ll League, .of Providence, R. I., protesting against the •• One hundred years of p~3ce eelebration "; to the Committee on Foreign Afl'airs.

Also, petition of F. R. ReynoldR, of Providence, R. I., favoring the passage of House bill 29, relati\e to eight hours a clay for women in the District of Columbia; to :the Committee on Labor.

By Mr. REILLY of Connecticut : Petition of Polish citizens of Wallingford, Conn., .and Independent Musiker Association, of New Haven, Conn., against House bill 6060; to the Committee on Immigration and Naturalization.

By Mr. SCULLY : Petition of members of the German-American Amance of Middlesex County, N. J., protesting against national prohibition; to the Committee on the Judiciary.

Also, petition of the National Association of Assistant Postmasters, relative to the dismissal of assistant postmasters; to the Comrui ttee on the Post Office and Post Roads.

Also, petition of the National Association of Clothiers, of New York City, protesting against the passage of the Bartlett-Bacon anti-injunction bills; to the Committee on the Judiciary.

.Also, petitions of members of the German-American Alliance, and Adam Vogel and John Fee, jr., all of llliddlesex County, N. J., protesting against national prohibition; to the Committee on the Judiciary.

By Mr. J . . M. C. SMITH: Petition of A. S. Williams Post, No. 40, of Charlotte, Mich., and Le-wis Clark Post, No. 2757, of

·Olivet, .Mich., protesting against any change in the American flag; to the Committee on the Judiciary.

Also, petition of the National Association of Clothiers, favoring the passage of the pure fabric bill; to the Committee on Interstate and Foreign Commerce.

Also, papers to accompany a bill (H. R. 7868) for the relief of Rose G. Houchen; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

Also, memorial of the Retail Jewelers' Association of Irving, Mich., protesting against guaranty of gold-filled watchcases; to the Committee on Interstate and Foreign Commerce.

By .Mr. STEPHENS of California: Petition of citizens of Los Angeles, Cal., against House bill 9674; to the Committee on the District of Columbia.

Also, petition of the California State Federation of Labor, favoring Bryan-Poindexter bill; to the Committee on Ways and Means.

Also, petition of citizens of California, against excluding the 1\Ienace from the mails; to the Committee on Rules.

Also, petition of Alaska Fishermen's Union; San Francisco Typographical Union, No. 21; and Elevator Constructors' Un1on, No. 18, favoring seamen's bill; to the Committee on the Merchant Marine and Fisheries.

Also, petition of the Associated Chambers of Commerce of the Pacific Coast, favoring an appropriation for participation by Alaska in the Panama-Pacific Exposition; to the Committee on Appropriations.

.Also, petitions of citizens of Los Angeles, Cal., favoring House bill 5139; to the Committee on Reform in the Civil Service.

.Also, petition of George H. Dunlap, of Los Angeles, Cal., against House bill 5139 ; to the Committee on Reform in the Civil Service.

.Also, petition of the Polish Citizen's Club of Los Angeles, Cal., against House bill 0060; to the Committee on Immigration and Naturalization.

.Also, petition of the German-American Alliance, of San Diego, Cal., and Concordia Turnverein, of San Diego, Cal., against House joint resolution 168; to the Committee on the Judiciary.

By Mr. THACHER: Petition of John Russell, commodore Plymouth Yacht Club, of Plymouth, .Mass., relative to deepening, etc., of the Government Basin near the wharves in Plymouth (Mass.) Harbor; to the Committee on Rivers and llarbors.

Also, petition of the Boston Fish Bureau, protesting against the passage of the 1\fcKellar cold-storage bill; to the Committee on Interstate and Foreign Commerce.

By l\fr. TRIBBLE : Petition of J. E. McGee and other citizens, protesting against oil mills operating cotton gins; to the Committee on the Judiciary.

By Mr. YOUNG of North Dakota: Petition of Mrs. Elizabeth Grass, of Fargo, N. Dak., favoring increase of pension for Army nurses of the Civil War; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

SENATE. FRIDAY, February 6, 1914.

The Chaplain, Rev. Forrest J. Prettymn.n, D. D., offered the following prn.yer :

Almighty God, breathe upon -us the gentle and refining in.fluence of Thy holy spirit. In the midst of all confilct of interest and dash of op-inion may we be enabled to keep the unity of spirit in the bond of peace. Grant us that grace of heart and life upon which a true foundation of manhood may be builded. Give to us the spirit that creates and seals forever the blessed bonds of friendship. Give to us passionate, 3.1"dent patriotism, that our lives may he given. may be consumed, in the interest of the great commission that Thou hast committed to our hands. For Christ's sake. Amen.

The Journal of yesterday's proceedings was read and appro,ed. 'THE UNITED STATES STEEL CORPORATION.

The VICE PRESIDENT laid before the Senate a communication from the Interstate Commerce Commission acknowledging the receipt of the resolution of the 2d instant, relative to an examination and inquiry for the purpose of ascertaining whether the United States Steel Corporation or any of its subsidiaries has been guilty of giving or receiving any unlawful rebates, offsets, or preferences, especially within the last six years, etc-., and stating tha.t the resolution will receive prompt attention, which was referred to the Committee on Interstate Commerce.

MESSAGE FROM THE HOUSE.

A message from the House of Representatives, by J. C. South, its Chief Clerk, -announced that the House had passed the joint resolution ( S. J. Res. 107) relating to supervision of the Lincoln Memorial.

The message also announced that the House had agreed to the report of the committee of conference on the disagreeing votes of the two Houses on the amendments of the House to the bill (S. 832) granting pensions and increase of pensions to certain soldiers and sailors of the Civil War and certain wid-ows and dependent relatives ,of such soldiers and sailors.

The message further announced that the House had agreed to the report of the committee of conference on the disagreeing votes of the two Houses on the amendments of the Senate to the bill ( S. 833) granting pensions and increase of pensions to certuin soldiers and sailors of the Ci\il War and certain widows and dependent relatives of such soldiers and sailors.

The message also announced that the House had agreed to the report of the committee of conference on the disagreeing votes of the two Houses on the amendments of the Senate to the bill ( S. 834) granting pensions and increase of pensions to certain soldiers and sailors of the Civil War and certain widows and d-ependent relatives of such soldiers and sailors.

ENROLLED BILLS SIGNED.

The message further announced that the Speaker of the House had signed the following enrolled bills, and they were thereupon signed by the Vice President:

H. R. 9574. An act to authorize the Missouri, Kansas & Texas Railway Co. to construct a bridge across the Mississippi River near the city of HannibaJ, in the State of Missouri ; and

H. R.10084. An act to authorize the changing of the names of the steamships Buckman and Watson.

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3022 CONGRESS! ON AL RECORD-SEN ATE. FEBRUARY 6,

PETITIONS AND MEMORIALS.

The VICE PRESIDENT presented memorials of Francis Scott Key Branch, American Continental League, of Brooklyn, N. Y.; of Paul Revere Branch, American Continental League, of tLeominster, Mass. ; of George Washington Branch, American Continental League, of Passaic, N. J.; of General Montgomery Branch, American Continental Leag1,1e, of Brooklyn, N. Y.; and of Commodore Barry Branch, American Continental League, of Passaic, N. J., remonstrating against an appropriation being made for the celebration of the so-called" One hundred years of peace among English-speaking peoples," which were referred to the Committee on Foreign Relations.

1\Ir. BURTON presented a memorial of Ohio Lodge, No. 269, Independent Order of B'rith Abraham, of Cleveland, Ohio, remonstrating against the enactment of legislation providing an educational test for immigrants to this country, which was referred to the Committee on Immigration.

1\Ir. GALLINGER presented a petition of the United National Association of Post Office Clerks of Portsmouth, N. H., praying for an increase of the salaries of post-office clerks and carriers, which was referred to the Committee on Post Offices and Post Roads.

He also presented a petition of the National Association of Civil Service Employees of Portsmouth, N. H., praying that pensions be granted civil-service employees, which was referred to the Committee on Civil Service and Retrenchment.

1\fr. NELSON presented a memorial of the congregation of the Kenneth Israel Synagogue of Minneapolis, Minn., remonstrating against the enactment of legislation to provide an educational test for immigrants to this country, which was referred to the Committee on Immigration.

He also presented a memorial of sundry citizens of Stewartville and Simpson, in the State of Minnesota, remonstrating against the enactment of legislation compelling the observance of Sunday as a day of rest in the District of Columbia, which was referred to the Committee on the District of Columbia.

1\fr. THOMPSON presented petitions of sundry citizens of the sixth congressional district of Kansas, praying for the enactment of legislation providing for Government loans on farm land, which were referred to the Committee on Banking and Currency.

He also presented petitions of the congregation of the First Presbyterian Church of Clay Center, of the Daughters of the King Class of the Methodist Episcopal Church of Hiawatha, and of Wesleyan Brotherhood Class of the Methodist Episcopal Church of Hiawatha, all in the State of Kansas, praying for the adoption of an amendment to the Constitution to prohibit the manufacture, sale, or importation of intoxicating beverages, which were referred to the Committee on the Judiciary.

Mr. STEPHENSON presented resolutions adopted by the iWisconsin State Union, American Society ·of Equity, · of Madison, Wis., remonstrating against the enactment of legislation to further define the Sherman antitrust law and making it applicable to farmers' and consumers' cooperative organizations, which were referred to the Committee on the Judiciary.

He also presented resolutions adopted by the Commercial Club of Superior, Wis., favoring an appropriation for the improvement of the Duluth-Superior Harbor in that State, which were referred to the Committee on Commerce.

He also presented resolutions adopted by the Milwaukee Association of Credit Men, of Wisconsin, favoring an appropriation for the control of floods of the country, which were referred to the Committee on Commerce.

He also presented a memorial of Aerie No. 137, Fraternal Order of Eagles, of Milwaukee, Wis., remonstrating against the adoption of an amendment to the Constitution to prohibit the manufacture, sale, or importation of intoxicating beverages, which was referred to the Committee on the Judiciary.

l\1r. BRISTOW presented a memorial of sundry citizens of Coffey County, Kans., remonstrating against the enactment of legislation compelling the observance of Sunday as a day of rest in the District of Columbia, which was referred to the Committee on the District of Columbia.

He also presented a memorial of sundry citizens of Burlington, Kans., remonstrating against the enactment of legislation to prohibit the free use of the mails by the press of the country, which was referred to the Committee on Education and Labor.

1\Ir. !:RADLEY pres~nted a memorial of sundqr citizens of Bowling Green, Ky., remonstrating against the enactment of legislation compelling the observance of Sunday as a day of rest in the District of Columbia, which was referred to the Committee on the District of Columbia.

Mr. McLEAN presented a memorial of Wallingford Branch, American Continental League, of Wallingford, Conn., remon-

strating against an appropriation being made for the celebration of the so-called " One hundred years of peace among Englishspeaking peoples," which was referred to the Committee on Foreign Relations.

He also presented a memorial of the German-American Alliance of Hartford, Conn., remonstrating against the enactment of legislation providing an educational test for immigrants to this country, which was referred to the Committee on Immigration.

Mr. LODGE presented memorials of sundry citizens of Wakefield, Chicop~e, Northbridge, and Lowell, all in the State of Massachusetts, remonstrating against the enactment of legislation to provide an educational test for immigrants to this country, which was referred to the Committee on Immigration.

Mr. BRANDEGEE presented a memorial of Local Branch, American Continental League, of Wallingford, Conn., remonstrating against an appropriation being made for the celebration of the so-called " One hundred years of peace among English-speaking peoples," which was referred to the Committee on Foreign Relations.

REPORTS· OF COMMITTEES.

Mr. BRYAN. From the Committee on Appropriations I report back favorably, with amendments, the bill (H. R. 12235) making appropriations for fortifications and other works of defense, for the armament thereof, for the procurement of llea vy ordnance for trial and service, and for other purposes, and I submit a report_(No. 230) thereon. I desire to give notice that on Monday next, after the routine morning business, I shall move to proceed to the consideration of the bill.

1.'he VICE PRESIDENT. The bill will be placed on the calendar.

Mr. CHAI\IBERLAIN, from the Committee on Military Affairs, to which was referred the bill (S. 1032) to amend section 1342 and chapter 6, Title XIV, of the Revised Statutes of the United States, and for other purposes, reported it with amendments and submitted a report (No. 229) thereon.

STATUE OF JOHN GORRIE.

Mr. SMITH of Georgia, from the Committee on the Library, to which was referred House concurrent resolution No. 31, reported it without amendment, and it was considered by unanimous consent and agreed to, as follows :

Resolved by the House of Representativea (the Senate concurring) That the State of Florida be, and is hereby, granted the privilege of placing in Statuary Hall of the Capitol the statue of John Gorrle, now deceased, who was a citizen of Florida, illustrious for distinguished civic services,

RAINY RIVER DAM •

Mr. NELSON. From the Committee on Commerce, I report back favorably without amendment the bill ( S. 3546) to extend the time for constructing a dam by Rainy River Improvement Co. across the outlet on Namakan Lake at Kettle Falls, in St. Louis County, Minn., and I submit a report (No. 227) thereon. I ask unanimous consent for the present consideration of the bill. It is a short bill and is favorably recommended by the War Department.

The Secretary read the bill; and there being no objection, the Senate, as in Oommittee of the Whole, proceeded to its consideration. It extends the time for commencing and completing the · construction of the · dam by Rainy River Improvement Oo., a corporation organized under the laws of the State of Minnesota, its successors and assigns, authorized by the act of Congress approved February 24, 1911, to be built across the outlet of Lake Namakan at Kettle Falls, in St. Louis County, Minn., to one year and three years, respectively, from date of approval hereof:

The bill was reported to the Senate without amendment, ordered to be engrossed for a third reading, read the third time, and passed.

MARKING OF GRAVES OF CONFEDERATE SOLDIERS AND SAILORS.

Mr. DU PONT. From the Committee on Military Affairs, I report back favorably without amendment the joint resolution (S. J. Res. 90) to continue in effect the provisions of the act of March 9, 1906 (Stat. L., vol. 34, p. 56), and I submit a report (No. 228) thereon. I ask for the present consideration of the joint resolution.

Mr. SMOOT. Let it be read first. The VICE PRESIDENT. It will be read. The Secretary read the joint resolution, as follows: ResoZvea, etc., That the act entitled "An act to provide for the

appropriate marking of the graves of soldiers and sailors of the Confederate army and navy who died in northern prisons and were buried near the prisons where they died, and for other purposes," approved March 9, 1906, and continued in full force and effect for two years by joint resolution approved February 26, 1908, and for the additional period of one year by a joint resolution approved February 25, 1910, and for the further additional period of two years by a

1914~ ·coNGRESSIONAL. RECORD-SENATE~ 3023 . joint resolution approved December 23, 1910, is continued in full force and efi'ect for two years from this date; and the unexpended balance of the appropriation made by said act of March 9, 1~06, ls continued and made applicable for expenditure during tlle additional period of two years her ein provided for : Provided, That herea.fter the provisions of said act shall include and apply to the graves of Conf ederate soldiers and sailors lying in all national cemeteries and ceme· teries at Federal milUary stations or localities throughout the country: Providetl f urther, That the compensation of the commissioner shnll be fix.ed by the Secretary of War.

Mr. SMOCYI'. I should like to ask the Senator from Delaware if he knows how much ot the original appropriation has been expended?

Mr. DU PONT. I understand that it has all been used but $50,000. That remains unexpended, and it is the object to reach that amount.

Mr. SMOOT. I have no objection to the passage of the joint resolution.

There being no objection, the joint resolution was considered: as in Committee of the Whole.

The joint resolution was reported to the Senate witho-ut amendment, ordered to be engrossed for a third reading, read the third time, and passed.

Mr. DU PONT. I also report back adversely from the Committee on Military .Afrairs the joint resolution (S. J. Res. 48) to continue in effect the provisions o:f the act of March 9, 1906 (Stat. L., vol. 34, p. 56). and I move that it be postponed indefinitely.

The motion was agreed to. BILLS INTRODUCED.

Bills were introduced, read the first time, and, by unanimous consent, the second time, and referred as follows:

By Mr. FLETCHER: A bill ( S. 4330) .for the relief of Frank E. Artaud; to the

Committee on 1\Iilitary Affairs. Bv Mr. NELSON: A. bill ( S. 4381) for the incorporation and regulation of cor

pomtions eng.uged in interst..<-tte commerce; to the Committee on the Judiciary.

By .Mr. STEPHENSON: A bill ( S. 4382) for the erection of a public building at Wau

pun, Wis.; to the Committee on Public Buildings and Grounds. A bill ( S. 4383) granting an increase of pension to Edward

Canna van; to the Committee on Pensions. By 1\.fr. BURTON: A bin (S. 4384) granting an increase of pension to H~nry

Hahn; to the Committee on PeD.Bions. By Mr. BRISTOW: A bill ( S. 4385) to correct the military record o:f Henry

Woodard; to the Committee on Military Affairs. A bill (S. 4386) granting an increase of pension to John W.

Shults (with accompanying papers); to the Committee on PenSions.

A bill ( S. 4387) to remove the charge of desertion against Hervey Griffin (with accompanying paper); to the Committee on Military Aff::tirs.

By Mr. OLIVER: A bfll (S. 4388) authorizing the Secretary of War to donate

to the Masonic homes property at Elizabethtown, Pa., four brass or bronze cannon or fieldpieces, with their carriages, and a suitable outfit of cannon balls; to the Committee on Military Af-

. fairs. A. bill (S. 4389) granting a pension to F. Isabelle Lawrence;

to th e Committee on Pensions. . Bv Mr. CLAPP : A. bill ( S. 4390) granting an increase of peD.Bion to Samuel

Lee Davis; to the Committee on Pensions. By Mr. KERN: A bill ( S. 4301) granting a pension to Amanda E. Kelley

:(with accompanying papers); to the Committee on Pensions. By Mr. McCUMBER: A bill ( S. 4392) granting an increase of pension to Calvin D.

Holbrook; to the Committee on Pensions. By Mr . SMITH of Arizona : A bill (S. 4393) to amend an act entitled '~An act providing

for second homestead and desert-land entries," approved F-ebruary 3, 1911; to the Committee on Public Lands.

By 1\Ir. NEWLANDS: A bill ( S. 4394) for the extension of time under the reclama

tion act, and for other purposes; to the Committee on Irrigation and Reclamation of Arid Lands.

By Mr. RANSDELL: A bill ( S. 4395) to regulate the importation of viruses, sermns,

toxins, and analogous products, to regulate interstate traffic in said articles, and for other purposes; to the Committee on Interstate Commerce.

By Mr. VARDAMAN: A bill (S. 4396) for the relief of heii·s or estate of David

S. Sexton, deceased (with accompanying paper); to the Com~ mittee on Claims.

By Mr. POINDEXTER: A bill ( S. 4397) granting a pen.sion to Annie El Farrell; to

the Committee on Pensions. NEW YOR~ NEW HAVEN & . HARTFORD RAILROAD.

The VICE PRESIDID T. The Chair lays before the Senate a resolution coming over from n. preceding day, which will be stated.

The SECRETARY. Senate resolution 200, by Mr. NORRIS, requesting the Interstate Commerce Commission to reopen its examination of the affairs of the New York, New Haven & Hartford Railroad Co.

1\Ir. GALLINGER. M:r. President, I suggest the absence of a: quorum.

The VICE PRESIDENT. The Secretary will call the roll. The Secretary called the ron, and the following Senators an ..

swered to their names : Ashurst Fletcher Nelson Bradley Gallinger Newlan"ds Brady Gronna Norris Brandegee Hollis Overman Bristow Johnson Page Bryan Jones Perkins Burleigh Kenyon Pomerene Burton Kern Saulsbury Chamberlain Lee, Md. Shafroth Chilton Lippitt Sheppard Clapp Lodge Shields Cummins McCumber Simmons Dillingham Martin, Va. Smltb, Arlz. du Pont Martin"e, N.J. Smith, Ga. Fall Myers Smith, 8. C.

Smoot Stephenson Sterling Sutherland Swanson Th.{)mpson Tillman Townsend Vardaman Walsh Weeks Works

.Mr. 1\fYERS. I am authorized to announce that the junior Senato-r from Missouri [Mr. REED] is necessarily abBent on important business. I desire that this announcement shall stand for the day.

I am also authorized to announce that the senior Senator from Missouri [1\Ir. SToNE] is necessarily detained from the Chamber by serious illness. This announcement may also stand for the day.

Mr. KERN- I desire to state that my colleUoooue [Mr. SHIVELY] is unavoidably absent from the Senate. I wish to have this announcement stand fol" the day.

Mr. SHAFROTH. I desire to anno-unce the necessary af>... sence of my colleague [M:r. THOMAS], and to- state that he iS paired with the senior Senator from New York [Mr. RooT].

Mr. THOMPSON. I desire to announce the necessary a~ sence of the junior Senator from .AI'kansas [Mr. RoBINSON] on official business connected with the Senate.

Mr. SHEPPARD. I wish to announce the necessary absence of my colleague [Mr. CULBERSON} and to say that he has a genera]) pair with the Senator from Delaware [Mr. 1m PoNT]. This an .. nouncement may stand for the day.

Mr. CHAMBERLAIN. I desire to announce that my corleague [Mr. LANE] is absent in attendance upon committee work of the Senate.

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. I wish to announce that the senior Senator from Georgia [Mr. BAcoN] is still detained at home by, sickness.

The VICE PRESIDENT. Fifty-seven Senators have an~ swered to the roll call. There is a quorum present

Mr. NORRIS. Mr. President, I ask that the resolution be read • The VICE PRESIDENT. The Secretal"'J will read the resolu ...

lution. The Secretary read the resolution (S. Res. 260) submitted byj

Mr. NonnLS on the 3d instant, as follows: ResoltJed, That the Interstate Cpmmerce Commission be requested to

reopen its examination of the affairs of the New York, New Haven & Hartford Railroad Co. and to make a further investigation of the finan., cial transactions of said company, with a view of ascertaining:

First. What became of the funds of said company wrongfully Invested at fictitious values in the various enterprises and corporations men .. tioned in the opinion o1 the Interstate Com merc-e Commission, No. 2384, case No. 4845, entitled "The New England investigati on in the matte~ of rates , classifications, regulations, and praetfees of carriers.," sub-. mitted May 20, 1913 and decided J une 20, 1913.

Second. Whether the person or persons ~uthorizing such investment of tbe funds of said company and tile person or persons receiving the benefit thereof are lia1Jle to punishment under existing laws.

Third. Whether under ensting law such funds so in-vested can be recovered on behalf of tbe stockho-lders of said company .

Fourth. What legislation, if any, is necessary to prevent the recur~ renee of simlln.r transactions.

·:Mr. NORil.IS. Mr. Presiden t. to begin with, I desire to modify: the resolution on page 1, line 7, by strit.-ing o-ut the word" wrong~ fully," and in the same line, after the word " invested,"_ b;,; striking out the words "at fictitious values,"' so that that part of the resolution will read:

First. What became of the funds of said company inyested in thE! various enterprises and corporations-

3024' CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. FEBRUARY 6,

And so forth. Mr. NEWLAl"'\fDS. 1\lr. President, will the Senator from Ne

braska permit me to make a statement regarding the resolution? 1\Ir. NORRIS. There will certainly be no objection to the

Senator making a statement, but I wish to make one myself, and then, I presume, the Senator will have ample opporttmity to be heard.

Mr. GALLINGER. Does the Senator from Nebraska modify his resolution by simply striking out the words he has stated?

1\lr. NORRIS. By striking out those•words. 1\Ir. GALLINGER. I am very glad the Senator has done that. 1\Ir. NORRIS. l\Ir. President, it will be observed that this

resolution does not propose a new investigation, but that it asks the Interstate Commerce Commission to reopen an investigation which they once made of the affairs of the New Ha\"'en Railroad Co. The investigation was concluded and an opinion rendered, as stated in the resolution itself. It was begun on the 20th day of 1\lay, 1913, and decided by the commission on the 20th day of June, 1913.

In my judgment the opinion rendered by the commission, through 1\Ir. Commissioner Prouty, shows on its face that the investigation was not complete. It does not show what became of the funds that were invested in yarious enterprises and in yarious institutions and corporations in which this railroad company was interested.

1\lr. GALLINGER. 1\fr. President--The VICE PRESIDEN'.r. Does the Senator from Nebraska

yield to the Senator from New Hampshire? l\Ir. NORRIS. I yield to the Senator. 1\lr. GALLINGER. Mr. President, I have been absent a few

days and have not yery closely followed the proceedings of the Senate. I will ask the Senator from Nebraska at this point, if the Senator pleases to answer, why this investigation was not pushed to u conclusion by the Interstate Commerce Commission? Was it because of the lack of funds?

1\ir. NORRIS. No; I aru not fully advised as to that; but, in a general way, my idea is that one of the reasons was that some of the witnesses were not cross-examined because of the fenr that there might thereby be immunity given to them. The investigation wns not made upon any resolution similar to this, but was a general investigation of the New England railroad situation. On page 578 of the opinion rendered by Judge Prouty, in referring particularly to this company and its capitalization, he uses this language :

June 30, 1!>03. the total capitalization of tbe New Haven Co. was npgroximately $93,000,000, of which $79,000,000 was stock and $14,-00 ,000 bonds. The mileage then operated was 2,040 miles. On Jun~ 30, 1912, the capitalization, excluding stock premiums, was $417,000,000, an increase of $324,000,000, while the operated mileage was 2,090 miles, an increase tJf GO miles.

The bonds and notes of the New Haven Co. had been during this pericd ordinarily issued at not less than par. The stock was sold at considerably above par. About Ji)21,000,000 of the stock reported by the New Haven Co. as outstanding had been, in fact, issued to the New England Navigation Co., one of its subsidiary companies, by which 1t was held, so that this stock is still. virtually in the treasury of the parent company. Di regarding this stock, treating its notes and bonds as issued at par and including the premiums upon capital stock which has actually gone into the hands of the public, the New Haven received during the nine years under consideration from the issue of stock and securities about 340,000,000. ·

While the New Haven operated 2,040 miles in 1903, It only owned -of this operated mileage 438 miles. During the nine years this owned milenge was increased by about 800 miles, and the New Haven Co. expended approximately ."40,000,000 in acquiring this additional owned milC'age. It expended dul"ing the nine ;years something o':er $GG,OOOlOOO upon its railroad for betterments anu equipment, making a tota of

13G 000 000 devoted to its railroad property proper. This would leave the sum of ~04,000,000, which in nine years had

been expended in operations outside its railroad sphere. This fact of itself is a most significant one, which, standing alone, might well require explanation. Attention is here dil·ected to some of the purposes for which and the manner in which this vast sum has been invested.

Mr. GALLINGER. 1\Ir. President--1\Ir. NOllRIS. I yield to the Senator. l\Ir. GALLINGER. I desire to say-and I thank the Senator

for the courtesy of permitting me to say it during his remarksthat I do not propose to antagonize this resolution, nor do I think the Senators from New England will antagonize it-that is my impression-but I am constrained to ask the Senator why it is that the Interstate co·mmerce Commission, with such great powers and with a free hand, as it seems to me, should halt an investigation it had been making, so that it becomes 'necessary for Congress to pass a resolution requesting it to continue that investigation? It seems to me anomalous, and I ask .the Senator simply for information on this point. If that great eommission has made an investigation that is incomplete and bas halted it for any purpose, it occurs to me that it has ample power, ample funds, and ample assistance, clerical and other.wise, to take _up the investigation and push it to a conclusion.

· Mr. NORRIS. 1\fr. President; I have no doubt that the commission haYe sufficient power and sufficient authority, and I am not able, perhaps, to fully satisfy the Senator as to why they discontinued the investigation. I want to say that, after I commenced to investigate the matter, I waited for what seemed to me to be quite a long while for some steps to be taken in the matter, until I became convinced, from reading this report and from subsequent charges that were made, to which I am going to refer, that it was a matter of national importance and one that ought to be giyen the fullest publicity before the American people. ·whether that is sufficient reason, it is the main reason, I wj.ll say to the Senator, why I concluded to introduce this resolution and why I believe the matter ought to be investigated.

I will show, I think, further on from this report that the opinion of Judge Prouty demonstrates on its face that the investigation was not complete. He starts out by considering' n large number of financial transactions. I am only going to refer to one or two of them as a matter of illustration. He takes up the Rhode Island Co.-that is one of the subsidiary companies, one of the organizations in which a large amount of this money was invested-and discusses it at some length, giving some of the details of the transaction; but, unless it is desired, I do not care to go into the details, for the reason that I do not care to take up the time of the Senate in that re~)ect. I want, however, to read the conclusion regarding this Rhode Island Co. which Judge Prouty reached, which is found on page 579 of this document:

Representatives o! the New Haven Co. earnestly insisted that this company ha.d not watered the stock of the Rhode Island Co.-

It was claimed on the one side that the stock of this company had been watered, and it was claimed on the part of the New Haven people that they had not watered it. Judge Prouty says further: and this, sti·ictly speaking, is true. The improvement company turned In the water and the New Haven Co. converted that water into wine. In whatever aspect the transaction is viewed the New Haven Co. gave $13,500,~00 for nothing.

The fictitious value that-was put into the company was put in before the New Haven Co. bought it in this case. Then Judge Prouty discusses-and I run going to refer to that only briefly-the New York, Westchester & Boston Railway, which is one of the subsidiar·y companies in which a large amount of the stockholders' money was invested. Says Judge Prouty:

'l'he New York, Westchester & Boston Railway is a fow·-track electric road extending from White Plains, N. Y., to a terminus at Harlem River,~ a distance of slightly over 20 miles. This road was built and ownea by the New Haven. -

Fmther on he says : The books of the New Haven Co. afford but little information as to

the actual process of construction. Between November 2_~. 1906, and May 1, 1907, that company deposited with J. P. Morgan & co. $11,000,-000, which was turned over from time to time to the Milbrook Co.

The Milbrook Co., I might say in passing, was another corporation, with a capital stock of $1,000. It is a remarkable fact, howeYer, that they paid the attorneys who drew up the articles of incorporation-! have forgotten the exact amount, but a yery large amount of money for drawing up the papers.

l\1r. CUl\fl\IINS. Fifteen thousand dollars. 1\Ir. NORRIS. I am informed by the Senator from Iowa that

the amount was $15,000. That company-

That is, the l\Iilbrook Co.-gave its notel'l to Morgan & Co. for the amounts received by it, and these notes were passed over to the New Haven Co. and wPre its ,.OliChers for this money. 1t dces not appear wllat the Milbrook Co. was, nor what its relation to the New Haven Co., nor its financial standing.

Other sums were subsequently advanced by the New Haven Co. at various times and in various amounts. The Milbrook Co. figured largely in these trans'lctions, and tllere was also a City & County Contract Co. The sum of $275,000 was paid to Oakley Thorne and Marsden J. Perry to secure the release of some conh·act. 'rhere was n merger of the Port Chester Co. and the old New York, Westchester & Boston Co. into a new New York, Westcllester & Boston Co. This ratter company issued its 41. per cent mortgage bonds, which were turned ovPr to the New Haven Co. in the amount of 518,000.000. Of these. $17,200,000 were guaranteed by the New Haveri Co. and sold to J. Pierpont 1\Iorl!an & Co. for $16,000,000, a discount of $1,200,000, which tbc New Haven still carries as an asset upon its books. .

After going into some more details, he concludes by saying: Here, therefore, is an P.ntcrprise which bas cost the New Haven Co.

$12,000,000 in excess of the value of its property npon its own sllow· ing. Again the question arises, What has become of this $12,000,0001 In case of the Rhode Island Co. it was possible to lor.ate the corpora· tlon if not the individual, which bad os~ensibly obtnined the money, but 'in this case it is impossible, from anything upon the books of the New Haven Co., to do this, even approximately. So far as those recol."ds go, this money has vanished into thin air.

1914. CONGRESS! ON AL RECORD-SEN ATE. 3025-I might go on at a great length quoting to you from this

opinion, bearing out the conclusion reached by Judge Prouty, and citing various other illustrations he has given of the financial operations of these people; but I do not believe, at this time, at least, I will go further into that matter.

Subsequently to that a great deal of publicity was given and some charges made publicly and given wide circulation in regard to some of the things that Judge Prouty says are unknown; for instance. the details of the l\Iilbrook Co. The New York World, in its issue of February 1, made some startling charges, in direct language, as to what had become of this money. I am not going to read all of those charges, nor go fully into the details, but I wish to read a few of them.

1\fr. KENYON. l\Ir. President, may I ask the Senator a question?

Mr. NORRIS. I yield to the Senator from Iowa. 1\fr. KENYON. I should like to inquire if these charges, made

openly, as the Senator suggests, have been dented by officials of the railroad company?

Mr. NORRIS. I have never heard of their being denied. It was charged in that issue of the World as follows: That the Milbrook Co.-

That is, this same company, with a capitalization of $1,000-lncot·porated under the laws of New York with a capital of $1,000 and debts apparently aggregating $15,000,000 on the day of its charter, made an agreement with the firm of J. P. Morgan & Co. to borrow unlimited snms on demand notes authorized by the board of directors of the New York, New Haven & Hartford Railroad Co. to complete the New York, Westchester & Boston electric line.

That is the railroad referred to by Judge Prouty. That the transactions between the Milbrook Co. and J. P. Morgan &

Co. were concEialed completely in " acconnt No. 2," kept in the offices of J. P. Morgan & Co. and not in the books of the Milbrook Co.

Further on it is said : That between October, 1906, and November, 1907, the firm o.f J. P.

Morgan & Co. advanced to the Milbrook Co. on demand notes, at 5 per cent, $11,155,000 of money belonging to the New York, New Haven & Hartford Railroad Co., for which J. P. Morgan & Co. acted as fiscal agents.

'.rhat deposited with J. P. Morgan & Co., in September, 1907, as collateral to secure the loans, amounting then to about $11,000,000, made on the demand notes, were securities with an actual value of only $200,200, according to a certificate handed to the accountant of the Milbrook Co. by J. P. Morgan, jr.

• • • • • • • That on the money loaned by J. P. Morgan & Co. to the Milbrook Co.

J. P. Morgan & Co. collected 5 per cent interest, although the money had been deposited with them by the New York, New Haven & Hartford Rai1L·oad Co.

That Thorne and Perry-The same firm mentioned by Judge Prouty-

as promoters, president, and treasurer of the Milbrook Co., had an agreement with .T. P. Morgan & Co. giving them (Thorne and Perry) H per cent of all of the New Haven money disbursed by them in promoting the affairs of the Milbrook Co., which controlled the New York, Westchester & Boston enterprise.

That this 7~ per cent was split between Thorne and Perry and W. H. Chesbrongh, a dummy director of the Millbrook Co., Thorne and Perry taking 47~ per cent each and Chesbrough 5 per cent.

• • • • • • • That J. P. Morgan & Co. would have apparently been compelled to

assume the losa of t:he $11,155,000 advanced to the Milbrook Co. on the Westchester deal if the New Haven, of which the late J. Pierpont Morgan was the dominant spirit, had not assumed it.

• • • • • • • That the only way that the firm of J. P. Morgan & Co. could get back

the • 11,155,000 which they had loaned on notes to the Milbrook Co. was by unloading that company on the New Haven.

That the Trust Co. of America, of which Thorne was president and Perry vice president, got $50,000 for buying the stock of the New York Railroad & Development Co. and some of the Westchester enterprise and $50,000 for acting as transfer agents of the New York, Westchester & Boston Railway Co.

The New York RailToad & Development Co. was another subsidiary corporation mixed Up in the building of this road. There were also several other corporations.

'.rhat the banking and promoting firm of Dick & Robinson, syndicate managers for the Westchester enterprise, marketed its securities, which were of uncertain value, receiving from $60 to $100 a share and secm·ing a commission of 2! per cent in cash and $1,500,000 in the stock of the Westchester Co.

That the promoters of the Westchester property bought and turned over to the Milbrook Co. bonds and stock which either had been sold at a nominal sum or given to politicians, promoters, and other persons who had apparently rendered no service nor paid anything for it.

That one C. H. Smith (identity obscure) got $2,100,000, one-half of which was in cash and one-half in stock, for assigning a contract to the City & County Contract Co. to construct the Westchester enterprise; which he had made three days before with the New York, Westchester & Boston.

That James P. McDonald got $375,000 for negotiating the same contract.

That the Mllbrook Co. paid $940,000 for $156,100 (face value) of stock of the New York & Port Chester Railway Co.

That the law firm of Stetson, Jennings & Russell (the Morgan firm) received $15,000 for drawing the incorporation papers of the $1,000 Milbrook Co.

That htmdreds of thousands of dollars were paid to lawyers for services of uncertain worth.

That the Knickerbocker Trust Co. certified to the custody of 45,000 shares of stock, par value $4,500,000, when in fact it only held 7,000 shares, the par value of which was but $700,000. -

That the firm of J. P. Morgan & Co., Messrs. Thorne & Perry, and the Knickerbocker Trust Co., in withholding the information from the authorized accountant of the Milbrook Co., tried to throw the responsibility for their evasion on Charles S. Mellen, then president of the New Haven, notwithstanding his protest against the acquisition of the Westchester project and the fact that he had voted against it.

• • • * • • • That, including the $11,155,000 loaned by J. P. Morgan & Co. to the

Milbrook Co., the New York, New Haven & Hartford, up to June 30, 1910, had dumped in excess of $21,020,074.74 of its stockholders' money into the Westchester enterprise.

That in the official validation report of the New Haven Railroad Co. the estimated actual value of the New Raven's actual investment in the Westchester enterprise, according to its own books, was figured at that time, June 30, 1910, at $12,066,921.18. ·

That, according to these figures, the difference between the cash paid through all agencies by the New Haven and the real value of the property received by it in return at that time was $8,953,172.50.

• • • $ • * • That of the $18,000,000 of the Westchester's 4~ per cent mortgage

bonds turned over to the New Haven, $17,200,000 were guaranteed hy that company and sold to J. P. Morgan & Co. for :P16,000,00Q-a discount of $1,200,000, which the New Haven still carries as an asset on its books.

That is the same charge made by Judge Prouty in the opinion to which I have made reference.

Mr. BORAH. l\fr. President--The VICE ·PRESIDENT. Does the Senator from Nebraska

yield to the Senator from Idaho? Mr. NORRIS. I yield. Mr. BORAH. I observe that this resolution provides for "a

further investigation of the financial transactions of said company, with a view of ascertaining," and so forth. As I underst.:'lnd, the Senator is now reading information which the Interstate Commerce Commission did not secure?

Mr. NORRIS. Some of this they did not secure. Mr. BORAH. Is the Senator informed as to why the Inter

state Commerce Commission stopped its investigation at a certaiu point?

Mr. NORRIS. I went over that matter somewhat before the Senator came in. I am not fully informed; I do not claim to be able to tell why they did.

Mr. NEWLANDS. Mr. President, it is impo,ssible to hear the debate.

Mr. NORRIS. In making r. general investigation of the railroad situation in New England, I had, I think before the Senator came in, read from the opinion in the case--

Mr. BORAH. I heard the reading from the opinion; but it occurred to me that if half of what is reported there is trueand for all I know, it may be all true-there are some 8 or 10 people at large who ought to be in the penitentiary.

Mr. NORRIS. Probably. Mr. BORAH. And it occurred to me that perhaps the Inter

state Commerce Commission stopped at a certain point for fear they might place these people in a position where they would be granted immunity,

Mr. NORRIS. I suggested that I thought that was one of the reasons, at the time they made their investigation, if they did that.

Mr. BORAH. If this resolution should go through, and the Interstate Commerce Commission should proceed with the investigation, might not that very thing hapren?

Mr. NORRIS. I do not think so, Mr. President. Mr. BORAH. I ask the question simply for information. Mr. NORRIS. Of course, circumstances might arise in the

investigation where that might be true. Personally, I believe that a great many of these transactions, some of which I am going to refer to in just a moment, would be shown without giving immunity to anybody who was any distance up the ladder in the New Haven concern. Some of them-in fact, most of them, I think-would be shown by an examination of the books. In that event, if anybody were given immunity it probably would be the bookkeeper; and as far as I am concerned I should not have any objection to giving him immunity.

Mr. CUMMINS. Mr. President--The VICE PRESIDENT. Does the Senator from Nebraska

yield to the Senator from Iowa? Mr. NORRIS. I yield. Mr. CUMMINS. It is not unlikely that the commission went

as far as it had authority to go under the law. The juriscliction of the commission is measured by the law, and it may not have been able to reach circumstances that were simply evi· deuce of a crime under a State law. I think, too, that a great deal of the testimony that was developed in that hearing is not included in the report.

Mr. NORRIS. I understand that is true, too. It may be that they have a great deal of this information in their possession now. I should not be surprised if that were true. If it is

3026 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD- - SENATR FEBRUARY 6,

true, of course it could be ~eported without fu:rtb.er · investigation.

Mr. CUMMINS. I myself do -not ·belie-v-e the Int-erstate Commerce Commission .has any tautharity to investigate the •question whether the directors of the N-ew Haven roud defrauded the stockholders of that road unless the iiiV'estigation is allied in some way with the ascertainment ·of what would be a proper rate ·for freight as a proper charge for passenEer service. We have been now for · years fully acquainted, in a general way, with the en.OTmlty of the capitalization not only of this camprury but of a dozen or more in the United States, because I venture to sa:y this -wretched history .finds a parallel in the capitalization -of a -dozen ·uf the great rail11oad-s of the United .States, and yet we have done nothing to make it a crime on the part of the railway :managers of the --country to do the very :things that the Senator !from Nebrru;ka is now -puinting <lUt. We Jlave

' declined from time to time to confer upon the Interstate Commerce ·Commission authority to -supervise the capitalization of the common-carrier comparues of this country.

Mr . .NORRIS. Ir. President, one of the objects I wish to attain by this investigation is the enactment of whatever "legislation may be neces ary to ma:ke impossible 'in the future what it is practically admitted has happened .in the New Haven case. I believe, as the Senator has said, we ought to have legislated along .this line "in the -past. If by giving pUblicity to these allegations, in case they should be demonstrated to b-e :b:ue, we .can bring about proper legislation to protect the connt::.cy .from a repetition of these tllings in the futm·e, we shall ·have aeeompJished, it seems to me, a great deal-much more than the IJUnishment of guilty J)ersoos in one paTticulaT 1nstance.

.Mt. CUMM[NS. We shall have accom_pUsbed -everytb.ing it we can stir the people and Oongress into action in that respect ; but while possibly w-e nave not all the 'information -th:lt exists, we haV-e enough to excite the interest of the people, a.nd it is information tthat might to -excite the action of Con-gress. So far as I am concerned, I would a great deal rather that -we should busy ourselves trying to enact a proper law .than wait u-pon -the .action of the rnterstate Oommeree Commission in any further investigation.

Mr . . eORRTS. Mr. President, we shall not 1Jusy ourselves and get the right klnd of legislation until .the countr;v- fully .understands the possibilities of wru~"1:loing nnder the laws .as they exist now, if there -are such possibilities; and tb..a.t ls one of the things I wish to determine.

Mr. LODGE. M.r. Presifumt--. The VICE PllESIDEl~ Does the Senator !rom Nebmska yield to the Senator from .Massachnsetts?

1\Ir. NORRIS. I y'ield. Mr. LODGE. I understood .the .Senator to say that :a gr.eat

dea1 -of testimony hns been taken by ·the .Interstate Commerce Commission on these -ver: points which has not been made public.

Mr. NORRIS. I .have been told so. Mr. LODGE. So ha-ve T. I understand that is tile ease.

Does the Senator know why that was not printed with the Test? !{I'. NORRIS. I do not. Mr. BORAH. Mr. P:resident, it .seems to me that there .might

be a very good reason why it had not been mn.de public, ·ana it seems to me there might be n veriV good reason ·why the Interstate Commerce Commission .has not ,gone further. If there is a desu·e upon the ,Part of the Department of Justice .to punish those people who have heen engaged in lthis transaction th~ere is good reason why they should ·stop whe1·e they ha-.e stopped.

I do uot subscribe to the aocb.we of .fo~i:vin.g all these transactions. A great many of them ha:v-e undoubtedly occmTed QY i·eason of the 'ignorance of .the law in a certain sense, not knowing just now far they co.uld go .and where they conld stop; but Sl:ch a transaction as this, if it be tr.ue. w.a.s a w.illful transacti on-a knowing transaction-a crime -committed 'With malice aforethought, and there is no .r:easan in the wo.rld why those n::en, if the facts be true, should .not be punished; n.nu I assl:liDe tl.Jat the Department of Justice in its own }Jroper time will undoubtedly proceed to punish them.

Mr. LODGE. If the Senator from Nebraska will alllow me, I agree entirely with that view. The reason why 1 -asked the question was to .know whether it would not be wiser for us to be sure about this thing before we force the hand of the Interstate Commerce Commission and possibly the Department of Justice. We may by .resolution, unless we know what they a1·e doing, compel them to disclose their case, ·whlc.h they UJ."e intending to prosecute. I know nothing about tit. I do not know thn t that is the reason_

Mr. NORRIS. Ordinarily .I think -:it would be a fair ;proposlticm to state that from the da:ily ,press we gather tb.e idea

that this road made an armngement with the Department o:tl Justice by which its slate was to be 'Wiped clean, the past forgiven, with the promise that if they w-ould sin no more they should be allowed -t.o proceea.

I wish to say in this connection fl:rat u.s far as I know the present management of the .r011d is J)erfectly honest, perfectly honorable, and perfectly competent. I would not throw a straw in -the way of interfe.Iling 'With that .road developing and ;reaching .ag.aiD the position in commerce that it had attained before it WRS robbed. But that does not, in ·my (judgment, -offer any reason whatever wby we :should not -punish those who have committed iWrongs in the _pu-st, and why we :sh:ould not amow all the facts in connection witll the ,mn:tter, so that we may have the benefit of those facts in pa.ssing the pl.'oper legislaltion to prevent the recurrence of such things in the future.

l\fr. LODGE. If the Senator will permit me, the pre ent management of the road, I thi.nk, Js just what the Senator bas described. I do llOt mean by .that Ito cast the slightest :reflection upon the persons who have gone out, but certainly there is -no man of higher character or m@re honest rmrpose, .I believe, in the country than Mr. Ellioii:. Of cou.rse we do not w.ant to throw any obstacle in the way of his trying to put the .l'oad in a ,Proper condition. I am sure none of us desire that, But if these charges, which I do ·not attempt to J)rejudge, are true, ~Y show ·that th-e sto-c.l.tho1ders of the company were robbed; if they a:re .not true, their falsity should be demonstrated. That is the iilain .English of ·it.

.Mr. NOJlRH3. I !believe that 'is gene.raJly conceded. 1\fr. LODGE. The only thing abont the resolution which dif

ferentiates it 'from most resolutions is that it is 'all attempt at least :to -pretect the •rights of the stockholder-s. Usually aU the suffering that has been brought bas fallen upon innocent stockholders of the road. The suffering and injury done to hundreds of innocent people, people "rith yery .smaTI means, in New Englund b.Y the hreakdown of the New Yo.rk, New Haven & Ha_.rtford and the 'Boston & ·Maine have been ym:·y gt·eat U tfuese thiiJ.gs ca:n. bf> ·p.rovea wnd something be done, -as the ·reso1ntion suggests, to recover the money of those people taken in this way, it -ought to be done. It se.ems to me that is ·the wo.rk, as the Senator from Idaho suggested, of the Department ·of Justice, and we o-ugltt to ·be -very careful not to interfere wifh anything the Department of Justice is doing at cthis time.

1\lr. NORRIS. I think, if we can nely any u_pon the undisputed l.>eiJor:ts that have been given in the public _press, the Depn.rtment uf :Justice is not attempting to do anything of .that Jrtnd.

Mr. CUUl\HNS. l\fr. President--1\Ir. NORRIS. I will yield in just a moment. 1 want to reply

a little fw:ther tG what the Senator .from Massachusetts said. .A:s .I ·stated awJiile ago, and .!I want -to repeat it, as far -as

my knowledge goes the present management of the .New Haven road is above criticism. at 1east I know nothing ·against it. I am '::lcquainted with Mr. Elliott. I have talked with him -about this proposition. If I were going to :make a criticism of the present management It would be this-and in substance I have said the same thing to llim-while we onght not to do anything to disconr~e the p.resent management from building 'Up that road a.nd putting it on its feet ngain, a road that at one time was as good as perhaps any road in tne entire civilized world, yet it seems to me that that.manngement, if it is subject t-o any criticism, it lis that lt ou:gbt to be willing to give its assistance to an investigation of what oceurred .in the past, in -order that the 40,000 widows and orphans :who hold ,stock in tlle :campan.y may .be lleeomnensed for !the "lOEses that they have sustained. It seems to me, as 'I told MT. Elliott, thai: it -wouJd give to the present .management the confidence of the entire country if they would ·say, "!Uncover this matter and 1et the truth be known."

The 'O"bjection to it that has been urged to me .here is .that it we give publicity to these facts the road might be damaged and perhaps go ln the 'hands of u :receiver; that we W:ill 1njure its pr,esent linancial conditi<m by giving publicity to the :robberies that :have .occurred 1n the -past. But to ·my mind that :i:s not a good objection. It is as if a Ill!lll should rob you while you are asleep .and take three-fourths of y.om· property., and with hh; ill-gotten .gains still rn his possession say to -yon, "Now, keep quiet; if you will kee_p quiet, J will not tllke the other fourth that 1: _permitted iVOU to keep; you lla CI. better ke~p still and hold whnt I have decided to let you lree1) and 'See if you can not build up -another fortune."

It strikes me there tis another reason why this honld be done, outside of the cousidera tion of the interest of the stockholders. I am just ·as much interested .in _pnotecting them as any man can _possibl_y -be. &-en though we w01lld concede n w that we \\rill wipe the slate clean and sny -nothing of wbat has occnrred in the past, because ;we believe iil.OW y.on ..have r.eoJ.:ganizad :nna. you are honest-if we should say that ll wo-uld ·be an 1.nTJ.ta-

'

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. 3027 tion in the future for any man who was capable of practicing ~harp financial transactions through dummy corporations, through dummy directors, to rob any other railroad in the same way, and then come here and say, "While we have robbed you, we are going to be good in the future, and if yon will let us keep what we have stolen you can take what is left and try to keep yourself out of the poorho~e."

Mr. BORAH. Mr. President-· -Mr. NORRIS. I yield to the Senator from Idaho. Mr. BORAH. I want to say only a word further, that I may

not be misunderstood by the Senator from Nebraska. The ultimate object the Senator desires to attain is one which I would cordially approve. The only desire I had in rising was to call his attention to what, it seems to me, might probably happen, unless the Senator is better informed, as he no doubt is, as to the program that is intended.

Mr. NORRIS. No; I am not informed. ~Ir. BORAH. I notice the Attorney General stated in print,

when the agreement with Mr. Elliott was made, that it did not include or cover any immunity for past offenses, criminal offenses, and so forth. That was printed in connection with the statement, and it followed the other statement in regard to it. Now, I can not conceive that the Attorney General would for a moment compromise those crimes.

1\Ir. NORRIS. I have not said he would. I am not making' any charge.

1\fr. BORAH. No; but he not only has said affirmatively he did not; but if he had not said that, it would be impeachable, in my judgment, to let such offenses go, if the information is in his possession.

The only thing I desire to call the attention of the Senator to is that by publicity we may frustrate the plan of the Attorney General in punishing these :;;>arties. I am Q..ne of those who believe that if these things be true, five or six of those men be!J.ind the bars in stripes would have the most tremendous moral effect on this country of anything we can conceive of. I do not believe that any legislation which we could pass would be so effective in this country as for the Government to show that because a man stands in a place pf power financially he stands in no different position before the courts and the criminal laws of this country.

The defect in the administration of the laws which are upon the statute books arises not out of the fact that the laws are defective, but because we have not had the courage to enforce them. An enforcement of that kind, if it can be had or is to be had, while the other legislation s:J;lould undoubtedly go on, will have a more tremendous effect on this country than any legislation which we can enact.

l\Ir. CUMMINS. Mr. President--Mr. NORRIS. I will yield to the Senator from Iowa in just

a moment. In response to what has been said by the Senator from ldaho

[Mr. BoRAH], I wish to say that I have no desire to give immunity to any man who has been guilty, if it be proven that he is guilty, of the charges that are alleged in this case. I do not believe that it is necessary in making this investigation to give immunity to anybody. But we do know that whenever these things occur the cry always goes up, "Do not investigate, for fear that you will give immunity." These things, as the Senator from Iowa [l\Ir. CuMMINS] said a while ago, have been done in a great many other cases. I do not remember about that, but it does not seem to me they were as flagrant as this is; and we have not found anybody behind the bars yet, immunity or no immunity.

It strikes me that an examination of the books, an examination of the clerks and the bookkeepers of this institution, will show what the facts are, and that will give sufficient information for a civil suit, for instance, to be brought by the present management of that road against the parties guilty of the robbery, if they are guilty, to recover for the benefit of those stockholders the money that has been unlawfully taken away from them. At the same time it would give us information upon which to legislate. It would give the Attorney General information upon which to prosecute.

I yield to the Senator from Iowa. . Mr. CUl\11\HNS. The difficulty about the situation is, as I

understand it, that there exists no Federal law which, being enforced, will put these gentlemen behind the bars of a jail or a penitentiary.

1\Ir. NORRIS. If that be true, Mr. President, then the question of immunity is eliminated.

Mr. BORAH. I do not exactly agree with the Senator as to these acts not being punishable under Federal laws, but certainly if facts quoted from the World be true they are punishable under State laws.

Mr. CUMMINS. Undoubtedly, Mr. President; and the Attorney General of the United States could give to these men or any other men connected with the New York, New Haven & Hartford Railroad immunity as against prosecution under the laws of New York or Massachusetts or Connecticut or any other State in which the crimes may have been committed. The solution of the whole problem, as I look at it, is to pass a Federal law that will make it criminal to do the things which are stated in the report of Commissioner Prouty. We will not be able to make those things criminal until we assume jurisdiction of the capitalization of the interstate common carriers of the country.

l\Ir. McCUMBER. Mr. President--The VICE PRESIDENT. Does the Senator from Nebraska

yield to the Senator from North Dakota? Mr. NORRIS. I yield; but I hope the Senator will not take

up too much time. Mr. McCUMBER. With the Senator's permission, may I

ask the Senator from Iowa a question? The Senator from Iowa is a member of the Committee on Interstate Commerce, and before that committee, for three or four years or longer, there have been bills providing for just exactly what the Senator speaks of, to bring all the great lines of railway doing interstate business under complete Government control by compelling them either to reincorporate or become licensed under the General Government, and providing specifically for preventive measures, so that it would be impossible to commit the crimes that are charged here against this railway. Yet we have never had any action before that committee. Possibly the bills are not correct, possibly they need modification, or something of that kind; but I want to ask the Senator from Iowa why we get no action on them; why no report of any kind has been made upon any of those bills that are sought to bring these railways under the control of Congress?

Mr. CUMMINS. Mr. President--Mr. NORRIS. I hope the Senator will not discuss the de

tails of some proposed law on this resolution. Mr. CUl\IMINS. The Senator from North Dakota inquired

of some member of the committee--Mr. NORRIS. I do not want to yield for that purpose. Mr. CUMMINS. The Senator from Nebraska will allow me

to say that when we had under consideration the amendment to the interstate-commerce law in 1010 there were some men on this side of the Chamber who tried very hard to incorporate in that amendment suitable provisions relating to this subject. I will not harrow up the feelings of any of the Members of the Senate who may still linger here who were here then, but the Senator from North Dakota will have no difficulty in refreshing his own recollection and assigning the responsibility of the failure to incorporate such provisions in our law upon the persons who ought to bear that responsibility. I say that I have been trying to do it ever since I came into the Senate.

Mr. NEWLANDS. Mr. President--Mr. CUMMINS. I think that is the trouble with the Depart

ment of Justice. Although I have had no communication with that office at all, I fear that it has been unable to find in any law of the United States an instrument for the punishment of the wrongdoing that has been disclosed in the investigation carried on with regard to the New York, New Haven & Hartford Railroad.

The VICE PRESIDENT. Does the Senator from Nebraska yield to the Senator from Nevada?

Mr. NORRIS. I prefer not to yield for that discussion. I ask other Senators not to inject it here. I do not care to discuss, on this resolution, the details of the law that we ought to pass. I prefer that the Senator will not interrupt me with a view of bringing on that discussion. He knows it would mean endless delay.

Mr. President, only a word in reply to what the two Senators have said. Some of us in the House, where I was at the time the bill referred to was passed, tried to put into the law that kind of a provision. We failed; and if this resolution, ' through the discussion that it brings forth, will fail to do anything else except to bring about the enactment of that kind of a law, I believe I will have been amply repaid and justified for the introduction of the resolution.

Mr. President, when I was interrupfed I was attempting to read an editorial from the New York World-a direct charge-one that Senators wi1l observe is an actionable statement if it is not true, published in their editorial column. I will only read a part of the editorial :

Needless to say this money did' not vanish " into tliin air." It vanished into the coffers of J. P. Morgan & Co. It was taken out of the treasury of the New Haven by Mr. Morgan and his associates to recompense J. P. Morgan & Co. for loans they had made practically without security to a dummy corporation organized to conceal various

3028 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SEN ATE .. FEBRUARY 6,

financial manipulations in connection wtth the construction of the Westchest er road. Even the exposure of life insurance corruption revealed no more cold-blooded piece of Wall Street piracy than the transaction 'vhose scaly history is printed elsewhere in to-day's issue ot the World.

Mr. President, there is something else, in connection with some other investigations, that has a direct bearing on this matter, to which I desire to call the attention of the Senate. I understand some investigation has been made in regard to these matters in Boston or elsewhere in Massachusetts by the proper officials there, and that it was there shown that one Henry D. Knowles, of Gloucester, a former representative, testified that he received from the railroad company-that is this railroad company-payment for interviews and for train service investigations while a member of the legislative committee in the· summer of 1912 investigating transportation problems in the western part of the State.

Howard L. Ralph, a local manager for the American Press Association, said that articles on the New Haven road furnished by the railroad's publicity department were sent on stereotyped plates to 315 papers in New Eri.gland by his company without expense to the papers. The-railroad company paid the Americnn P1·ess Association a certain fixed rate per line for handling the matter.

It might be well, in that connection, to observe that there is a provision in the Post Office appropriation bill of August 24, 1912, which reads as follows :

That all editorial or- other reading matter published in any such newspaper, magru~lne, or periodical for the publication of which money or other valuable consideration is paid. accepted, or promised shall be plainly marked " advertisement." Any editor or publisher printing editol'ia.l or other reading matter !or which compensation is paid, accepted, or promised without so marking the same, shall upon convictioo in any court having jurisdiction, be fined not less than $50 nor more than $500.

That is the United States statute. I have only read one illustration, but there are a great many others. In this investigation it developed, Mr. President, that there was a professor of law, I believe in Harvard University, who during these years, or at least during a part of them, was getting a salary from this company, I believe at the rate of $10,000 a year, as a kind of advisory attorney. The public knew nothing about it. He delivered lectures; he carried· on his work in the university, and I was told this morning by a Member of the House of Representatives that this university professor~ before it was disclosed by the investigation that be was a salaried official of this road,. had on three different occasions come to Washington, had gone to the office of a member of one of the leading standing committees of the House of Representatives, and that he had on those three different occasions labored witb the Representative at length to convince him that there ought to be nothing done in regard to the New Haven Railroad transactions, and that he was so insistent in coming to that Representative's office about the matter that the Representative told him he could not spend any more time with him; that it was useless to try to persuade him to believe along the lines the professor was evidently trying to mark out. These things show what became of some of the funds of the New Haven road, and I have only given you a few as illustrations.

Ur. President, I understand that this investigation in Massachusetts showed that there was one item curried on the books of this company known as " Other expenses." The public knew nothing about it, and an ordinary examination would not develop what "Other expenses" meant; but that investigation bas shown that these " Other expenses " covered a multitude of transactions that were at least of such a nature that they required explanation. For instance, here are some of them under that head: 10 luncheons---------------------- ------------------ ----- $61. 40 10 luncheons------------------------------ ------------ --- 60.80 10 luncheons--------------------------------------- 61. 60

The price going up. That was after the passage of the tariff bill, I suppose. [Laughter.] 10 luncheons---------------------------------------- $117. 80

I suppose that was after the passage of the currency bilL [Laughter.] 19 dinners---------------------------------------- $239. 30 18 luncheons----------------------------------------- 110.80 Brenkfasts ______________ '!..._____________________________ 38. 95

News stand --------------------------------------------- 1. 60 Mr. CUi\IMINS. Where were those meals eaten? I am curi

ous to know. 1\Ir. NORRIS. I do not know; and if I did, I would not tell

the Senators here, for fear there might be an exodus of Senators for the purpose of getting some of those expensive meals; and we would not have a quorum left.

Mr. President, as I said a while ago, I have no disposition, I bave no object, I have no desire to dO' anything here that will

injure anyone who is honest and who is trying to do what is right and what is lawful; but it does seem to me that the question relative to this railroad is one of national importance, deal .. ing in subjects upon which we ought to legislate, and do legislate-a railroad whose stock a few years ago, I understand, sold above 250, and it is now down to less than 70 cents on the dollar. I have been told that 40,000 stockholders of this road are widows and estates belonging to orphans and fatherless children in New; England.

Mr. LIPPITT. Is not the Senator from Nebraska a little in error about the number· of the stockholders?

Mr. NORRIS. I may be, but I have so heard. Mr. LIPPITT. My recollection is-it is not important-that

the number is 22,000. Ur. NORRIS. Twenty-two thousand. It is only a question

of degree, Mr. President; and they ought to be protected if we can protect them.

This resolution has been criticized because I recite therein that one object to be attained is-

Whether the person or persons authorizing such investment of the funds of said company and the person or persons receiving the benefit thereof are liable to punishment under existing laws.

It is said that that is asking the Interstate Commerce Commission to advise us, and that that is not its proper function. 1

I will admit that is not the proper function of the Interstate Commerce Commission, and if that were the construction, and 1

the only construction that could be put upon it, I would admit that the resolution was erroneous and wrong in that respect; but my intention in drafting the resolution was to give the Interstate Commerce Commission an idea of why the Senate wanted the investigation. If you employed some one to investigate a subject for you, and you would tell him in advance what you wanted to know, and especially if he were a Tawyer, as are the members of the Interstate Commerce Commission, it would assist him a great deal in carrying out that investigation. I bad no thought that the Interstate Commerce Commission was going to advise the Senate in direct terms as to whether these people were liable to punishment; but if they knew why we wanted the information, I thought it certainly would assist them in the character and the nature of the investigation which they would . make.

The third clause ot the resolution reads as follows: Third. Whether under existing Jaw such funds so Invested can be

r ecove1·ed on l:lehalf of the stockholders of said company.

That has been criticized for the same reason, tha.t we ought not to ask the Interstate Commerce Commission to tell us that; but, if you will read the resolution, you will find that it does not ask the commission to tell us thn.t, but it directs them to reopen this investigation, to go further into this matter with a view of ascertaining the facts. The reason this language was put into the resolution, or at least that was my idea, was to give the commission to understand that we wanted to know, if it were possible to ascertain, whether under existing law this money could be recovered, so that whoever would be entitled to get the benefit of the :facts developed would be enabled to use them in an action to recover.

Mr. NEWLANDS. Mr. President, when this resolution cnme up for consideration the other day I asked that it lie over until to-day, with a view to consulting the Interstate Commerce Committee of the Senate as to whether they desired to insist on a motion for the reference of the resolution to the committee. I consulted the committee this morning, and I find no disposition upon the part of the committee to urge a reference to it of this resolution, and therefore the matter comes up for consideration by the Senate.

I will further state that, immediately after this matter was brought to my attention, I addressed a telephonic communication to the chairman of the Interstate Commerce Commission, asking him to transmit to me any information in the possession of the commission that would enable the Senate to act intelligently upon the· resolution, particularly with reference to the status of the investigation, and as to whether any further in\estigation would be desirable or practicable. I will ask the Secretary to read the communication which I have received from the chairman of the Interstate Commerce Commission.

The VICE PRESIDEl\TT~ In the absence M objection, the Secretary will read as requested.

The Secretary read as follows:

Hon. F. G. NEWLL"''DS1

L~TERS'l'A.TE COM l\JE:RCE COM'MISSION, Washington, Februarv 6~ 1911,.

United Btates Bru1atc, Washington... MY DEAll SID<ATOn.: Responsive to your snggestion in our phone con

versation the other day, I took up with Mr. Prouty questions presented in Senate resolution No. 260 (introduced by Senator NORRIS).

1914 ... C0NGRESSIONAL RECORD-SEN ATE~ 3029 I thought, as I presume you th-ought, that: possibly, having personally

had charge of our investigation of the New Haven a~a,irs and having prepared the report of the commission, he would have a more intimate knowledge and fresher recollection as to the situation than I had.

I atta~h copy of my informal memorandum to :Ur. Prouty and his memorandum to me in reply. The- views exgressed by Mr. Prouty are in accord with my understanding and recollection of the situation.

The time since you spoke to me about this bas been so shol't and other matters have so imperatively pressed for attention that it has not been po::.sible to get this in more formal shape for you and get it to you as requested to-day. I trust, therefore, that any appearance of inforl!l!lilty will be excused.

Yours, truly, E. E. CLAllK, Chairman.

[Memorandum of Mr. Prouty.] FEBll.U.A.RY 5, 1914.

I attach copy of Senate resolution 2.60, proposing that the commission be instructed to reopen the examinatio.n of tho affairn of the New Haven 1oad.

Tlle chairman_ of the Senate committee called this to my attention, and wanted to know irr general what our impression is as to the advisability of this proceeding, and he asked me to talk with you about it and let him know some time to-day, as they expected to bring th-e matter up on Friday. •

It. has oceurrcd to me that perhaps in the investigation of which you had charge we accumulated. a good deal of information that was nut detailed in the report.

It is a little difficult to estimate just how far back they want this investigation to go. 1 should like- to have your general view of how much of an nndm1:aking it would be and whether or not we- would p1·ouably develop anything of interest.

I should like. also, your view as tQ par.agraphs 2. and 3 of the resoiution, w11icb seem to me to ask us for information that ought to be sought at the hands of the Attorney General. Thanking you for your early attention to this matter, I am,

Yours, truly, --- ---, Ohai1-man.

[Memorandum to the cho:.irman.] FEBRUARY 5.

Replying to your memor:m.dum of February 5, in reference to Norrisresolution, the investigation of "the commission covered only the period during which Mr. Mellen had been president of the compnny-that is, a11pro:rlmately 10 years-but I am very sure- that there is nothing in tlle New Haven management. before that time which would justify an examination.

Our accountants brought away a great mass of figures, which were not incor-porated into our report nor even alluded to. My impression is tlw.t we M\'e everything in our files which a further exrunination ct:luld disclose It would be: possible to make up from these figures a detailed statement showing the persons to whom this money has been paid, but thnt; in my opinion,. would have but little interest for the public and be of no profit.

In our investigation wo traced these transactions as far as could be done from an examination of the books of the New Haven Co. In. all cases we run up against some corporation which was not · subject to tbc iorisdiction of the commission and at whose books we had no aut hori'ty to look. No attempt was made to e:xamine the books of these v:ulous construction companies, etc., for the reason that this was not getmane to the investigation under way. It is- possible that something further might be done in this· direction, although I somewhat don ut the authority of the commission to reach these companies.

T be same rema.rk n.ppllea to paragraphs 2. an.d 3 of the resolution. The. 11 arc lwth matters witl:rout the jurisdiction ot the commission. On t l:e whole. I do not believe anything would be accomplished by a_ furthc1· investigation on ou: Qart. The Senate itself, with its g1::eater authority in t.bes.e res.pects, could undoubtedly accomplish much more tbnn tbe commission.

Very truly, yours, PROUTY.

(Inclosure.) :Mr. KENYON. Mr. Pre.<:;ident--Tlle VICE PRESIDENT. Does the Senator from Nevada

yield to tho Senator from Iowa? l\1r. · KE:N'YON. I d() not ask the Senator to yield; I was

trving to get the floor in my own right. ·Mr. NEWLANDS. Mr. President, the question before the

Senate is, first, as to whether, in view of the letter of the chairman. of the Interstate Commerce Commission and the memorandum of Mr. Prouty, it desires further investigation by that commission; and, second, whether it wishes the legal advice of that commission as to whether the persons authorizing these in...\estments are liable to criminal prosecution; and, third, the legal opinion of the commission as to .whether the funds so invested can be recovered for the benent of the stockholders.

It is perfectly clear tha.t any investigation of the subject matter covered by this resolution would come within the jurisdiction of the Interstate Commerce Commission so :fur as it relates to the rates charged by this corporation. Under the law the Interstate Commerce Commission exercises the function of fixing rates, and in fixing those rates it must have regard to the valuation of the roads, their capitalization, and other factors declared in the decision of the Supreme Court.

Capitalization, therefore. becomes an essential fac~or in rate regulation. Excessive or fraudulent capitalization would, of course, receive the proper consideration of the commission in regulating rates.

The fourth provision also comes within the jurisdiction. of the Interstate Commerce Commission, for it asks the recommendatio~ of the commission regarding legislation that will preyent

similar transactions in the future~ 0ne ot the most important functions ot the Inter.state Commerce Commission under the Iaw creating it is to make recommendations to Congress; and it may be said with accuracy and truth that almost all the Jegis1atjon in the way of' reform that has been passed amendatory of the interstate-commerce ·act has been passed pursuant to the persistent l'ecommendation of that commission, which has had and now has the entire confidence of the country.

So far as·the legal opinion of the Interstate Commerce Com· mission is concerned regarding criminal prosecutions and the possibility of~ recoyering these funds for the benefit of the stockholders, it is very evident that that inquiry should be made of the Attorney General rather than of the Interstate Commerce Commission.

So far as.. the Interstate Commerce Commission is concerned, we hav-e the statement that it doe~ not think any further investigation by it will be fruitful of results. The Senate, therefore, is called upon to act upon the question whether it will insist upon furthe1· investigation by the Interstate Commerce Commission, when we know that the- Interstate Commerce Commission is already very heavily loaded. We know that it is burdened with work. We know that it has already made an investigation. We know that that investigation has been. a very full and complete one, as full and complete- as it ought to be made, according to the~ judgment of the commission; aud the question now is whether we shalT further press this mattel" upon the commission itself.

There is another question, also, with reference to the Attorney General's office-~

Mr. SIMMONS. 1\Ir. President--The VICE PRIDSIDEl'\f'I'. Does. the Senator from Nevada

yield to the Senator from North Carolina? Mr. NIDWLAl~DS. I do. 1\.fr. Sll\Il\IONS. For information, :r desire to ask the chairman

of' the Committee on Interstate Commerce a question in connec· tion with the- very point he is now making. It is a question which has been in my mind since the discussion of this amendment began.

r understand that the Interstate. Commerce Commissi·on is a body created by law; that its powers are prescribed and defined in the act or acts of its creation; and that it has no powers outside of those conferred upon it by the Congress of the United States. That is a correct statement, is it not?

Mr. NEWLA.NDS. I think it is. Mr. SIMMONS. I understand the Senator to say that the

seeond proposition here, requesting the commission to inquire and ascertain " whether the person or persons authorizing such im·estment of· the funds of said company and the person or pel'sons receiving the benefit thereof are liable to punishment unde1· existing laws," is not a matter coming within the power conferred by law upon. the Interstate Commerce Commission. I understand him also to say that the inquiry proposed in the third subsection.- to wit, uwhether under existing law such funds so invested can be recovered on behalf of the stockholders of said company:' is a matter not within the power of the cornmission under existing law. Do I correctly understand the Senator with referen.ce to those two propositions?

lli. NEWLANDS. I thi.nk that statement is correct. The Interstate Commerce Commission has full powers of investigation with reference to rates and with reference to any -violations of the interntate-commerce act. I do not recall-perhaps the Senator from Nebl'aska.. mn.y recall-that the interstate-commerce act contains any provision regarding the misappropria· tion or malinvestment of funds. It bas provisions relating to rebntes, preferences, and things of that kind; and, of course, it would be the duty of the Interstate Commerce Commission to inquire into any offense against the law in that particular and to turn over the facts ta the Attorney General's office with a view to prosecution if the facts justified a prosecution. I will state, turthe.r, that I think the same thing is true as to the reco\ery of: funds by a railroad. company on behalf of its stockholders. I know of no provision in. the interstate-commerce act regn.rding thaL My view is that if there is any national bw at all upon the subject of the misappropriation or malinvest· ment of funds, the. matter would go to the Attorney Generars office fur investigation.

Mr. NORRIS. Mr. President, will the Senator yield to me? 1\!r~ NEWL.A.c~DS. Certainly. Mr. NORRIS. I should like to say to the Senator from

Nevada, and particulal'ly to the Senator from North Carolina, who propounded the query, that I do not claim that the Interstate Commerce Commission have the power that he seems to think I thought they had by whnt I have said in the second and third provisions of the resolution. As I said while I was occupying the floor, the idea of putting that in was simply to

3030 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE: - - - FEBRUARY 6,

let the Interstate Commerce Commission know why the Senate wanted the information. I am not anticipating that if, when they investigated it, they came to a conclusion one way or the other as to those two propositions, they would have in answer to the resolution to tell the Senate what their conclusion was. It is simply giving them our idea as to why we want the information, so as to guide them in making the investigation.

Mr. SIMMONS. Mr. President, as I read the resolution, it requires the Interstate Commerce Commission to make · the investigation ~ith a view to ascertaining four different things; and the matters to which I have called the attention of the Senator from Nevada are two of the four things.

As I understand, the Interstate Commerce Commission is a body of limited powers. It can exercise no jurisdiction and no functions that are not conferred upon it by the law of the land. If the Interstate Commerce Commission is making an investigation for the purpose of enabling it to carry out any of the powers and duties and functions conferred upon it by law, it has authority of law to make that investigation, authority to send for persons and papers, and authority to spend the money of the United States for the purpose of making that im·estigation.

The question I wish to propound to the Senator from Net"ada is this : If we authorize the Interstate Commerce Commission to make an investigation which it has no authority under the law to make, and stop right there, has the commission any power or right or authority to spend the money of the 11eople. of the United States in making that extrajudicial investigation, and has it the power to send for persons and papers and to administer oaths? If we are going to confer upon the commission new power to make an investigation by virtue of a joint resolution, that is a different thing. If we are going to do that, we will have to do it in such a way that the authority becomes the ln w of the land, and is passed by both Houses of Congress and is signed by the President. If we shall l).ndertake to do it, and confer upon the commission the right or impose upon them the duty of making an investigation without authority of law, then, unless at the same time, in some way or other, we give them the money to make the investigation and confer upon them the power to summon witnesses and examine them under oath, they will not have that power.

I ask the Senator if that is not a correct statement of tile law, and if, under that statement of the law, it will not be impossible for the Interstate Commerce Commission to exercsie all the powers that are attempted to be conferred upon them under tllis resolution? As I understand, this is a resolution of the Senate. It is not a joint resolution, which would require the concurrence of the House and the signature _of the President. The question I have in my mind is whether, by a resolution of the Senate, we can confer upon the Inbrstate Commerce Commission the right to make an investigation which the law does not empower them to make, and whether, if we attempt to do that, they would have the power to spend the money of the people and to perform the other functions that are absolutely necessary in order to conduct these judicial investigations, to wit, summoning witnesses and administering oaths?

Mr. NEWLANDS. Replying to the Senator from North Carolina, I have to say that I have no doubt at all that the Interstate Commerce Commission can assume jurisdiction of the first and fourth clauses of this resolution, the first making an inquiry as to investment at fictitious values, which involves the question of capitalization-a subject that can be justly considered in the regulation of rates-and the fourth what legislation, if any, is necessary to prevent the recurrence of similar transactions. I have no doubt that the commission has jurisdiction over that subject, because it has the power of recommendation to Congress.

As to the intermediate sections, however, the second and third, which call for the opinion of the commission as to whether the person or persons authorizing these investments are liable to punishment under existing laws, and as to whether such funds can be recovered on behalf of the stockholders of the company, I submit that the matter belongs to the jurisdiction of the Attorney General's office, and that the query should be addressed to that office. Such a query would probably involve no expenditure by the Interstate Commerce Commission, for it simply asks for their legal opinion upon facts which they have ascertained in the course of their investigation; which investigation is entirely legal, as it relates entirely to fictitious investments and to excessive capitalization.

So, if the re olution is passed, it seems to me the first and the last clauses ought to be referred to the Interstate Commerce Commission, and the second and the third to the Attorney General's office.

Mr. President, the Senator has urged that this investigation should be pressed immediately, although both the Interstate Commerce Commission and the Attorney General's office are now crowded with work with reference to this and accompanying questions. I do not care to emphasize opposition upon that ground, but I wish to present the considerations so that the Senate may have them before it.

We know that the Interstate Commerce Commission is already engaged in a very important inquiry with reference to rato increases. In that inquiry, undoubtedly, the overcapitalization of the New York, New Haven & Hartford Railroad is a legitimate subject for investigation; but whether we should insist Upon further investigation and report, when the commission has already declared in the communication of 1\'Ir. Prouty that, in its judgment, no good can be accomplished, is a question that demands deliberation and consideration.

I understand, of course, the importance of pressing the criminal prosecution of the men who have been guilty of these malinvestments, assuming that they are fully established, but whether or not that is a matter of the first importance in the public interest remains to be considered. The Attorney General's office is now engaged in consultation with 1\Ir. Howard Elliott, the new president of the New York, New Haven & Hartford Railroad, with reference to bringing that corporation into harmony with the Sherman Act. That involves not only very serious questions of law, which must .be very engrossing, but also t"ery serious questions of finance; and the public itself is immensely interested in the financial reorganization of this road in harmony with the law, so that it can establish the credit necessary for it to carry out its rehabilitation.

In the judgment of many the present financial condition of this road is largely responsible for the numerous accidents upon it involving destruction of life and property. The whole transportation system of New Engla~d depends upon the proper reorganization and the proper running of this great system. It seems to me it might well be left to the discretion of the Attorney General-an official in whom we all ha...-e confidence-to determine whether he shall rush to the front first the practical question, in the interest of the public, of the immediate reorganization and rehabilitation of this road, or whether he shall be diverted from that needed work into a criminal prosecution.

Of course, if there is danger of the statute of limitations intervening, I can understand that it will be absolutely essential to press these prosecutions immediately. On that subject I am not informed. _

Mr. KENYON. .Mr. President-· -The VICE PRESIDENT. Does the Senator from Nevada

yield to the Senator from Iowa? 1\.Ir. nEWLANDS. Certainly. Mr. KENYON. The Senator has suggested the statute of lim·

itations. That has been running through my mind. I understand that the occurrences to which the Senator from Nebraska has referred took place in 1007 or 1908. Has the Senator from Nevada given any attention to the q-qestion whether the statute of limitations has run or whether this is in the nature of a continuing crime?

Mr. NEWLA~""DS. No; I have given no consideration to it, and I am not informed in regard to it. As I understand, there are no national laws upon the subject, so that the prosecution would have to be pushed under State laws, and that would be no part of the duty of the Attorney General.

Mr. KENYON. The Sherman antitrust law might possibly reach the officers.

Mr. NEWLA.l\TDS. 'I'he Sherman antitrust law might reach them; but so far as the matter of excessive capitalization is concerned, I imagine that if that is an offense at all under existing law it is an offense under State law.

Mr. NORRIS. That being true, there would not be any danger of any immunity from an- investigation under this resolution?

Mr. NEWLAl\TDS. No; there would be none whatever. Now, Mr. President--The VICE PRESIDENT. The morning hour having expired,

the Chair lays before the Senate the unfinished business, which will be stated ..

The SECRETARY. A bill (H. R. 7051) to pro-ride for cooperative agricultural extension work between the f.gricultural colleges in the several States receiving the benefits of an act of Congress ~pproYed July 2, 1862, and of acts supplementary thereto, and the United States Department of Agriculture.

1.\fr. NEWLANDS. Mr. President, so fttr as I am concerned, I think that this resolution ought to be divided into two parts, referring the first and fourth division to the Interstate Commerce Commission and the second and third to the Attorney

1914-r CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SE ATE. 3031 General. But the fact remains that there is no national law under which overcapitalization can be 1-~nished· We have been trying to pass such a ln.w for many years. The matter came up in 1910 under legislation proposed in Mr. Taft's administration. The clause provided for the control by the National Go-vernment of stoc± and bond issues.

1\!r. LODGE. Mr. President, I rise to a point of order. The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mr. HUGHES in the chair). The

Senator will state it. 1\.Ir. LODGE. Has the unfinished business been laid before

the Senate? The PRESIDING OFFICER. The unfinished business has

been laid before the Seru1.te. lli. LODGID. I understand that the Senator from Nevada is

discussing the resolution of inquiry. Ur. NEWL.A.NDS. I will state that the Senator from Georgia

[Mr. SMITH] told me that he would have no obj-ection to my concluding my remarks.

1\Ir. LODGE. If the resolution has gone over--M.r. SMITH of Georgia. The resolution has gone over. Mr. LODGEJ. That is all right. It is not going to be acted

upon to-day. I understand that the resolution went over without prejudice. Is not that the understanding of the Senator from Nevada?

Mr. NEWLANDS. Yes. Mr. LODGE. I am told at the desk that it has been sen.t to

the calendar. Some of us want to dispose of the resoluti(}n. Mr. NORRIS. I ask unanimous consent that the resolution

may go over without prejudice, without going to the calendar. Mr. LODGE. Certainly; that was the understanding. The PRESID.Il~G OFFICER. The Senator from Nebraska

asks unanimous consent that the resolution may go over without prejudice. Is there objection? The Chair hears none.

1\!r. NEWLANDS. I understand from the Senator from Georgia t.rurt .he is desirous of proceeding with the unfinished business, and I will defer further remarks until to-morrow.

COOPERATIVE .A.GIUCULTURAL EXTENSION WORK.

The Senate, as in Committee of the Whole, resumed the consideration of the bill (H. R. 7951) to provide for cooperative agricultural extension work lietween the agricultural colleges in the severnl States receiving the benefits of an act of Congress approved July 2, 1862, and of acts supplementary thereto, and the United States Department of Agriculture.

Mr. WORKS. Mr. President, some days ago I submitted some remarks upon the pending bill. I am not going to consume the furth-er time of the Senate. I took the position at that time that . this appropriation, if made, would not benefit the farmer to anything like the extent that is claimed for it, and that practically to a great extent it would be simply a waste of the public money. .

What the farmer needs, in my judgment, is not teaching that will enable him to grow largel' crops, but the ability to dispose of the crops he raises. B-earing 11pon that question I submit an article that is from Up-to-Date Farming, a journal published in Indianapolis, and I ask that it may be read by the Secretary.

The PRESIDING OFFICER. Witho11t objection, the Secretary will read as requested.

The Secretary read as follows : [From Up-to-Date Farming, Indianapolis, Feb. 1, 1914.]

IlEAL CONDITIONS AND ACTUAL NEEDS--THE FACTS HAVE BEEN FORCED TO THE TOP.

What we are going to print below is nothing new to readers ot Up-toDate Farming. For many years we have told the public that increased production, however desirable, is no remedy for the "high cost of living " ; nor does the prosperity of the farmers or of the country depend upon that. Our argument was that the farmers already produced a surplus, and the greater the surplus the less it was worth to those whose labor produced 1t, and that It added nothing to the supply for those who needed tt. This argument see!ru!d so di.lferent from what the world had previously understood that it was ignored in official li!e, and the schools and the press continued to teach and urge greater production as the one thing for the farmers to learn and to do. ·Former Secretary Wilson's figures, in spite of the hands through whleh they passed, showed different, but the idea was so startling and so apparently absurd that the facts were ignored. and agricultural " extension" trains gave forth their supposedly awakening sounds throughout the country, and scheme after scheme. backed by millions of money, was inaugurated to Induce heavier yields.

No remedy came. The farmers worked, crops grew, surpluses were marketed, an.d valuable products went to waste or were destroyed. Over the wasting piles of what the farmers could not sell they had to accept meager prices for what was taken. and the consumers we:re compelled to pay exorbitant prices for what they used. We kept up -our fight. The people read and wondered and by and by believed. But not so the press and the schools ; and not so the politicians who were se~ plnce and power. They feared the ruling forces, and dared not condemn what seemed to be popular 1n high places nor to admit facts that powerful Influences did not desire should be made known.

But ours is a Government of the people, and truths that alrect all can not always be hidden. If persistently, fnithfttlly, ·and honestly brought out, they will be seen. The light will shine 1n spite of the · clouds that may for a time roll between us and the sun. Our words have caught the public ear, have engaged the public thought, and hav~

made their way to Washington. .As .a villdication, we are glad to quote from Secretary Houston. Om· readers must realize that it is very similar to quoting edito-rials that appeared in this paper years. ago, and that makes us all the more rea dy to quote them now. In his recent report Secretary Houston said:

" However desirable increased production on farms may appear to be from the consumer's standpOint, it does not follow that such increased production would result in any increa e in the en h income per farm or per capita of farm population, or that prices paid by consumers would be any lower.

" Had the total production :in 1!U3 equaled or exceeded the i912 production. it seems probable that the cash income per farm would not have been greater and might have been less than in 1912, but it is extremely doubtful whether the cost to the consumer would have be~n any less, because retail prices are promptly . raised on a ~rospect ot undro;production, but are very slow to decline if there lS overproduction.

"The long line of distributors and middlemen between the farmer and the consumer are in a position to t:a.ke advantage of the market and to a certain ~x:tent control the market in bo-th directions, because they are better organized to keep informed of crop and market conditions and to act promptly than either fnrmers or consumers, who a:re not organized and as individuals are helpless.

" The high prices paid by consumers, ranging from 5 to nearly 50 per cent in some cases more than the farmer receives, indicate that there is plenty of room for lowering the cost of farm products to consumers and at the same time largely increasing the cash incom~ per farm without increasing farm production.

" This condition is undoubtedly a. marketing problem which will have to be solved by better organization of farmers and improved methods of marketing.

" When as the result of such organization and improved methodst the price of farm products can be maintained at a. hlgher level witnout increasing the cost to consumers, farmers will be 3ustified. in iner~asing the O'lltput of their farms with a fair prospect of rea.lizing reasonable profit on their il:Lvestment of time, labor, and money, which in the agw;egate is enormous."

' The report brings out," says a lefl:ding city dally paper1 " that while this (last) J'ea.r'S crop was smaller than that of 1912 its cash value broke all records with a total of nearly $10,000,000,000.

"However" continues the daily, "Leon M. Estabrook, Chief of the Bureau of Statistics of the o~f&artment of Agriculture and cha!rman of the department's crop-rep · g boaro, says the greater part of the huge sum b.as gone into the pockets of the middlemen. who stand between the farmer and the consumer and levy tribute from both.

" Conditions as shown m the official crop review are astounding," declares the astonished public press. " Droughts and other factors reducing production bring farmers a greater cash return. thus putting a premium on a short supply. This fosters a rising market for the middlemen."

Farmers, will you believe it now? Will you heed what Secretary Houston at the head of the farm department of the Government, says? "This condition ll! undoubtedly a marketing problem which will have to be solved by better organization of iarmers and improved methods of mar keti.ng.''

Lawmakers, will you heed the warning? Whom serve ye, the managers of the market, the speeulators in farm pyodncts, because of the power they are supposed to have at the polls, or the people who really cast the ballots?

Mr. GRONN.A.. Mr. President, I am very glad to know that the Senator from California [Mr. WoBxs] has presented this matter to the Senate for the information not ®ly of the Senate, but for the information of the people of this great country. It practically coincides with what I have formerly said on this fl.oar-that the success of. the farmer depends not only upon the amount that he produces, but it depends upon his :income; it qepends upon whether he receives such a price for his product as to make the industry of farming a profitable one. •

There is no other business that I know of, nor is there any other industry in which people are engaged, where those whe are engaged in the industry must depend upon other people's judgment as charity, if I might say so, to place upon those products a certain price. The farmer has nothing to say about fixing the price of his product. The -price is always fixed by men who are not engaged in the industry, but who are engaged in handling the product after it leaves the farm.

Overproduction in grain, in cattle, in cotton, or in any product produced on the farm means a lower price ()f that product. I do not mean by that that we should discourage the farmer from taking an active interest in scientific agriculture and in being able to produce more bushels to a given area, but, as I have so often said on this floor and elsewhere, until we make it possible for the farmer to get a price for his product that will give hlm at least a small profit we are not going to make farming a success and we are not going to get people to go back to the farm_

When the representatives of railroads of this country come before CongreSs or before the Interstate Oommerce Oommisston making complaint that they are not making a profit in the1r industry, out of a sense of justice we increase their rates. When the manufacturer engaged in the industry of manufac:. turing shows that his business is unprofitable he is generally; protected or he is given the opportunity of making a profit on the goods he manufactures. It is not so with the f:irnler. The farmer has to take the price that is placed upon his product by some one engaged in hanallng his products after they leave the farm. ·

Mr. President, I believe that if we could expend the same amount of moneY. to teach the farmer how to market his crops1

3032 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SEN ATE. FEBRUARY 6,

to make it possible for the farmers to combine and to dispose of their products at a lower cost for transportation and marketing, it would be more beneficial to the American farmer than the pending bill.

For years and years the American farmer has produced more grain than the American trade could take care of. It is seldom that he has produced less than the amount required for our country. The American farmer has for the last 50 years, I belie\e, produced a surplus in his own country and has exported products amounting to millions, yes, hundreds of millions of dollars, giving a balance of trade in favor of the United States. · I do not think that it is the fault of the American farmer that the balance of trade has at times been against us. I believe that they have· seen the advantage and taken advantage of new methods of scientific farming. They have not neglected their industry. While I find no fault with the idea of the Federal Government appropriating money for the agricultural col~ leges of the various States in the interest of this work. it can not be said that this is a new idea or a new theory or that it is unknown to the American farmer, because it is not.

I sympathize with the people who are living in States wher~ conditions are such that a certain class need more instruction in farming, and I have no objection to making appropriation::; that will benefit those sections. But after all, Mr. President, this bill makes appropriations which will amount to millions of dollars, and which will be expended by certain men not engaged in the industry of farming but by certain educators .who are to teach the practical farmer how to farm. I shall be surprised if much of this vast amount of money is not only wasted but deliberately used for political purposes. I know something about what is going on in my own State. I could refer back to what has happened "\fithin the last two weeks and show that men who are in the employment of the Government are participating in conventions and nominating candidates for office.

Mr. President, the American farmers are not as foolish as some people believe them to be. While they are slow to make complaint, I want to remind Senators that when they have fully made up their minds and satisfied themselves that legislation is being enacted not for the purpose of helping the farmer but for the purpose of making it appear that it is beneficial to him, no legislation of that sort is going to be welcomed.

Mr. President, I believe in making appropriations by the Federal Government and by the States for the purpose of disseminating knowledge among all classes of people, among farmers as well as manufacturers.

I wish to say that the editorial just read at the desk bears out the statement that I made. It is an editorial written by a man who I believe has the interest of the farmer at heart. He quotes in that editorial a statement made by our grt>at Secretary of Agriculture. I agree with Mr. Houston in the statement he makes, that while we are anxious to increase production we should be just as anxious to see that when the farmer makes his crop it is made at as little cost as it is possible for it to be made; that through transportation and the system of marketing it is made possible for him to get at least what his products cost him to produce.

This can not be done and will not be done by any provisions contained in the pending bill. The Senator from Georgia [Mr. SMITH], for whom I haYe not only personally a great deal of respect but admiration for his splendid ability and for the .great work he has done in the interest of the farmer, presented to this body a bill which, in my judgment, would be far more beneficial to the farmer than this bill can possibly be.

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. Will the Senator allow me to interrupt him just a moment?

Mr. GRONNA. Certainly. Mr. SMITH of Georgia. The Department of Agriculture is

now engag~d in developing the division of markets, which the Senator from North Dakota and I supported on the floor of the Senate and which originated here. The colleges of agriculture are studying market problems now right behind the Department of Agriculture. It is my earnest belief that the men from the colleges in this extension work will cooperate with the farmers and do for them as much service in the line of utilizing the suggestions that come from the Department of Agriculture and the information gathered about marketing their crops as with reference to increasing them. I have regarded that as one of the most important services that these men would perform. .

Mr. GRONNA. Mr. President, I am very g1ad to have that assurance from my friend, the Senator from Georgia, but it is only a week or 10 days ago since a certain convention was held

out" in the no1'thwestern country, where members of a ·certain chamber of commerce were the dominant factors in shaping resolutions, and the president of an agricultural college was the ehail;man. That convention was known as the Tristate Grain Growers' Convention, consisting of membership from three States, and I say men representing the International Harvester Works and inen representing great raili·oads were the leading spirits dominating that convention, and the farmers were very silent. They were not heard to the extent, if they were heard at all at these meetings, as were men representing these great gigantic trusts. ·

I hope, Mr. President, that the provisions of this bill will be carried out in the spirit in which they are intended, for the diffusion of knowledge, for disseminating knowledge among farmers, teaching them how to more economically and abundantly grow crops. I have no doubt-in fact, I know-that the Senator from Georgia [Mr. SMITH], as well as other Senators, believes that this legislation is in the interest of the farmer. I hope it is; I hope it will be beneficial to the farmer, because if there is any industry in the country that needs support it is the industry of farming. It is perfectly evident, from the very fact that strong, virile men, young boys who have grown up on the farm, are loath to remain on the farm and that they go to the cities. The very reason for that, in my opinion, is that farming is not a profitable industry; but when you make that industry more profitable, when you can show to the farmer that he can get a bigger income, that he can get more pay for his products, 110 matter where the farm is located, whether in the North or in the South, in the East or in the West, there will be no difficulty in keeping men on the farm.

The farmer, not only accepts the price placed upon his products by other people, but his industry is such that his paper is undesirable. He pays a higher rate of interest than any other class of men engaged in any other industry. When men in other business secure capital at the rate of from 3-! to 4~ per cent; the farmer pays the maximum, no matter what the prevailing rate of interest may be. He pays a higher price for his labor than any other men engaged in any other industry. He works longer hours. He, with himself and family, puts in more hours of hard labor than anyone engaged in any other indust.Ty and at a lower wage per day, as has been so well shown by my colleague [Mr. McCuMBER].

But, it is said, we are going to take care of the farmer now and furnish him cheaper capital. Mr. President, no doubt such bills introduced in the Senate and in the other House ha Ye been introduced with good intentions. It is perhaps believed by those who are sponsors for those bills that they will possibly furnish the farmer with money at a lower rate, but_! have looked those bills over carefully, and my mind is entirely too obtuse to see where the farmer is going to get his capital.

If you are going to benefit the farmer with cheaper money, why do you not pass some law authorizing the President of the United States to issue long-time bonds nt a low rate of interest to be loaned on farms? It is possible for the Government of the United States to loan its credit to the farmers of this country as well as it does to the bankers of the country. There is a possibility of the farmer getting cheaper money, providing we are willing to say that Government bonds shaH be sold for the sole purpose of loaning the money to the farmer on long time and at a rate of interest slightly in advance of the rate paid by the Government.

Suppose the Government should issue a billion dollars' worth of bonds at the rate of 3 per cent, to be loaned to the farmers at the rate of 4 per cent. In 47 years the farmer would pay not only the interest, but he would wipe out the entire debt. I want to suggest that plan to the majority party.

We all want the farmer to produce as much to a given area as possible, but we need not think that the farmer is going to continue to pile up a surplus of products and sell them at a loss from year to year. Unless the farmer can get a profit on his products, unless he can be given a market where he can dispose of his products at a price that is profitable, the people of this country are not going to flock back to the farm.

Mr. President, I have said more than I intended to say. I simply rose to say that I agree with all that is said in the article presented by the Senator from California [Mr. WORKS], and I agree with every word which the Secretary of Agriculture, Mr. Houston, has said in his report on this phase of the industry of agriculture .

.Mr. CLAPP. Mr. President, I think we all recognize that there is a force born of the union of purpose and activity far in excess of what the aggregate of the individual force would be of those who constitute the body which develops the concrete· force; in other words, in the association of government,

1914 .. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. 3033

moral and material benefit may properly be considered as one of the objects sought in tile association. That being true, it, no doubt, is within the fair purview of the purpose of free government that the force thus developed may be used along certain lines to develop certain conditions; but it is a line of policy that is always fraught with a great deal of danger, because the moment the government is invoked either in affirmative legislation, in negative legislation, or in direct appropriation of funds, there is a danger· that the particular class in whose interest such government force is invoked may Jlress the vantage ground which they ha>e, by reason of political superiority, in the policies of the go>ernment.

Every suggestion for the employment of go-vernment as an adjunct to the material development of a people should be considered with the most careful reference to the question of how broad the benefit sought to be attained is extended, because, of course, we all recognize that, in the complex condition of our civilization, no class of our people can be benefited without reflecting that benefit more or less upon all others, and no class can be injured by governmental policies without visiting that injury more or less upon all other classes. Taking that broad view, howev·er, and exercising the utmost care, there is still always the danger that the force -of government thus in>oked may be unjustly and unfairly applied.

..Agl'iculture stands out peculiar in its appeal to governmental aiel in this respect. First, we are all theoretically interested in extending to the broadest possible scope the productiveness of our soil. Whether the consumer gets his share of the increased benefits of that production and whether the producer gets his share are incidental questions which, of course, must be dealt 'vith by themselves, but theoretically our entire people are interested in developing the agricultural resources of our country. It has even a broader appeal than that, because of all the forces that face our civilization as a menace there is none to-day that stands out at such an acute angle as the tendency of our people to crowd into the cities.

The great city is the place where vice feeds upon itself, like a great festering sore thriving upon its own rottenness. The best Interests of our Republic demand the widest possible extension of our population outside of the cities. So that, without reference to its direct benefit to the farmer, any legislative policy which will tend to check the tendency of our people to herd in the cities and which will tend to keep upon the farm those who are there and encourage others to go upon the farm has the widest possible foundation for its justification.

Under this view of this question, while I think there are some provisions in this bill which I wish were not here, while I feel, perhaps, that some of this money will be wasted, still, for one, I think I can find a justification for the appropriation here contemplated.

But, Mr. President, there is one phase of this matter which has come out prominently in the discussion of the last day or two. It seems that when this bill was first drawn it provided:

That in any State in which two or more such colleges-

Being the colleges referred to in the bill-have been or hereafter may be established the appropriations hereinafter made to such State shall be administered by such college or colleges as the legislature of such State may approve, upon a plan to be submitted to the Secretary of the Interior.

The latter part of the provision I nm quoting from memory, but I think I am within the facts in saying that the bill as first prepared referred the matter at least to the consideration of the Secretary of the Interior.

That same provision has been in former laws, and the distinguished Senator from Washington [Mr. Jol't~S] yesterday said that in those laws where that provision is found there had been at least some approximation to a fair division of the appropriations between the white and colored races in the States to which that provision had reference, while in those laws where no such provision was contained the money had gone practically entirely to the white race. I can not bring myself to justify the elimination from this bill of the provision upon that subject found in the laws referred to by the Senator from Washington.

Mr. President, it is not my purpose this afternoon to discuss at any length the racial question. The Senator from Georgia [Mr. SMITH] has very · frankly admitted that under the provisions of this bill as those provisions now stand the appropriation will be administered entirely through the white college in his State.

Mr. President, the Senator from Mississippi .[1\'Ir. V .ARDA.MAN] stated yesterday .what, of course, every student of divine law and human experience knows, that the South suffered far more from the curse of slavery than tbe enslaved race itself suffered. That has always been the law; it has always been the experience. The oppressed suffer less than the oppressor; the one upon whom a

LI--192

wrong is visited, in the last analysis, suffers less than the one who visits the wrong upon him. Whatever source we may ascribe to that law, whatever the condition under which that law is invoked, human experience confirms the existence of such a law.

Mr. V .A.RDA.l\I.A.N. Mr. President--The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mr. WALSH in the chair).

Does the Senator from Minnesota yield to the Senator from Mississippi?

1\Ir. CLAPP. With pleasure. Mr. VARD.A.llA.N. l\Ir. President, I hope the Senator in the

discussion of this question will not lose sight of the fact tbat slavery was not originally a southern institution as distinguished from other parts of the Republic. The South was no more responsible for it than was the North. As a matter of fact, the slave trade had its headquarters in the little State of Rhode Island, and there was never a dime's worth of stock owned in a sla-ve ship by a southern man. While the system worked wrong, though not in the sense in which the Senator has expressed himself, the South was in no way more responsible for it than were the people of the North. The slave was brought here and sold to the southern man by the northern man, and the northern man made money. The southern man bought the slave, raised cotton with the negro, and made money. So far as the moral responsibility is concerned, one section is just as much respons1ble for it as the other; but great pecuniary loss fell upon the South when the North liberated the slaves.

Mr. CLAPP. It was not the pecuniary loss I was about to discuss. I am fearful that the Senator from Mississippi is perhaps a little oversensitive as to what I was saying. I regret his interruption, because I had no intention of making any comparison of responsibiHty. It is true that in the North men were engaged in bringing the slaves to America, and it is equally true, no doubt, that it was the climatic conditions in the North which reconciled the North earlier to the extinction of slavery than in the slave States. I believe in being perfectly frank and fair, and I had intended no distinction that would have reflected any moral obloquy upon the South.

Mr. VARD.A.MAN. I did not take it in that way. I simply wanted to keep the record straight; that was all.

1\lr. CLAPP. Very well. It lessens nothing the force of what I was saying, that the oppressor pays the penalty, for the North, in a large measure, shared in the consequences of sl:-u-ery and the slave trade; but climatic conditions rendered it perhnps more natural that the system should linger and fiourisb in the South.

Mr. President, the penalty that the South paid was not alone in. blood and in treasure, but the South paid the same penalty that is ever visited upon the oppressor, in the lessened strength. activity, and force of the oppressor, due to the fact that he is not obliged to put forth that effort which he would put forth if he did not depend upon the activities of those who were oppressed and who served him. I believe to-day that the South is suffering from that condition and that cause.

At the close of the great strife, which, in my humble judgment, would never have been witnessed had it not been for slavery, the colored people were found in a peculiar condition. I have no doubt, Mr. President, that in many of the families of the South there was an absolute affection on the part of the master for the slave and an affection on the part of the sla-ve for the master. The best testimony of that is that, so far as my reading goes, during the four years of that struggle, while the slave was probably ever ready to shield and shelter those whom he thought were bringing freedom to him, he seldom-in all my reading I have never yet found an instance--where he betrayed the helplessness of those who had been intrusted to him while his master went fort11 to the field of battle. That must stand as a monument to the affection which existed between maste1· and slave. This race, numbering then some four millions, were found in a practically destitute condition. Under the law they could have no property ; they could not enforce any property rights. It is true that many maste1·s gave to their slaves some sort of title to property, very much, I assume, as a farmer may give to his son or his daughter, some particular piece of property upon his farm; but, above and beyond all, was the law which prevented, as I understand and recall it now, as to every State--there may have been exceptions-the right of recovery of property by the slave.

It is no doubt true that in many families, and on the part especially of many Christian mistresses, an effort was made to give some degree of education to some of the slaves; but the fact remains that there were laws against the education of the black man, and that in the main he was without education. Of their progress since then the Senator from Washington [Mr. JoNEs] has already spoken.

3034 CONGRESSION .AL RECORD- SEN ATE._ FEBRUARY 6,

-There is some force jn the position taken by the Senators from those States that, having this problem on their hands, having to deal with this situation, they are better qualified to judge what s..l!ould be done than those who are not so · situated; but, Mr. President, here comes in another great natural law: The master, the oppressor, the superior one has ever arrogated to himself the authority to say what was better for the one who was oppressed, the one who was enslaved, or the one who was dominated by the superior. Had it been left to the say-so of the power which governed, the power which enslaved, and the power which dominated, there would never ha\e been any human progress. The king never has gone down from his throne to take the subject by the hand and place him upon a pL'me of equality with himself. No feudal baron ever rode forth from hls castle giving his keys to the toilers in the valley; t>ut the toilers in the valley, your ancestors and mine, by war und the spirit of free institutions, climbed the hillside and tore down the feudal wall. . So, no matter how generous, how fair the spirit of the master may be in what he seeks to do, history confirms me in the proposition that we would have had no progress in this world if we had left it to the volition of him, who on the throne, at the head of the army, master, or otherwise superior, to say in what manner and when progress should be accorded to those beneath, below, and in subjection. So while it is true that we do not live in the environment of Georgia, we are all capable of measuring, analyzing, and fathoming those human purposes and human forces which ever ope1·ate in human activities.

It is said by the Senator from Georgia that it is to the interest of the southern farmer to develop the agricultural efficiency of his tenants. Undoubtedly that is true; but, Mr. President, the southern negro is a citizen of the United States. We in Minnesota are interested in the final solution of the negro question in Georgia. The people of Iowa are interested in the final solution of the negro problem in Louisiana. This entire country is interested in the solution of that problem, because if it can not be peacefully and fairly solved, then in some form-heaven, in its infinite wisdom, only knows how-this entire country must again pay the penalty, because we can not expect to escape it if a wrong is committed. · The man from the North understands human nature, and the negro of the South is a human being. While he may have peculiar propensities, while he may have peculiar mental conditions born of his environment, there is an underlying law of human natrrre that pervades the purpose and spirit of the negro in the South as absolutely and certainly as that which pervades the negro of the North, and it is this: You have got to hold out to a man some hope, some prospect; there bas got to be some inspiration given him to look forward to the time when he will not be a pupil, when he will develop into a spirit of independence. The mere financial interest of the Georgia farmer in the development of the efficiency of his tenant farmer along the lines suggested in this bill will not develop that independence of spirit, that hope of some day standing upon his own footing, which is essential to the final development of the negro and the solution of the negro problem, because in that r.espect the negro problem is simply a human problem, and the laws of human nature apply to human nature wherever yon find it.

Now, why strike .out the provision in the former law! To strike out the "Provision contained in the former bill is to say to every colored man, North and South, "You are being discriminated against in this law. You are made the basis of the appropriation itself; you are counted when it comes to taking the dollars from the Treasury of the Federal Government, but you are to be ignored, even through representation, to say nothing of the detail of representation, when it comes to the .division of that appropriation."

When we consider that we are invading the somewhat dangerous domain of taJdng money from the taxpayers of the country and devoting it to one specific purpose along the line of the de-relo.pment and benefit of one particular class it seems to me that as little as we can do in fairness and justice is to insist that somewhere in this scheme of distribution there shall be at least some sort of an appeal to the Federal Government that is bestowing, not its own benefaction, but as trustee for all the people, a benefaction derived from all and distributing it to a few.

For that reason I, for one, am in favor of the amendment proposed by the Senator from Washington. It does not take this money a way from these people. If, as the Senator from Georgia yesterday so frankly stated, it appears that it would be a waste of this f-und to put it in th:is college or that, it seems to me it is going a long way, n. bow drawn at a long venture, to suggest that a Cabinet officer would thus insist upon the distribu-

tion of this fund. All we ask is, in addition to the legislature of the State, which, of course, primarily is in the midst of this environment and primarily considers the environment, that before the action of the legislature becomes final, subject as that legislature may be to local conditions in the State affecting the purpose and the judgment of the legislature, it shall be submitted to a Cabinet officer of this Go\ernment.

I, for one, believe it is .a dangerous IJrogram. to enter upon to make appropriations to the States and not some where in the appropriation resene that finnl authority on the part of the Go-rernment, vested in some officer and resting in that officer, to be exercised if in the distribution of the fund by the legislature it is manifest that injustice is being done.

I can not see how those who ha-re so long contended against this policy should now be in favor of it. All we ask, as I said before-and I shall not longer trespass upon the time of the Senate-is that this bill shall simply provide that the matter shall be submitted to a cabinet officer of the Federal Go\ernment. Since it is a Federal appropriation, I think we should retain and reserve that much of final authority and power o-rer the appropriation, if by any possihility there is danger of its being misapplied and misappropriated.

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. 1\!r. President, before formally presenting a proposed unanimous-consent agreement, I wish to inquire whether any one present is opposed to it, because if so it will be useless to call a q110rum and put the balance of the Senators on notice.

The proposed agreement is as follows: It is agreed by unanimous consent that not later than 4 o'clock on

February 6 the Senate will proceed to the consideration of House bill 7!>51, a.n.d during that calendar day vote upon any amendment that may be pendmg, any amendments that may be orrered, and upon the bill through the regular pa.rlin.mentary stages to its final disposition; -o.nd that after 4 o'clock on February 6 no Senator shall speak m-ore than once nor longer than 10 minutes upon the bill, nor more than once nor longer than 10 minutes upon any amendment.

Mr. GALLINGER. Do I understand the Senator to ask that a vote shall be taken to-day?

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. That we shall commence voting at 4 o'clock, but leaving all amendments to the bill and the bill itself subject to 10 minutes' debate from that time on.

1\Ir. GALLINGER. I trunk I never have known a unanimousconsent agreement to b~ asked on an important measure where it was provided that the vote should be taken on the day the request was made. I hope the Senator will put that off a little longer than to-day.

:Mr. SMITH of Georgia. Then I shall not press the pro~ posed agreement at this time.

Mr. GALLINGER. I should not object to it if the time fixed were to-morrow.

1\fr. SMITH of Georgia. I have offered it several times before, and I will wait a little longer. I was rather rmder the impression that no othei' Senn.tor desired to speak at length upon the bill; but I shall not offer the proposed agreement now.

Ur. GALLINGER. It is possible that the Senator will get a -rote on his bill to-day.

I wish to make a few observations on the measure, but, as is my custom, I shall not speak at great length.

It has not been my privilege, because of enforced absence from the city, to hear the debate on this important measure. I favor the principle of the bill and have intended to vote for it, as I probably shall in whatever shape it may assume. I have hurriedly, at my desk, sketched the speech of the junior Senator from Georgia [Mr. SMITH], made on the bill yesterda-y. The Senator was, as he always is, frank and unequivocal in the arguments he offered and in the conclusions he reached. I would gladly agree with the Senator from Georgia if I could so far as the distribution of this fund is concerned in a certain portion of the country, but I ha-re not been able to bring myself to that view.

The Senator from Georgia states that there are more colored men in the State of Georgia than in any other State of the American Union, and he puts the number at 1,170,000. According to the census of 1910 the population of the State of Georgia was 2,609,121. So there are 1,170,000 colored men in the State and 1,439,121 whites, or, in other words, there are only between two and three hundred thousand more whites than colored, the colored population being 45 per cent of the whole.

It seems to me the fact that there are almost as may colored people in Georgia as there a~e whites is a controlling reason why we should in every possible way do what we can to elevate those 1JeOI>le and make good citizens of them. If the colored men in Georgia are educated, especially along the lines of industrial education and of agriculture, whlch the Senator ha so ably advocated heretofore, the State of Georgia will be tile stronger and the richer and the more powerful because of that fact.

. 1914. CONGRESS! ON AL RECORD-SEN ATE . 3035 I do not know whether I shall speak from the book or not

when I cull attention to the claims that are made as to the progress of the negro in the South since the days of his emancipation. It may be that the claims that have been made in certain quarters are exaggerated, and that he has not made the advance that bas been suggested by certain people who have written on the subject; but the claims have not been disputed, and I am fully persuaded, from what little knowledge I personally possess, that the advance of the negro in the South has been much more rnpid than the advance of the white serfs of llussia, and that he deserves a great deal of credit for what he has accomplished under the most adverse conditions. Without at all raising the race question, because I have no disposition at all to do that, I feel that as a representative of one

. of the States of the Union it is my duty to do everything I can, by ...-oice and by vote, to help along the progress of those people to a higher and a better civilization than they ha...-e yet attained.

I had not the privilege of hearing the speech of the Senator from Washington [1\Ir. JoNEs] who has introduced the amendment which I fa...-or; and it is barely possible that in what I shall introduce into the RECORD I may be traversing ground covered by the Senator. His speech has not yet been put into pl"int, and hence I ha...-e not had an opportunity of examining it.

I have here a communication from the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People, with headquarters in New York. They publish a newspaper called "The Crisis." Connected with that institution I find the names of some very worthy men and women. The national president is l\Ioorfielct Storey, of Boston, a man with whom I do not agree on some matters, but a very distinguished citizen of the State of Massachusetts, who stands for a great deal that is good in our national life. At the head of the board of directors stands Miss Jane Addams, of Chicago, a woman who has done so much for the civic ~etterment of the whites of this country, and who apparently IS doing what she can for the civic betterment of the .colored people of the country.

This communication, which came to me, and which I presume bas come to other Senators, I think ought to go in the RECORD. It is dated January 28, 1913 . . They say:

The Smith-Lever bill, now pending in the Senate will provide appropriations .f~r ag-ricultural extension work to be carried on by the colleges rcce1vmg benefits under the acts of 1802 and 1890 in cooperation with the Department of Agriculture.

In each C?f the Soutbern States but one there are two such collegesone fot· white and one for colored students.

I confess that was a surprise to me when I read it-that the colored people have established in each of the Southern States but one a col!ege for the study of agriculture. It is a splendid record, of wh1ch they may well be proud. They continue:

The. bill provides that in such cases the appropriations . " shall be admimstere?, by such colle~e or colleges as the legislature of such State ~ay direct. This I?roviswn would authorize the State legislatures to g1ve the administration of the whole fund to the white colleges.

. As. I understand, the Senator from Georgia frankly stated lll h1s speech that that would be the policy of the Southern States.

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. Certainly in my State· I think it would be the only intelligent thing to do. '

Mr. GALLINGER. That is the way I read it in the Senator's speech.

If the bill should be enacted with this clause the colleges for colored students would have the administration of none of the fund~>, and the colored farmers would receive little i! any of the benefits. 'lhis statement is not conjecture. It is proved by facts.

Under the act of 1802, which did not safeguard their interests the colored colleges received $291,285, ot· 81t per cent of the total or' $3 -408,893 .. Under the act of 1890, which did safeguard their interests, they recelv':_d, of the income in 1912, $240,478.57, or 28 per cent of the total of $8:->0,000.

The act of March 2, 1887 (34 Stat. L., 431), appropriating money for agricultural experiment stations provided that the appropriations " shall be equally divided between such colleges unless the legislature of such State or Territory shall otherwise 'direct." As a result of this provision almost nothing from the appropriations went to the colored colleges.

'l'he Jones amendment to the Smith-Lever. bill safeguards the interests of the colleges for colored students by substitutlna for the clause which authorizes the State legislatures to name the cofleaes which are to administer the funds, a clause modeled on that in th:' act of 1890 If this amendment is adopted a fair ancl equitable division will be provided for between the white and colored colleges to be ao-reed upon betwf.en the State legislatures and the Secretary of the Interior W~ earnestly ~ge you to vote for this amendment, which aSks for

nothing but bare JUStice for the colored farmer. Very truly, yours,

NATIONAL ASSOCIATION FOR THE ADVANCEMENT OF COLORED PEOPLE.

Mr. President, as I said a moment ago-and I am speaking entirely without preparation-! wm put into the RECORD some statements as to the advance of the colored people of the South in their material development, which I assume is true. But

however that may be, I think it is universally conceded by those who have studied the question, both North and South, that aU things considered, that people freed half a century ago have made wonderful progress in the acquisition of property and in education.

I have in my hand an article which, if I remember correctly, I clipped from the Congregationalist, a religious paper of one of the leading denominations in the city of Boston. The statements contained in that article are so illuminating and so impressive regarding the people who are to be discriminated against if this bill passes in its present form that I feel I shall be pardoned for reading it to the Senate. It was published not long ago, perhaps a month ago or thereabouts. It is headed, "The changed attitude toward the negro," and is as follows:

The romantic period of the negro's emancipation Is over. There was a time when we listened in the North with a throb of heart to the songs of freedom hoped for or attained. The call of the unfinished work spoke to us and we could sing-

" The good time coming ls almost here; It's been long, long, long on the way."

Uncle Tom was a vivid reality to many an imagination, and we felt keen satisfaction in the thought that the slave was to be proclaimed a brother. ·

That romantic chapter in the history of the negro race ln America is long ago closed and can not be reopened." Many of its fruits in philanthropy and legislation have dropped abortive from the bough. We have tried the experiment of giving the ballot for the negro's selfprotection, and all over the South it has been filched away from him. We have educated his sons and daughters, and they are now denied any share in the common life. The trades and occupations more and more are closed against him We complain that the strangers who have passed through our entrance gates are clannish and live apart. nut we compel these children of our own soil to live apart in servile or in clannish isolation. The last places that were his In public office are being taken away from him or with deliberate intention of contempt certain places in the lower ranks are left to him alone.

There is no glamor now about the cause of the negro in America. The southern white man stops in his motor car lJeforc the Shaw monument in Boston in folite and dumb astonishment. The average man is frankly bored by al discussion of the rights and wrongs of the colored man.

What remains for the Christian in America in regard to these men and women whom God made with a dark skin and were brou~ht to dwell aillong us? There are 10,000,000 of them, all theoretical citizens of the United States. Can we af'l'ord to be merely bored in thinking of their· needs and cares? Two opportunities at least remain-the opportunity of recognition and the opportunity of ald.

If the romantic age of negro emancipation had gone by and left the negro as he was, there would some excuse for the southern white man·s kindly contempt and far the northern white man's bored indifference. But a race that has developed its own strong and cultivated leaders, that has risen from slavery and in a single generation educated more than 60 out of every 100 of its people, old and youn~, a race that from poverty and dependence has accumulated $700,000,u00 worth of property and tills 20,000,000 acres of freehold farms, is a strong race and will yet assert itself powerfully in our national life.

If it does not grow out of the soil of Christian brotherhood, our duty of recognition should grow out of mere admiration for great achievement under conditions harder than we have ever known. Grudging acknowledgment here is an arraignment of our powers of admiration for great and difficult work well done and lofty alms accomplished.

'!'he duty of aid remains. Shall not we brothers of the ministering Christ rather call it a privilege? Help has been given; help must still be given to secure and to advance this hope of the negro-American. If he is to live in a class apart, we must see to it that he has the higher culture as well as the practical opportunity to make that class worthy of our own high ideals.

The relapse of the American negro into barbarism would in a hundred ways be a calamity to our national life. Money and thought are well expended here. And by our capacity for going on in this work of helpfulness when the romance has faded and the glamor departed the sincerity of our good will and the reality of our sense of brotherhood will be severely tested. It is easy to go or give with the crowd; the trial comes when the crowd is scattered and the cheers have ceased, but the way of duty and of opportunity stretches on before our feet.

I wish also to read another clipping that I made a littl~ while ago from some publication, and which is very brief. When I speak of the amount of property that these people have accumulated and the ratio of illiteracy in their ranks, I speak, as I suggested a moment ago, without personal knowledge, but I have reason to believe the statements are accurate. The clipping is as follows:

A race that owns property valued at $700,000,000, including 20,000,-000 acres of land, and bas only 30 per cent of illiterates in a single generation after slavery can not be called decadent. This is the reply of the National Negro Business League to the critics of the negro in America. It calls attention to the fact that this amount exceeds the whole value of the possessions of the white peasants of Uussia. T!Jc direction in which the faces of these Americans are set is indicated by the reelection by the league of Booker Washington as president for the fourteenth consecutive year.

1\lr. President, I am not going to discuss the fifteenth amendment to the Constitution of the United States. If I did, possibly it would excite a feeling of more or less rancor on both sides of the Chamber. The fact is that the negroes were given the right of suffrage. They are not granted that right to-day. I believe the future will take care of that question in some way, and I trust the proper way, but it has no place in this di8· cussion, and I do not propose to discuss it.

I do, however, in all sincerity and earnestness, with simply a feeling of what I conceive to be common justice to the colored

3036 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE~ FEBRUARY 6,

people of the- country, who are almost in a m~jority in Geor-gia, and who are in a majority in the State of South Carolina, numbering ten or more millions of men and women in the country, appeal in their behalf to the Senate of the United States to do them the justice of permitting their agricultural colleges to have a fair share of the money that we are to vote from the Federal Treasury. I know that my State desires that. I belie\e fre Northern States generally would desire it if it were submitted to their people for discussion and decision.

In earnestly expressing this view and indulging this hope, I tru t the representatives from the Southern States, looking~ as I doubt not they do, to the betterment of the condition of these people, so numerous and so worthy in many ways, will agTee that tlle amendment submitted by the Senator from Washington shall become a part of the law. I shall not detain the Senate longer, but shall await with a great deal of interest the vote on this amendment, which doubtless soon will be taken and .which I devoutly trust may be agreed to.

Mr. VAllDM:IA.N. 1\Ir. President, it was not my purpose to ha.T"e anything further to sny upon this bill. Although I am very much interested in its passage, I had det.ermined to leave its pilotnge over the turbulent waters of its further voyage to fhe wise head and ldllful hand of the able and patriotic junior Senator from Georgia. But certain things lm:ve been said and objections urged which make it necessary for me to bring to bear whatever influence my limited capacity may carry to prevent the ilistortion of its terms and possibly defeating the consummation of its splendid purposes. If enacted into law as the biU came from the House, I think it would be a great benefit not only to the farmer, the tiller of the soil, but to all of the American people, because we understand that the farm and its products, the country home and its pure--lived inmates, uncontan1Ulated by--

The social wants that sin against the strength of youth And the social lies that warp us from the living truth-

are the enduring substrata upon which all industrial prosperity rests. Not only is it true that the farmer's toil produces the real wealth of the country, but it is also true that the farmer, as distingui'shed from other classes, furnishes to-day the larger l)er cent of the patriotic, incorruptible voters of this Republic. To me one of the most discouraging facts reTealed by the last census was the fact that 51 per cent of the population of America lived in the cities and towns. You have but to turn to the pages that record the story of the past to find the evil omen involved in this statistical fact, and the rea'Son of my solicitude for our national future. Man is but the creature of heredity and environment. Human nature is the same in all ages of the world. The same a-spirations, hopes, fears, hates, and loves actuate and control men to-day that contrelled them 2,500 years ago. The only light we have_ to guide us in the darkness of the future is the light which shines out from the experiences of the past. The llornan Republic, to a certain extent our great prototype, wa:s strong, clean, virtuous, and true as long as she was goT"erned by tlle free cultivators of the soil, all of whom, let me impress upon Senators, were Caucasian; but when the rich dwellers in the city became tlle owners of the land and the old agricultural population was reduced to industrial vassalage, free institutions died and Rome became a despotism under the name of republic. It is the rarest thing in the world that you ever hear of <fishonesty in rural politics. Not only is the man who lives in the country honest and patriotic, but it is also a pregnant fact, 1\fr. President, that from the farm every year go into the cities the virile population which keeps the patriotic spirit aliT"e there.

As a matter of fact, but for the army of red-blooded, healthybo<lied recruits that continue to go from the country to the cities and towns, signs of decay in the urban population would soon manifest themselves. The country is the breeding place of the patriot. He is the product of fresh air and free sunshinethe child of the home where \irtue abounds, where revePence for God is taught at the family altar, and love of counh'Y and duty to the flag are exemplified in the lives of the patriotic father and consecrated motller whose excellency is characterized by "doing the noble things that others pray." It is rare, indeed, that you find the golden-hearted patriot in the gilded palace. He seldom comes from the insanitary section of the " soulless city "-from the congested tenement house. He can not grow in a sociul atmosphere where character is often below par and repu~'ltion at a premium, where "poverty is a disgrace and failure brings despair" and the blurred · genuine is of less value in the social countinghouse than a poli.shed counterfeit. The men and women who arc to direct the . destini~s of this Republic, lead it along the paths of peace, direct its commercial and industrial affairs, carry it on to higher, nobler, and greater achievements-in a word, fulfill the hopes and realize the dream

of the great men and women who gave it being-will spring from the loins of the men who UDW live beneath the shadow of the cloud-piercing mountains, whose toil stirs the fragrant soU of the fertile plains, whose happy homes dot the banks of the rushing rivers upon whose bosom floats the commerce of a Nation, or the earnest husblllldman who labors on the land down by the "gray waste of ocean," where from early morn to dewy eve" he listens to the multitudinous laughter of the sea"~ the man who lives close to nature and nature's God-

Who sees God's love in the fragrant rose, His sh·ength in each rolling sphere;

Who feels Efis touch as the zephyr blows, And knows that His mercy for all like a river flows,

And his soul has ceased to fear. To that class of people we are to look, Mr. President, for

the perpetuity of our Go\ernment, for the preservation in their . pristine vigor of American institutions. Kow, the purpose of this bill is to help the tillers of the land to discover the hidden treasures of the soil, to devise methods of cultivation which will lessen the burden of _ farm life by shortening the hours o1l drudgery, and render more producti-re the land. Its splendid purpose is to improve the man, enlarge his mental horizon, and give intelligent direction to his efforts. The effect also will be to add comforts to tlle cotmtry home, lighten the burdens of woman, afford greater opportunities to the boys and girls upon whose shoulders soon must fall the responsibilities of home anct the burdens of government. I can not see how any Senator on this floor can find an objection to the bill. No argument has yet been made against it. A few statements have been made, but no argument has been advanced against the merit of this measure. UnfOTtuna.tely its passage through the Senate has been delayed by injecting a question which were better left out. But I do not hesitate to say, Mr. President, tha.t the question thus injected into this discussion, though irrelevant, is of the most vital importance to the South and fraught with greater menace to the Nation than every other social and economic question combined which now confronts the civilization of the century. A distinguished Senator in this Chamber on yesterday referred to it as a " southern problem." He is in part only, correct in his statement. The problem is in the South in its most acute and aggravated form. But it is a national problem-as national in all of its elements as ever emanated from the pregnant womb of time. In it is involved the vital issue of the purity and integrity of Anglo-Saxon blood--the " continuous germ plasma" of the Oaucasinn race. A proper solution of this great problem is the first and paramount question before the American people. It is susceptible of settlement by the Nation only, and not by any subdivision of the Nation. The whole Nation is responsible for the problem, and the whole Nation must solve it. The question which we shall consider now, Mr. President, is what is best for both races in the distribution of and the disbursement of the fund proposed to be appropriated by this bill. I Will! very much impressed by the sublime philosophy proclaimed by my friend the Senator from Minnesota [Mr. CLu>r]. It is a tribute to his good heart but has little releYancy to the question at issue. l\Iy friend is always interesting; he is always honest, and the a:ff!.uence of his eloquence is always charming to me.

But he convinces me, Mr. President, that he knows v-ery little about the history of the negro race. His philosophy, if applied to the Oaucasjan, is absolutely correct. But the negro and the white man are not the same. The difference is antipodal. A study of tlle biological phase of the problem-" the ontogeny and phylogeny "-of it will make that fact clear-if indeed there could be any doubt about it. No man has spoken more wisely and clearly upon this subject than Abraham Lincoln, for whose genius the Senator from Minnesota has great respect, as we all have. l\Ir. Lincoln's friendship and devotion to the negro's interest can not be questioned. I call the Senator's attention to the wise words of this wondrous man. In a memorable speech, deliYercd at Charleston, Ill., in 1858, Mr. Lincoln said:

I am not nor ever have beE-n in favor of bringing about in any way social and political equality of the white and black races-that I am: not nor ever haTe been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes nor of qualifying them to hold office nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical diirere>~ce between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms o! social and political equality. And inasmuch as the.y ean not so live, whi!e they do remain together there must be the po ttion of superior and mferior, and I, as much as any other man, am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race.

Could the question be more strongly presented or more cogent truths embraced in so short a space?

Now, I am going to make a statement which I challenge any Senator upon this floor to successfully contradict. The negro us a race, in all the ages of the world, has never shown sustained

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD- SENATE. 3037 ~ power of self-d evelOilrnent. He is not endowed with the creative faculty. " God planted the Egyptian and the negro side- by side in the fabled Yalley of the Nile with equal opportunities:. The earth wns new; all things lay before all men; uo ·man could borrow from his neighbor. because his: neighhor had naught to lend; no man could learn from his neighbor, because his neighbor had naught to teach. Here was the vil'gin e rth, fresh andr moist from the hand of the Creator ; there was the mysterious sea, and far away in the shining spaces of the night lay the uncounted stars with their lessons spread. .All of these were to be conquered. The door of hope stood broadly QPen and no color line was drn wn."

But the doot· of hope might have remained closed so far as the progress the negro was to make for himself was concerned. Tie has never created for himseU! any civiliza tion. He has nevel' rlsen above the government of a club. He has never written a l angua ge. His achievements in architecture are limited to the tha tched-roofed hut or a hole in the ground. No monuments ha;e been bailded by him to oody forth and perpetuate in the memory posterity the virtues of his ancestors.

For countless ages he has looked upon the rolling sea and ne er dreamed of a sail. In trutl'l, he has n-ever progressed, save and except when undex the influence and absolute control of a superior race. IDs o:ppartunities l.mve been great. The negro helped to build the temples of Ra.meses, he polished the columns of Karnak, he toiled at the hundred-gated Thebes, he was touched by the tides of civilization that swept across the Eastern Hemisphere in the forenoon of the ages, and yet it made no more impression upon him as a race than a drop of water on the oily back of a duck. He is living in Africa to-day, in the land where he sprang, indigenous, in substantially the same condition, occupying the same rude hut, governed by the same club. worshiping the same fetish that he did when the Pharoahs ruled in Egypt. He has never had any civilization except that which h:Js been inculcated by a superior race. And it is a lamentable fact that his civilization lasts only so long as he is in the hands of the white man who inculcates it. Wben left to himself he has univeL'Saliy gone back t() the barbarism of the jungle.

Let us consider his condition. in Haiti. If you are not familiar with the history of Haiti, I beg you to inform yourselves. You will find in it a pregnant lesson which I commend to your consideration. It will throw a flood of light upon our own Ameriean problem. The negro acquired control of this island more than a hundred years age. Thomas Jefferson said:

This ill test the negro'& capacity !or self-government. With his usual. prescience and foresight, Jefferson predicted

failure. But he said : Let him try it. We wl1l help him.

Haiti was at that time the gem o! the Antilles. The most magnificent cane fields, coffee plantations, and fruit gro-res graced the landsca!)e' of that delightful little island. Now shift the scene. Look at Haiti to-dayr after 100 years of negro rule. After 100 yeru.·s of assistance b;v the white man-assistance with m-oney, with example, precept, and all of those superior virtues which characterized the civilization of the white race. What do we find there to-day? Sir Spencer SL John, who represented the English Government at Port au Prince for 20 years, wrote a hook entitled " :::Iaiti, or Black Republic." When this English officer first visited Haiti he looked with compassion upon the black man. He thought he had been denied an equal chance in the race of life. He tho-ught he had been the victim of slaverythat the elements of manhood had been stifled by such oppression as some of tire djstinguished Senators on this floor in this debate have called attention to as having been practiced in the Southern States of America. Yes; he thought "the negra was a sunburned Yankee, who had not been given a square d~l."

Sir Spencer St. John remained as the representative of his Government at the court of this black Republic for 20 years. He made a close study of the questi<>n. He informed himself as to the racinl peculiarities of the negro, and his testimony to the world is that the negro is incapable of self-government. He is incapable of sustaining a civilization all his own. Further, he says :

After an experience ot 100 years Haiti has proven a. tallcrre. Titer~ is no semblance o! ctv il government there, except in the se!l.pOJ:ts? which are dominated oy whites and mulattoes.

And he tells ns further the disgusting story of the worship of the voodoo and cannibalism, which he says is as common as their sexual crimes in the Southern States of this Republic. Wby, Mr. President, the United States Government is in San. Domingo to-day as the guardian of that people, having sent. agents there to administer their public affairs. NO'w, I know the ll€gro hrrs made n. certain order of progress in the South. Be has ~cquh:etl p ·orH~rty. He is acquiring hook learning. I am

advised th~t there · is a decrease of illiteracy of something like 12 per cent in every decade. There is no doubt about that. But I am going to make a statement which, I dare say, will astonish some of the gentlemen who have shown such honest and sincere interest in the negro's advancement. While he has progressed mentally, he has deteriornted morally and physically. It is a lamentable fact that as a race the negro in America is morecriminal to-day than he was in 1861. And certain diseases which were unknown among them before the war are decimating their ranks~ filling the hospitals with incurables and the asylums with lan.atics. I predict that these diseases will cause a marked falling off in the birth rate in the next decade.

And that is true of the negro in the North, probably more so than H is of the negro in the South. Nobody will deny that, that is, no one will deny it who has any reliable information on the subject. The white people of Pennsylvania are friendly to the negro. There he has been given every opportunity that the public schools and colleges afford for his moral and mental advancement, and yet, I am adnsed, that while he is only 2t per cent of the total population of the State- of "Brotherly Love," the negro race furnished 17 per cent of the male criminals and 30 per cent ·of the female criminals. In the city of Wu.shin.gton, a perfect ha-ren for him, where speci-al distinction has been shown him because of his" race, color, or previous condition of servitude," here in this city, where he has been treated as a hothouse plant, where-he has enjoyed all the advantages of. social, official, industrial, and political equality, we find him., after 40 years of freedom, while only 28 per cent of the total population, his race furnishes 68 per cent of the grist for the criminal courts to grind. It is not uncommon here, at the seat of government. where all of these special favors have been accorded the negro--! repeat, it is not uncommon-to find the pages of the morning papers blurred with the account of as.saults perpetrated by negroes on white women on the main thoroughfares of the city.

Now, Mr. Pres:!.dent and Senators, I do not want to do anything that will arrest the negro's p.rogress. I would not raise my hand against his: material advancement. I believe that I am his real friend. I know him; I understand him in all the relations of life. I have lived with him from my infancy. I was nursed by an old black mammy, the recollection of whose tender ministrations to me are among the sweetest assets of my life:. A dear old negro woman nursed every one of our babies. A most faithful, trustworthy, devoted servant and friend wa.s this good old womanp I never permit a.n opportunity to pass to pay the tribute- of' my love and respect for her memory. As governor of my State I am sure that I exerted myseli as much to protect the negra in the enjoyment of his life, his liberty, the pursuit o.f happiness, and the products of his own toil as any executive in Ameri-ca has ever done. He does not vote· much jn Mississippi, but I really think that he votes more than he ought to vote; if he votes at all. I do not think it was e-rer intended by the Creator that the two races should live together upon. equal terms-enjoy equal political and social advantages. One or the other- must rule. The people of the South tried to share with the negro in the government of the country after the wnr~ but the negro declined to share with the white man. Black heelS' rested cruelly upon white necks for many years after the close of the war. The white rp.an endured the· negro's. misrule, his. insolence, impudence. and infamy. He suffered his criminal incapacity to govern until: the public domain had been well-nigb. squandered and the public treasury looted. We saw the civilization reared by the: genius of our fathers, glorified and cemented by their sacred blood, vanishing from the en.rth, and by means, I will not say in this presence, fair. but by means sufficient, we invoked the law of self-preservation; we n.rose in the might of an outraged race and as the Savior scourged the money changers from the temple, so the southern white m:1n drove from power the scalawag, the carpetbagger, and the incompetent negro. I shall waitr for another occasion to enlarge upon this phase of the race problem. Mr, President, I was interested when my good friend, the learned and eloquent Senator from illinois [Mr. SHERMAN] on yesterday asked the question of the Senator from Virginia [1\lr. MARTIN], "How many negroes vote in Virginia? " I do not know how many negro-es vote in Virginia, but I want to say to the Senator from illinois that it would be a godsend to every Commonwealth in. this Republic if there were no negro votes cast anywhere.

If in the providence of God the negro may ma.ke progress sufficient to justify the ·American people in giving him the franchise, that time has not yet an·tved. I believe the Republican Party is getting about a.s tired of the negro in politics, and 1 believe the members o:t that party in. this Chamber, if they were candid, would admit that they are about as tired of dealing with him in politics a.s. the Democrats are. I was ~ery much

3038 CONGRESS! ON AL RECORD-SEN ATE. FEBRUARY 6,

gratified to notice at one of the recent councils of the leaders of the Republican Party that you are trying to devise ways and means by which you may get rid of the pernicious vote of the southern negro in your national com·entions. You ought to do it. It is not creditable to any party to pay the price you have to pay for it. 0 Mr. President, the time has come when we should discuss this question as patriots rather than as partisans. The passions and prejudices generated by the unfortunate conflict of three score years ago have no place in the heart-they should not be permitted to becloud the intellect or distort the judgment of the men who are writing laws to govern this new Republic to-day.

New conditions teach new duties, Time makes ancient good uncouth;

They must upward. still, and onward Who would be abreast of truth.

Lo. before us gleam the camp fires ; We ourselves must pilgrims be;

Launch our Mayflower and steer boldly Through the desperate winter sea,

Nor attempt the future's portals With the past's blood-rusted key.

God Almighty never intended that the negro should share with the white man in the government of this country; and you can not improve upon the plans of God Almighty or defeat His purposes, either, by legislative enactments. Do not forget that. It matters not what I may say or others may think; it matters not what constitutions may contain or statutes provide, wherever the negro is in sufficient numbers to imperil the white man's civilization or question the white man's supremacy the white man is going to find some way around the difficulty. And that is just as true in the North as it is in the South. You need not deceive yourselves about that. The feeling against the negro in Illinois when he gets in the white man's way is quite as strong, more bitter, less regardful of the negro's feelings and conditions than it is in Mississippi. And that is true of every other Northern State. I have been all over the States of Illinois, Ohio, Iowa, Indiana, some of the Western States, and New.England States. I know the temper of the white people on this question. I had the pleasure of speaking in the city of Springfield soon after they had had a lynching fest. A negro was thought to have committed an unmentionable crime. The mob got after him. The sheriff and his friend carried the negro away in his friend's automobile. They returned, and the mob found the negro had made his escape. To wreak their vengeance upon those who undertook to uphold the law they proceeded to destroy the automobile, and they demolished the restaurant belonging to the man who had carried the negro away. A thing of that kind could hardly happen in the South.

The difference between the southern man's conduct in a matter of this character and that of the people of Illinois is this: The southern mob sometimes gets the guilty man and hangs him. In the North, if the mob finds itself unable to punish the beast who committed the outrage, they proceed to destroy property and kill everything of a dark color. 1\fr. President, I am not the negro's enemy. I know what is best for him. I think I can measure his productive capacity. I know the influences that move him. I am familiar with the currents of passion which sweep through his savage blood. I understand his hates, his jealousies, and his attachments. In a word, I think I know him as he really is. .And knowing him, I believe I know what is best for him. You can not measure the negro by the standard you would measure accurately the white man. He is different from the white man physically, morally, and mentally. The pure-blooded negro is without gratitude. He does not harbor revenge. He is not immoral-he is unmoral. I have never known one who ever felt the guilt of sin, the goading of an outraged conscience, or the binding force of a moral obligation. The pure-blooded negro reaches mental maturity soon after he passes the period of puberty. The cranial sutures become ossified by the time he reaches 20 years of age, and it is not uncommon to find one who reads fluently at 15 years of age not to know a letter in the book at the age of 25 or 30. It was this physical difference which 1\fr. Lincoln had in mind when he said:

There is a physical difference and an impassable gulf between the two races-

Lombroso, the great Italian scientist, used this language: Just at that moment when the Caucasian intellect is spreading its

wings for a more daring flight the negro closes up and comes back. No, .Mr. President, the Jaws suited for the white race are not

adaptable for the government of the negro. " The heir of all the ages in the foremost files of time~· can not progress if restrained by statutes intended for the government of the most backward and inferior of all the races of men. Nor can you by law lift the negro and hold him to the high standard which you demand that the white man live upon. As the Senator from Georgia [Mr. SMITH] said on yesterday, if the amendment

offered by the Senator from Washington be ndopted, we of the South shall be compelled to vote against the bill; not in a spirit of enmity, not in a spasm of hate, but because we know what the results will be. There will not be a Southern State that will share in the proposed benefactions of the measure. Mr. President, that Senators on the other side may get some accurate idea of the negro's industrial capacity, I want to read from a well-tempered, thoughtfully considered article written by Mr . .Alfred H. Stone, a planter in the Delta of the Mississippi. He gives his experience with the negro in the management of his Delta plantation. This experiment was fairly and honestly made. I know Mr. Stone. He is not only a man capable of understanding and developing all the possible truths involved in this experiment, but he is an honest, just, sincere man, who, I am told, always gives his negro laborers the benefit of the doubt. This will be interesting to Senators who, as I said a moment ago, look upon the negro as a "sunburned Yankee who has not been given a square deal in the race of life" :

The principal statistical features of the experiment during the fiveyear period which witnessed its beginning and its practical abandonment may be thus summarized: We brought to the plantation, at the close of the season of 18fl8, 30 new families, and began the first year 1899, with a total of 58. On 1,064 acres of cotton land we made but 459 bales of 51)0 J?Ounds average, a family average of 7.9 bales, The average price received was 7.50 cents per pound, and the entire crop cotton and seed, brought $21,G63.88, or a family average of $373.51: Of the families on the place, ... G, or 44.8 per cent, left at the end of the year. We moved in 27 families, and with the 59 which the addition gave us cultivated 1,048 acres of cotton in 1900. The crop was 817 bales, or 13.8 per family. It sold at an average price of 9.94 cents, and with its seed brought $47,541.66. This was an average cash product value of $805.79 per family. The number of families who left the place at the close of the year was 13, or 22 per cent of the total. We secured 15 new ones, and had on the place 61 families in 1901. We had this year in cotton 1,348 acres, and raised 1,270 bales-20.8 to the famiJy. At an average price of 7.90 cents for the cotton this crop. including seed, r ealized $60,742.04, being $995.77 per family. We lost 16 families this year, 26.2 per cent of the whole force, and moved in 24 new squads, which gave us 69 for 1902. '£he latter year we raised 1 131 bales of cotton on 1,341 acres. Seed and cotton brought $54,593.26, the average price of the latter being 8.08 cents per pound. '£he average product of cotton was 16.4 bales per family, the average value of cotton and seed $791.20. At the end of the year we lost 17 families, 24.6 per cent of the total, and moved in 23 for the following year. '£his gave us 75 squads for 1!)03. We cultivated 1,392 acres of cotton and raised 741 bales-9.8 to the family. This brought 11.77 cents per pound, the cotton and s~d selling for $53,527.73, or an average of $713.70 per family. At the close of the season 31 families, 41.3 per cent of our working force, left the plantation.

During the period under review the tenant system of the plantation was changed from an exclusively rent basis to just as nearly an exclusively share basis as it was possible to reduce it. In the first two years the entire plantation was in the hands of renters, while of the cotton acreage in 1903 they worked but 54.6 per· cent and produced but 45.3 per cent of the crop. This has been still further reduced, and of a total cultivated acreage of 1,577 in 1904 they worked but 465 acres, or less than 30 per cent. The number of families on the place increased from 58 to 75 during this period; the numbei' rentin!? fell from 58 to 36, a decline in per cent of the total number ft·om lOu to 48. Here, again, the renters lost still further in 1904, falling to 30 families ont of 79, a decline to less than 38 per cent of the total. In 1899 they held 73 head of work stock, 94.8 per cent of the total number on the place. This fell to 60 head in 1903, which was about 47.6 per cent of the total. Here, too, there has been another decline, the 60 in 1903 having fallen to but 23 in 1904.

But the story of the decline of the renter on Dunleith plantationof the failure to accomplish what was at least hoped fot· under t.ho system inaugurated in 1890--can not be told in any statistical display, nor can the reasons which compelled the abandonment of the expet·i· ment be set forth in a column of figures. Back of the inception of the scheme was the desire to create a satisfied and satisfactory force of reasonably permanent tenants. Not that we were ever sanguine enough to hope to have them all in this category. We would have been satis· fled with a group of 50 per cent of the total, or even with less. It was hoped to accomplish our object by a direct appeal to self-interest. We demonstrated our ability to make independent property-owning families out of poverty-stricken material. These families in turn demonstt·ated the fact of their independence by severing relations with us almost as promptly as we put them on their feet. After the termination of three years we had begun to feel reasonably certain that even the most practical appeal we could make to radically improved material welfare would be generally overcome by an apparently instinctive desire to " move." After the experience of five years we were quite satisfied of out· entire incapacity to make the average plantation negro realize the remotest causal relation between stability and prosperity.

We were not surprised to have 26 families leave us the first year, nor were we especially concerned over the departure of 13 the second. It was not alone the number who left us each year, but likewise the increasing annual drain on the property involved in their departure that forced us to realize the utter impossibility as a business proposition of continuing our general system. In operating a plantation, stock and implements rank with labor as necessary complements. A cardinal feature of our plan involved the placing of the first two essentials In the hands of the latter. If the labor could be depended upon to remain on the property under normal conditions a reasonable average length of time, this resuJt would of course have been merely incidental to a successful conclusion of the experiment. If, however, the laborers proved conclusively that they could not be so depended upon, then to hnve continued to put the business at their mercy by giving them control over everything necessary to its conduct would have been extending a foolhardy invitation to ultimate disaster. It is bad enough to have to face a general exodus of labor, but such a contingency becomes doubly serious when it involves the loss of stock and implements as well. There are on the plantation to-day but two head of work stock that were there in 1899. What bas transpired gradually, and without sel'i-~¥:as~~~~;q~~~~1~s, m~tf~t we:s~fto~!d'e t~~cu;~~~is1~lo~ ~~ng!ioJea:;Y wf~~ labor to proceed far enough. I wish it understood that not the slightest

•

1914.: CONGRESS! ON AL RECORD-SEN ATE~ 3039 obstacle is placed in the way of a tenant's acqmrmg implements and stock, but also that we no longer sell him these things on long time, nor do we otherwise personally encourage their purcllase. We simply endeavor to fill the place of each departing renter with a share band and try to confine such renting as we are compelled to do to such as come to us with stock of tlleir own. In shol"t, we are no longel" engaged in the altruistic enterprise of converting shiftless and emptyhanded negl"oes into desirable and well-equipped tenants for the temporary benefit of other planters.

From 1899 to 1903, leaving out of consideration the 30 new familles brought in at the beginning of the former year, we moved in 124 families . In the same period we lost 103. Of the 79 families on the place in 1904, but 8 were with us in 1899. Of the 103 who have left, some with little, some with much, not one has become an owner of land. Most ha\c simply continued as tenants elsewhere. Many have lost what they carried away and have become share hands on other plantations. Some have dropped into the ranks of day laborers. A few have drifted into towns. Let me illustrate one of these removals. In December, 1900, we moved in a crew of seven people. They all repr!.'sented themselves as work-ing hands, though one of the men was over 65, with a wife past GO. Their entire outfit consisted of a bor·se, worth at a liberal valuation $50, and $58 worth of miscellaneous and indescribable household etiects. In necember, 1903, while riding over the place one day, my attention was arrested by a procession slowly appl·oaching me. It consisted partly of two wagons, one buggy, two mules, one horse, three cows, two calves, and five dogs, the property of this same crew of seven. In addition they bad with them outside wagons enough to assist them in hauling away 285 bushels of corn, 1t100 worth of household efl'ects (including a sewing machine for each woman and a gun for each man), and a half dozen crates of hogs and several of poultry. During the three years they bad paid rent and accounts amounting to $4,1G8.9G, had received in cash $747.85, and had cash paid for help in theh· crops to the amount of $303.DO. 'l'heir accounts, of course, included a vadety of 8urchases In addltion to their living expenses. 'l'hey carried awa;v $1,1 0 worth oi personal property. They left to get rid of the super-v1sion incident to plantation management, and removed a short distance to the property of a nonresident, :md seC'llred their advances from a merchant. In November last I learned that the bead of the squad had applied to a neighboring planter for a location for 1905 and wanted the latter to lift a debt of $1,000 for him.

Mr. President, I hnve read at length for tile purpose of showing the gentlemen who manifest such profound concern for the material advancement of the negro, and I want to s::ty-

Mr. Sl\IITH of Michigan. Mr. President--Mr. V ARDAJ\1.AN. I will yield to the Senator in a moment.

I want to say that this is not an exception. The people whom this author has de cribed are not exceptions to tile rule; they are the rule, and as they manage their private affairs, so would they us~ the public funds, so wlll they at all times perform official functions. Shiftless, unsteady, improvident, nomadic, utterly unreliable, as incapable of consecutive thought pertinacity of purpose, calm, conservative, sequential action as a vagrant star that floats upon the deep bo ·om of the night-if left to them to carry out tile provisions of this bill, it would be a great disappointment even to you gentlemen who insist upon it.

Mr. SMITH of Michigan. Mr. President, I did not understand the Senator from Mississippi. Did the Stone quotation, which the Senator has just made, refer to the colored tenant farmer in Mississippi?

Mr. V .ARD.Ab!AN. Yes, sir. Now, to contrast so that Senators may understand the differ

ence between the white man and tile negro as a laborer, I want to call their attention to some experiments tllat were made in that same county with Italians, who did not know when the crop was planted the difference between a cotton stalk and a cocklebur. They were brought over there and put to work on a dead leYel with the negro, and here are some of the results of their labor. I quote from the same author, Mr. Stone:

I shall consider only the cash commodities of cotton and seed, and shall reduce the figures to annual averages.

This gives us the following results: .Average number of squads, Italians 52, negroes 167; average number of working bands, Italians 2GO, negroes 433; average number of acres per working band~_ Italians 6.2, neA"roes !}.1 ; average pounds of lint per band, Italians 2,584, negroes 1,174; average pounds of lint per acre, Italians 403, negroes 233; average ca!':h product per band (cotton and seed), Italians $277.3G, ne:rroes $128.47; average cash product value per acre, Italians $44.77, negroes 26.36. Thus the Italian is seen to have produced more lint per b:md by 1,4:10 pounds, or 120.1 per cent, and to have exceeded the negro's yield per a<'re bv 170 pounds, or 72.9 per cent. The difference in money 'lalue in fa-vor of the Italian was $148.89 per band, or 115.8 per !.'ent, and $18.41 per acre, or 69.8 per cent.

I have simply called attention to this, Mr. President, in order that Senators may understand that there is a difference in races deeper than color or external appearance, and you can not change that difference, or by any kind of legislation impart to the negro superior qualities which God Almighty did not give him in the beginning. As I said a moment ago, there has been much talk indulged in about "his oppression.'' The negro started life with equal opportunity with the Caucasian. Neither had anything to borrow from or to lend to the other. The white man evolved the civilization that glorifies the beginning of the twentieth century. "It was the wings of his own spirit that bore him aloft "-the qualities within rather than the influences from without enabled the white man to attain the' superb eminence which he now enjoys. The negro remained stationary. If you would have the negro progress, if you would promote

his. material interests by legislation, I submit to you that the best way to do it is ·to bring about cordial cooperation, invoke the assistance of the white man. You can not do it in any other way. It is true in the North, it is true in the South, it is true in the Enst. it is true in the West.

Mr. CLAPP. "\\Till the Senator pardon an interruption? Mr. V .A.RDAM.A.N. Yes, sir; with pleasure. Mr. CL.~PP. I think we have drifted far amain in this dis

cussion and that much of it is not rele-vant; but the Senate is anxious to get through with the bill, and much that the Senator from Mississippi has snid I shall not reply to to-day. The occasion, however, seems to require that I shall do so later. There are several deductions which the Senator has drawn which I shall discuss, -nnd I would not want my silence to-day to be taken as an acquiescence in the deductions which the Senator has made.

Mr. V .ARD.AMAN. I did not flatter myself by thinking that my friend the Senn.tor from Uinnesota would agree with me now, but I do indulge the hope that time, as it courses onward, may unroll to his mind the essential truth which may lead him out of the wilderness and that .he will come to see this question in its naked enormity.

Mr. CLAPP. What I was going to suggest to tile Senator \vas that he does not seem to take into account in this discussion the difference between tile African uegro and that Iarg2 body of people in this country, many of whom have even more Anglo-Saxon blood in tllelll than they have of .African blood, and yet are clllssed in this general and somewhat indifferent manner as negroes.

Mr. V .A.RDAMAN. I would suggest to the Senator that in his State, I think, 50 per cent of the negro population have, probably, more white blood in tllem than they have negro blood. In the Northeastern States-in l\Iassachusetts, for instancetilere are nbout 36 or 38 per cent of the negroes who are mulattoes or a little bit more white; in Mississippi only about 11. per cent .of the negro population have any white blood in them at all; and in Georgia and South Carolina, I think, it is about 9 per cent; but I want to say to the Senator that the same racial characteristics c.ontrol both classes. There is very little difference. The mulatto usually inherits the vices of both the moiher and father. He has the characteristics of the hybrid and the debased nature of the mongrel. Of course, there arc exceptions-freaks of the race--some remarkable men lla.ve been the products of hybridization, but tlley are very few in number, and count for but little in making up the general average of the race.

:r.1r. CLAPP. That may oe true in the South, but, rejoining to the Senator ns the Senator has so often to us, I claim a more intimate knowledge of the situation in my State than tlle Senator from .Mississippi can have of the situation lliere; and the situntion which he depicts as to his State does not apply to the colored people of my St..'1te.

Mr. V ARDAl\.LA...,..~. As a matter of fact, if the Senato.r will pardon me--

Mr. CLAPP. I ask the Senator's pardon for interrupting him. Mr. V .ARDAMA.N. I do not .at all object to being interrupted

by the Senator from Minnesota. He is always courteous and agreeable. But I want to say to the Senator that the negroes in .his State, as .a race, have increased in crime, and the pere::ntage of crime among them as a race in his State to-day is greater than it was 20 years ago.

Mr. CLAPP. Well, ~lr. President, I would very seriously question that statement.

1\lr. V .ARD..UI.A ... r. I can only speak in the language of the statisticians, and men who live north of Mason and Dixon's line are the men who gathered the statistics; and I am sure they did not doctor the :figures to the detriment of the negro.

Mr. CLA.PP. Yes; that is the trouble with an argument that drifts from tlle issue. I do not want to take the time now to discuss the value of statistics. You could prove by statistics that foreigners commit the crime in this country, when those of us who have been prosecuting officers know from our experience that they do not. The man lacking in familiarity with our laws and our customs and not having .our ability to employ couns~l is arrested for something, railroaded through court, and then he figures in statistics as a criminal, whlle the shrewd Yankee, familiar with the law. having political influence, and possessed of menus, gets off; and then, lo and behold! statistics show one thing, while facts show another.

Mr. V .ARD.Al\IAl~. If the :senator from Minnesota will take the trouble to send to the Congressional Library and get the works of .Mr. Williatn F. Willcox, a member of the faculty of Cornell or Columbia. Unhersity, on the Criminality of the Nc;;ro, he will find that my statement is correct.

3040 CONGRESS! ON ~L _EE_CORD_- _SEN ATE. FEBRUARY 6,

Mr. CLAPP. As I said, I want to leave the last word with the Senl).tor from Mississippi. I simply want to say that I am not at this timo disposed, and I do not think I ought, to take the time to follow the discussion, but I do not want my silence to be taken as acquiescence in the deductions made by the Senator.

Mr. VARDAMAN. I do not think that anybody would think that; I am very sorry that the1.·e is not some foundation for such a suspicion; but I want to say, Mr. President, I agree with the Senator that the negro has progressed mentally. He is, as I said a moment ago, reducing the percentage of illiteracy between 10 and 12 per cent every decade. A larger majority of the young negroes in Mississippi can read. We are furnishing them schools which run from four to nine months in the year, and the white man pays the bill. As I said here on the floor yesterday, the negro has had opportunity that was never before afforded to an inferior race at somebody else's expense; he is acquiring property. But this progress is not making a better citizen of him. You can not understand it, but I tell you in all solemn candor he is a thousand times more criminal to-day as a race than h~ was in 1861.

There never was a more faithful, trustworthy protector of the southern "White woman, or white womanhood anywhere, than was the old slave during the war and immediately following ; and it is a startling fact that I am going to announce at this moment that every white woman in the black belt of the South to-day is living in a state of siege. Th~ sons of -those faithful, well-behaved servants-or slaves, if you prefer-with all of their superior schoolbook learning and improved opportunites, have become the rapist and the robber. The care, the protection, the safeguards that are thrown around the white women are a thousand times more rigid-greater vigilance is kept than were thrown around our mothers 100 years ago on the frontiers, where the wild man and the wild beasts roamed at will. These are fac.ts, and you can not deny them. The Senator from Minnesota can not understand that; but if he should live in the black belt of the South for a little while-if his wife and daughters could live there, they would soon feel the dampening effect of that black cloud of peril which hovers over the devoted head of every white girl and woman in the South to-day.

No; I am not an enemy to the negro; I want to educnte him-or rather train him-along proper lines; I want to train him in a way that we may improve his hand and educate his heart; I want to build, if possible, a moral substratum upon which to rear this mental superstructure; but if that is not done, with his ideas of morality, or as Froude, the historian, would put it, his ideas of "unmorality "-when you enhance his mentality without building this moral substratnm, upon which it is to rest, you simply increase his capacity for harm. Your education will only serve to make a less desirable citizen.

I want, first, to build the foundation. The white man and the negro of the South are not enemies. They may be made so if you continue to insist on trying to bring them into abnormal relationship. The relations that existed between them before and immediately succeeding the war was akin to that of father and son. My recollections of the black folk on the farm during my boyhood are among the pleasant memories of my life. The negroes in Mississippi k"Tiow that I am not their enemy. I would not p~rmit them to vote, but I would protect them in the enjoyment of their life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness and the product of their toil. And if the white people of the South are permitted to proceed along proper rational lines, knowing and recognizing the negr<>'s inferiority, desiring, however, his betterment; if they are permitted to work out, although handicapped, as they are, with laws which were conceived in hatred and brought forth in a spasm of venom and revenge-if they are permitted to do it, Mr. President, in their own proper way, very much more progress will be made for the negro's uplifting, for the negro's improvement than will be made if it shall be directed by men who do not know any more about it personally than I do about the political economy of the planet 1\fars.

Mr. SHERl\IAN. Mr. President, to recur to the subject matter before the Senate, I venture to say that the amendment offered by the Senator from .Washington [Mr. JoNES], as I understand, would accomplish the purposes sincerely desired by the Senator from Mississippi [Mr. VARDAMAN]. It is not unusual for men who agree as to the ends to be attained to differ from each other as to the means of accomplishing those ends. We find ourselves in that condition to-day.

I would not add to the difficulties of those who are carrying the burden alluded to by the Senator from Mississippi. If I had any prejudices, I would lay aside .:!Very one of them in order to help. I believe, without any regard to the mere geographical residence of any Member of this bOdy, that we ought earnestly to join with our friends who .have a very large

• percentage of negro population to produce the best possible results in bringing about their advancement and in making them fit to carry the burdens incident to American civilization.

I know that the emancipator is quoted as to almost everything nowadays. Lincoln has been quoted as authority almost as often to support many economic fallacies as he has in the matter of the liberation of the slaves, and men have indulged in surmise as to what he would do if he were present on earth now. He said at Charleston, Ill., substantially what the Senator from Mississippi quoted, but he said more. He said:

Because I do not want the black woman for my wife, it does not necessarily follow that I. therefore want her for my slave.

Speaking in 1858, be said : I do not believe in admitting the negro to the rights of citizenship

so that be may serve on juries, that he may bold public office, and that he may engage in such govemmental action as his white master.

In the same year, in the same course of debates, he said that he was not endeavoring to interfere with slavery in the locality where it then existed. He wished to confine it to the territory where it was found, where wise limitation had left it, where the fathers intended, because of its being a local institution, that it should remain. He protested against its npread, against various acts of legislation that came from the Congress of the United States, against various decisions of courts, local and otherwise, against various efforts made to make free soil in the West and the Northwest additional territory in which this local institution should be allowed not only to be planted but to spread, making the Kansas and Nebraska territory the vantage point from which future efforts should be made to carry it still farther forward to the P aci fie coast.

He believed in confining the institution at that time, in 1858, where it then was; he believed at that time what the Senator from Mississippi has quoted from his Charleston (Ill.) speech. In less, though, than five years from that time he wrote a proclamation that literally destroyed the local institution wherever it existed. If he changed his opinion on one-

Mr. V ARDAl\.IAN. Will the Senator yield for a question? Mr. SHEllMAN. With the greatest pleasure. Mr. V .ARDMIAN. The Senator do~s not seriously announce

that Abraham Lincoln ever favored social and political equality between the negro and the white race, does he?

Mr. SHER:\IAN. Not social equality; no, sir; he did not. Mr. V .A.TIDA.MAN. I beg the Senator's pardon; but up to the

very time of Mr. Lincoln's death he told the negroes who came to him here iu Washington, "You will not be permitted to share in the government of this country, and I am not prepared to say that you ought to be, if I bad the power to give you that right."

He said further : " The shackles of slavery will be stricken from your aTms. You, the educated and more fortunate members of your race, take the others and go to some country"-his idea was the same that Jefferson's was-" and there work out your own salvation." I do not pretend to quote Mr. Lincoln literally. Th~ great desire of his patriotic heart was that the friction might be avoided by deportation.

Mr. SHERMAN. Mr. President, there is no controversy between the Senator and myself on this phase of the racial question. I do not think at any time any declarations were made which can be authenticated by documentary evidence, historic or otherwise, in which Lincoln contended that there ought to be social equality of the two races living side by side.

Mr. VARDAMAN. Mr. President, I beg the Senator's par. don, but Lincoln always used the words "social and political

. equality." I have made a very careful study of Mr. Lincoln's ideas on this question, and I have said often, and I repeat here, that my views and his on the race question are substantially identical. He bad a vision; · he saw the end; and, next to Thomas Jefferson, I think Abraham Lincoln understood the race · question better than any man :41 his day living north of Mason and Dixon's line.

Mr. SHERMAN. I do not wish, Mr. President, to go into this at length, but I restate, in order that we may understand each other, that there is no controversy as to Lincoln's views on the social equality of the two races. There is a controversy as to the other matter. I do not agree at all that in latter days Lincoln disclaimed political equality. I think, on the contrary, evidence is accessible to show that he believed in latter days thnt some degree of political equality was inevitable. Whether he believed in the full extension of that equality in accordance with the fifteenth amendment as it was adopted js open to question.

As has been said by a Senator on the floor-! think it was the Senator ' from New H:ampshire [Mr. GALLINGER], but possibly it was some other Senator-it might ,be questionable whether· the fifte_enth amendment, coming at the time it did and putting

•

1914 .. CONGRESS! ON AL RECORD-SEN ATE: 3041 political rights in the hands of a great number of persons of no experience and education, might not have been too great · an ad,·ance at that time; that some degree of preparation could well, from a governmental point of view, have been had prior to the vesting of this right. The thirteenth amendment was adopted in 1865; the fourteenth amendment· was adopted on July 21, 1868, and the fifteenth amendment in 1869. Of course the authority alluded to passed away in April, 1865, so that it was not given to him to give expression to his views at that time.

What I want to do, if such a hope may be properly indulged in by me, is to be of some service in helping do some good, at le~st. in this matter. It is a vexed one. Political equality is something that I am not wishing to discuss at this time; I shall not go into it, and I hope it will never be necessary to go into it at all in this Chamber. We have radically different views on that question. They may arise from our environment; they may arise from our different methods of thought or from the different views we take of the governmental possibilities of two diverse races living in constant contact with each other. especially where the relation of master and servant once existed and bad been rudely and suddenly severed by the result of the Civil War.

T11ese are matters which I believe men of my generation rather than to take them up in a spirit of prejudice should tnJ;e them up as dispassionately as possible, so that all the area which at one time suffered a very great readjustment of values consequent upon the immense loss of property might be in some degree improved, if possible, by legislation wherever it can be done.

I never go over any of the 11 States that unfortunately undertook to set up a separate government without a feeling of sadness. Every battle field, every old chimney standing, eyery ruined or abandoned plantation, and e-very statistic of life and property lost is only a further evidence of the immense wave that the American race had to encounter before it settled, as far as legislation and war can settle, these controversies. This problem is something that the men of our generation have inherited from our predecessors, and I think if anything can be done in a spirit of dispassionnte discussion toward its settlement it ought to be done. I believe all-at least nearly all of us. and I hope all of us-feel that way about it.

lt is true when that question is raised between the two race.:; living side IJy side the same results usually follow. I have never been one of the men living in a Northern State who ba:o; pointed with indignation to the men of my own blood who by Yiolent means baye meted out such rude justice on the spot as tlley thought commensurate with the offenses which they took it for granted had been committed. I think if the two races living side by side in equal numbers in any part of the country had presented to them the same question the same inevitable result would follow when lawless instincts are aroused. At no time have I eyer indulged in criticism of one section more than another because of the numerous cases of lynching that have occurred in various parts of the Union. All are reprehensible in t.be highest degree.

There are about 120,000 negroes living in my State, and approximately 40,000 of them are Yoters. The larger part of them are found in the cities nnd are classified under the bend of "urban population" in the census reports. 1\lany of them are from AJabamn and Mississippi, coming. by way of St. Louis, up the Mississippi Valley on the railroads, which make our portion of the counh·y easily accessible to them. In a smaller way, but not in a detailed way, I am sure, we have to a certain degree some of the same questions to which the Senator from Mississippi alludes. When he states the immense burden that the white man is c..'l.rrying in Mississippi and elsewhere where the circumstances are similar I can not fail to have with him a certain sympathy, not perhaps in the extreme degree to which he manifests it in stating his argument here, but in some degree, at least, I feel his difficulty and the difficulty of others situated in like manner and in similar surroundings in trying to soh·e some of these questions in justice to all.

In my home city, it is true, as the Senator from M:ississiPT>i has said, a riot occurred, and for two whole days and nights the authorities were helpless. The same question arose that often arises where there is a numerous negro population in the Southern States. It was suspected that an outrage had been committed. It was afterwards ascertained that this was wholly erroneous and that there was no outrage then committed in the cHy of Springfield, although it was thought at the time that there hnd been. Conclusive evidence was produced by medical authority that it could not have occurred and did not occur.

Mr. V ARDA.l\IAN. But the fact that the mob acted as it did only goes to show how easily race prejudice is inflamed and to

what extreme white men will go in such cases, regardless ol the geography of their residence. It is the race instinct which has been in all the ages of the world so potential in preserving the purity of the Anglo-Saxon.

1\.Ir. SHERMAN. I do not think there is any difference in locality. They are all alike. I have not any doubt about it. I know they are just the same in my part of the country as they are in other places across the Ohio River. It took 4,000 troops, that cordoned and guarded the city of Springfield for a week, to reduce society to its normal state, but it was done. Several men were killed, and several men went to the hospital; but order was restored, and it was found when men recovered theil· senses that no outrage had been committed by anybody, as suspected at first.

I am only stating this by way of explanation, and not at all as a matter of pride. Nobody regrets the occurrence more than myself. It happened in my home town, where it was given very wide publicity throughout the United States, and very unpleasant notoriety at that; but it occurred. It occurred at Charleston, Til., and the same thing has occurred in various Northern States. The Senator from Mississippi and I can have no controversy on the result when the same lawless causes present themselYes in any part of the United States. It is possible that it might be more restrained by the authorities in some places than in others. That depends entirely upon the strength of the local government

Mr. VARDAMAN. Mr. President, I desire to assure the Senator that my reference to the occurrence in Springfield was not made in any censorious or unfriendly spirit whatever.

.M:r. SHERMAN. I understand that. Mr. "VARDAMAN. I bad the misfortune to have several

similar occurrences of that k"ind in my State when I was governor.

In the city of Jackson, the capital of the State, where an outrage was perpetrated and the community, of course, was very much incensed, I was fortunate in being able to control the mob. We made a very careful search of the city that night for the perpetrator of the crime. A great many arrests were made. The homes of a great many negroes were visited, and the suspects were put in' jail. In the morning, when I returned to the executive mansion r.fter having been in my saddle all night, a messenger came to announce that a mob had assembled at the jan and that they were battering down the door. I made my way there, and when I reached the jail they had broken the lock on the door and gotten the man out. They had a rope, and they were yelling, "Crucify him! Hang him! " I dismounted from my horse, took the man away from the mob, and put him back in jail. I succeeded in dispersing the mob without calling even a policeman to my assistance. I had the negro tried. He was tried by a court and a jury of 12 white men in the following summer, and he was acquitted. He happened not to be guilty.

I mention tills merely to show you that the spirit of hostility to the negro in the South is not so intense and so bitter as certain gentlemen would have you believe; that really there is a kindly feeling. Sometimes they catch the man who commits an outrage and they hang him; but they do not molest any other members of the race, nor do they interfere with their usual vocations nor destroy their property. That only goes to show, and it was my only purpose in referring to the incident, that where you had to call out 4,000 State troops to quell the riot, I alone, the governor of the State, went there and took the man from the mob and put him back into jail and protected him until I found out that he was not guilty, and then be was acquitted and went his way.

Mr. Sl\'IITH of Michigan. Mr. President, will the Senator from Illinois permit me to ask the Senator from Mississippi a question?

l\Ir. SHERMAN. Certainly. Mr. Sl\IITH of 1\ficbigan. I listened very attentively to the

remarks of the 3cnator from Mississippi, but I must confess I was somewhat shocked by the statement he made that the condition of the negro in the South is largely due to unwise laws that were conceived in prejudice, and I think be said--

l\Ir. V ARDAMA.l~. I beg the Senator's pardon; I did not say that.

1\Ir. SMITH of Michigan. Perhaps I did not catch the Sena· tor's language. I want to be correct about it

l\Ir. VARDAMAN. No; the Senator did riot catch it. I said we were trying to work out the negro's salvation; we were trying to improve his condition; we were h·ying to solve this question as best we could, handicapped by a law-and I referred to the fifteenth amendment-which I said was conceived in a spirit of hate, generated by the conflict between the sections,' and brought forth in a spasm of venom and revenge, not to

3042 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. FEBRUARY 6,,

benefit the negro, as you know, but to pnnish the southern white l1lllll for the rebellion. I did not refer to laws made here.

Mr. SMITH of 1\.Iichlgan. Of course the Senator from Mississippi understands that I would not put him in a wrong light. I thought I und.erstood the ·senator correctly. His statement was not s.pecific, but I anticipated he was aiming at the fifteenth amendment to -the Constitution.

Mr. SHEllMAN. Where these outrages oceur, the larger the city the gre· ter the difficulty of quelling the resulting disturbance that always occurs. A large part of it, when it is started, comes from the lawless element that gathers as a fringe on eycry mob. The members of that element bave no purpose whatever to serve except to promote disorder, to destroy life, to burn the town, to ruin property as much as possible. There is a. spirit of loot that is released whenever an occasion of this kind offers itself. The bonds of civilized society ·seem to be temvorarily dissolved~ and then nothing but martial law restores a. condition of order.

In three cases of whieh l have known and which I have lived thi·ough that has been done locally. Order has been restored by calling out the National Guard where violence ha.:s occurred, and \ ery often it has been done by the use of loaded guns. In the ca. e of the Springfield mob it took loaded guns to disperse some 1,800 men, as nearly ns we eould cotmt them, who were very r~solute in their luwlt>&>'"'lless; but it was done. This, however, diJ not immediately grow out of the controversy that ~me from the supposed outrage. It came from the lawless element that is incident to a. city of any size after it pa~ses a population of twenty-five or thirty thousand.

'l'o resume the discussion of the main question, :r want to be just as hrief as I can. I am quite certain we all realize the difficulties. Pos ibly I and others who live in my latitude do not realize them so acutely as do the gentlemen from the different States farther south. What provoked my interest in this matter yesterday was the fact that certain Senators seemed to say that because they were constantly .surrounded by these questions they were better .adapted to settle them, and in one or two cases it seemed to me it was rather suggested that because of their superiot· means of knowledge their opinions should not be criticized. It was not put in ·words in just that way, but l gained that "impression from the general oir of the statement. Perhaps l was not entirely justified. That, however, is what led me to intervene as I did and as I shall now.

I will concede -a great deal to those who are facing this problem. We hu-ve some of it in the territory where negroes are domiciled in my own pa:rt of the country. We have in my horne town about 6.000 negroes. They are largely quartered in one place, as is often the caSe not only in Northern but in Southern States. The political question, however, has nothing to do with the economic question. and I do not wish to discuss it any .more than is really necessary to repel any ,auggestions tho t have been made. I do not care for the political end of it.

l\Ir. SIMMONS. Mr. President--The VICE PRESIDENT. Does the Senator from Illinois

yield to tile Senator from North Carolina.? l\Ir. SRERl\IAl~. Yes. 1\Ir. SIMl\IONS. I am very glad to hear the Senator rn.a.ke

tilat stn.tement. I have been listening to this discussion foT some time, and it has eemed to me that we have covered a very wide "field in the discussion. lt certainly is not a question of social equality. It certainly is not a. question of political equality. It is a question of economic equality that l think is of tile most interest here, and that is what I understand the Senator now to say.

If the Senator will pardon me for just a mament, I suppose hardly .any of us here entertain the idea of social equality. We differ somewhat about the question of political equality-that is, the South has one view of the capacity of the colored man to participate in government except as he may educate himself and make himself capable, and the North has a different view of that question. That, however, is not what we are discUBsing here to--doy. The question before us, as 1 understand, is whether the particular bill now pending before the Senate will, in its practical wo1·kings, do an injustice to the colored m..'lll and be a discrimination against him in his economic relation to the balance of the populaton of the country.

Briefly, I do not think there is .much differenee between any of us about that question. I think both the people of the South and the people of the North feel that in the matter of working out his destiny .here the colored man ought to have an opportunity, like any other man, to better his condition in life. I am certain tllat is the feeling in the South. Whatever .may be the feeling in the South about social equality or political equality~ I nm certain there is but one sentiment there on the eoonomic question, and that sentiment is that in the race of life

the -colored man is entitled to an equal opportunity with the whit-e man, and that his rights ought not to be abridged or denied him wherever the question is that of making a living for himself and his family.

In the matter of education, in my State, and, I think, in most of the Southern States, we try to be just to the colored man. It is true that as a matter of fact we do not give him per capita the same amount for the education of his children that we give per capita. for the education of tile white children; but I think if the Senator will investigate tile matter he will find that in nearly all of the Southern States we have practically the same school term for tile colored children as for the white children. There is not a single school district in my State that has not both a colored school and a white school, and I think I am safe in saying that tilere is not a single school district in my State where the school term of the colored children is not just the same us the school te.rm of tile white children. That is, we give them the same number of days in their chools that we give the white children, and we divide the fund upon that basis. That is the equitable basis, because it does cost a little bit more to educate the white child than it does to eclu<!ate the black child.

The same rule is carried out, I think, with reference to our State institutions. We haye oar colored normal school and we have our white normal school. We have our colored agricultural and mechanical school and we have our white agricultural and mechanical school. We divide our school fund upon that basis, and I think the proportion of colored children in my State who are enrolled in the schools to-day is equal to that of the white children who are enrolled in the schools to-day. The only difference between our treatment of the colored children and the white children in reference to schools and that of the State of the Senator from Illinois-because I have talked with .him about the subject to-day-is that in Illinois there are no separate schools for the colored children. They all go to the same schools. lf the fund we are talking about were to go to the agricul

tural and mechanical colleges there would be some foundation for the claim that there ought to be a. division of it so that the colored agricultural and mechanical college would get its reasonable proportion of it and the white agricultural and mechanical college would get its proportional part of it. Thn.t, however, is not the purpose of the bill. There is not a. dollar appropriated in the bill that is to be expended in the education of the colored students in the colored agricultural and mechanical college or the white students in the white agricultural and mechanical college. You can not, therefore, segregate it in that way. This fund is for the sole and exclusive purpose of currying farm-demonstration work to the farmers in the different sections of the country. Of course in tilat statement I am leaving out the provision of the bill with .reference to the distribution of literature. I am speaking about the part of the fund which is to be devoted to demonstration work. Practically all of it, I think all except 5 per cent, is to be devoted to demonstration work.

The question is, How is the fund to be devoted to demonstration work to be controlled? Is it to be controlled so as to establish two systems of demonstration in the State--one under tile control of the colored college for the colored farmer, and one under the -control of the white college for the white farmer? I think if .SenatOTs will look at the .matter in that light-and that i.s the practical way to look at it-tiley will see that it would not be practical, it would not be good economy, it would not be a wise method of distributing this fund and dividing this work to -establish two systems of demonstration in the severn! States. If that is not apparent upon the most casual consideration, an analysis of the actual farm situation in the sections of the country where the two races are found together, as they are in the South, will show that that would be an imprnoticable, unwise, and uneconomic method of distributing and mnnaging this fund.

Take the ordinary farm in the South. As I stated here the other day, we have not yet gotten away from the big plantations in the South. Before the war we had these big slave plantations in the sections of the country where the negroes mostly, now reside. They have not been broken up. They have not been subdivided into small fa.nns. That is a. great misfortune. It has been a. great handicap to the South. The sooner tiley ru·e divided the better it will be for ns-the better for the white man and the better for the colored man.

As long as they are kept together as they are now and rented out as they are now you will .find on every big farm in the South probably an equal number of white tellllnts and of colored tenants. Sometimes, and in many sections of the .State, the colored tenants will predominate, but yon can find u number of white tenants U];)on every one of those large ·farms~

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. 3043 Would any practical man seeking to carry information to

the small tenant farmers upon a big farm, we will say, of 5,000 acres, one-half colored men and one-half white men, employ two demonstrators, one a white demonstrator and one a black demonstrntor, and have the white demonstrator go there and demonstrate to the colored tenants, and have the colored demonstrator go there and demonstrate to the white tenants?

Leaving out the segregation of farms and bringing the farms of a community or of a township together, you may have 15 or 20 of these large farms in one township. One demonstrator· can do the entire work for that township. One demonstrator now is doing the entire work in the largest counties in my State. U you segregate this work and give one-half of it to the colored college and one-half of it to the white college or divide it according to colored and white population, each employing a demonstrator of its own race, in the particular township or commtiDity where you have a dozen farms divided up between white tenants and black tenants you have one demonstrator going there one day to demonstrate to the colored man and another demonstrator going there the next day to demonstrate to tha white man. Is it not very much better to put this fund under the control of the colleges and let them select the demonstrators?

The Senator has said that in his State there are 120,000 col-ored voters.

Mr. SHERMA.l~. No; that is the colored population. Mr. Sll\1MONS. I thought the Senator said " voters." Mr. SHEllMAN. No. We have approximately 120,000 col-

ored population. • _ Mr. SIMMONS. I thought 120,000 was a very large number

of yoters. Does the Senator believe it would be wise in his State to appoint .colored demonstrators on account of the fact that he has this colored population there? Does the Senator really belie\e the colored man has advanced to such a stage of knowledge with reference to agriculture that it would be wise to appoint a colored demonstrator in a county in his State for the white man and for the black man, both together? Does he not think it would be better in his State to appoint white demonsh·ators?

I ask the Senator that question in all candor and frankness. I have- no prejudice about it. I do not want this great bill, which I believe is of immense importance to the farmers of this country, handicapped by an unwise and an uneconomic provision, a provision that would result in a division of this fund that in my judgment would make it ineffective. I do not want to see that done.

I do not think this race argument is necessary. I think we have strayed far afield in injecting it into this question. I do not think in my State it would be wise to appoint a colored demonstrator in one county, because he would necessarily come into contact with the white farmer, and I do not think the white farmer would think himself benefited by such information as he could get from the colored demonstrator.

Mr. VARDAMAN. Mr. President--The VICID PRESIDENT. Does the Senator from illinois

yield to the Senator from Mississippi? Mr. SHERMAN. I do. Mr. VARDAMAN. I simply wish to beg the pardon of the

Senator from North Carolina for not getting instructions as to the course I should have pursued in my remarks.

Mr. SIMMONS. Why, Mr. President, I am not in any way reflecting upon the course the Senator from Mississippi has pursued in the argument. I am trying to present this matter in the way it occurs to me. I think the practical question we are dealing with, and the only question we are dealing with, is whether, in a community about equally divided between white farmers and colored farmers, we ought to divide this fund and appoint one colored demonstrator and one white demonstrator. That is what it seems to me it would lead to if we are to divide the fund between the two colleges of a State where there is a white agricultural and mechanical college and a colored agricultural and mechanical college.

That is the only ide.fl I wished to inject into the speech of the . Senator; and I wanted to ask him whether or not he thought that would be a wise thing to do.

Mr. SHERMAN. Mr. President, I quite agree with the Senator from North Carolina as to the irrele>ancy of much that has come in; but the responsibility is about equally divided between the two sides of the Chamber. It is almost impossible sometimes to discuss anything that raises the question even incidentally, without traversing much of this territory. I do not know that it is time lost, because there is about so much of it that has to come out anyhow, and the sooner it comes out the better.

The real question here on this amendment is whether, when we make the appropriation, we ought not to gi\e directions to

the hand that holds the purse. That is a wise precaution that it is sought to place in the bill by the amendment offered by the Senator from Washington [Mr. JoNES]. After it has once passed beyond the stage of a bill and is a statute, and the appropriation has become available, it will be too late. So, incidentally, it is of some importance here; and I can understand readily how the discussion drifted into the phase of whether the different State authorities, legislative or otherwise, can be trusted to take this money coming from Federal sources and apply it wisely and justly in all of the States of the Union, unless there is some sort of protection such as is contained 1n this amendment.

The question is asked here whether two demonstrators · in agricultural extension work could go out into the field and give the necessary insh·uction without a waste of money; whether it is not a waste of money to double the force, and thereby impliedly double the expense.

I would rather waste money than do an injustice, even though it be public money. I would rather waste some dollars for some years than fail to do all that can be done for an element of our population that needs this assistance much more than the white man needs it. Here we are self-helping. The white man takes care of himself.

Mr. SIMMONS. Mr. President, does not the Senator think that if the demonstrator were a white man he woulc.....,be as much interested in instructing the colored tenants as to the best meth6ds of farming as he would in instructing the white tenants? The Senator from Georgia made it very clear yesterday, in his very forceful ru.·gnment, that the returns to the landowner, where the tenant system prevailed, depended absolutely upon what the tenant was able to dig out of the land, whether he was a white tenant or a black tenant. The landowners in the South are just as much interested in the black tenant cultivating his land so as to get the best results out of it as in the white tenant cultivating his land so as to get the best results out of it, because the rent of the landowner depends upon the yield of the crop, whether that crop is cultivated by a black man or a white man. So the white people, who own the bulk of the land, are just as much interested in having the colored farmer properly instructed in the rudiments and in the science of agriculture a,s they are in having the white man who tills the soil instructed in the same way. That being so, if the white man controls this fund, will he not have the same interest to instruct the colored farmer that he will have to instruct the white farmer? Where is the foundation of the Senator's fear that the colored farmer will not be given an equal opportunity for instruction under a white demonstrator that would be given him under a colored demonstrator?

Mr. SHERMAN. That, of course, led to the original introduction of the irrelevant matter.

Mr. SMITH of Michigan. Will the Senator from Illinois yield to me for a moment?

Mr. SHERMAN. Certainly. Mr. SMITH of 1\fichigan. The Senator from North Carolina

has spoken of the colored land tenant. Mr. SIMMONS. Yes; we have more of those than we have

of negroes who own land, but we have a good many who own land.

Mr. SMITH of Michigan. There are a great many? 1\fr. SIMMONS. Yes. 1\Ir. SMITH of Michigan. For instance, during the last census

period the negroes of the South increased less than 10 per cent in population, but they increased 17 per cent in the ownership of. farms against a 12 per cent increase of white farm owners. In North Carolina the farms cultivated by white owners increased only 9 per cent, but the farms cultivated by negro owners increased 22 per cent. That is the increase in the Senator's own State.

Mr. SIMMONS. I n.m very glad to see that the colored folks in my State ha-ve made such a fine record.

Mr. SMITH of Michigan. Does the Senator dispute it? Mr. SIMMONS. No; I do not dis1mte it. I take pride in

the fact that they are doing so well in my State. But I do not see that that militates against the argument I am making. I was addressing myself to the white tenant and the colored tenant. We have white men who own small farms and we have colored people who own small farms. The white people of my State are just as much interested in the colored man who owns a farm succeeding in making money as they are in the white man succeeding. He buys from the merchants; he makes mortgages; he is a member of the community. They are just as much interested in the colored man cultivating his small farm succes&fully as they are in the white small landowner cultivating his farm successfully.

30'!4, CONGRESS! ON AL RECORD-SEN ATE. FEBRUARY 6,

1\Ir. SMITH of Michigan. But the progress the negro has made and is now making is a very remarkable tribute to his constancy.

:Mr. Sil\fifONS. I think it is. Mr. SMITH of Michigan. Prof. Branson, of Georgia, whom

the Senator from Georgia personally knows, says: Nearly one-fourth of all the negro farmers in the South own the

farms they cultivate.

1\Ir. SillMONS. I do not dispute the statistics. I know that wherever they can do so they are buying land. I think it is a

..._ very good sign. I am glad whenever I hear that one of them has accumulated enough to buy a farm and become an independent farmer; and I am very glad when I hear of a white tenant who has accumulated enough money to buy a small farm, because I think the hope of the South is in dividing up our large land holdings into small properties.

1\Ir. SMITII of Michigan. The negroes are making marvelous progress in that direction.

Mr. SIMMONS. The Senator says the colored man has bought a larger per cent of farms than the white man. I expect that is probably true, because the colored man in my State is more distinctively an agricultul'ist than the white man. Since we began, as the Senator knows, the marvelous development of our factories in North Carolina, extending practically over the whole State, the white people have gone more into manufacturing. They ha\e gone more to the towns and engnged in commerce and lin the industl'ies that center around the villages and towns than have the colored people. I think in recent years a larger per cent of colored people have remained in agriculture than white people, and that, I take it, would account for the fact that a larger per cent of them b.uve bought farms and become land-owners than white men.

lli. SMITH of .Michigan. The same relative increase in land ownership by the negroes extends through ILearly all the Southern States. For instance, in Florida they own nearly onehalf of the farms they cultivate; in ' Kentucky and Oklahoma, more than one-half of the farms they cultivate; in Maryland and Virginia, more than three-fifths of them; and in West Virginia, nearly four-fifths of them.

In less than 50 years the negro has acquired possession of 20,000,000 acres of farm land. Altogether his farm properties are valued at nearly $500,000,000- Negro land holdings in the aggregate make an area a little iarger than the State of South Carolina.

That is marvelous progress from slavery and serfdom. Mr. SIMMONS. That is a very gratifying statement. 1\fr. &\liTH of Michigan. It seems to me that in making ap

propriations for the encouragement of agriculture you ought not to o-verlook the tremendous strides that the colGred man has made in the South in land ownership, and Senators ought not to withhold from him the scientific inform!ltion that you give to others.

l\Ir. SIMMONS. That is the very point I am making. It it not proposed to withhold from him any informati-on that we give to the phite man. Let me say to the Senator there is this fact about the colored man, and it is very gratifying: He is very .anxious to acquire the independent ownership of land. He is very anxious to acquire a home. He is very anxious to acquil.'e--

Mr. SMITH of Michigan. It is the only chance he has to better his condition.

1\Ir. SIMMONS. It is a very good sign, and I am very glad that is true. As soon as the colored man is able to buy a piece of land and can find a piece of land of a size that he is able to buy, he invests his money in it, and if he has not the money and can get credit he will buy it on credit.

The colored people of the South are, as the Senator says, becoming independent landowners at a very gratifying pace. They are becoming educated, as the Senator from Washington [Mr. JoNEs] demonstrated by his figures here the othe1· day. They are taking great interest in education, and the rate of illiteracy among the colored people in the South has decreased very rapidly in recent years, and it is going to continue to decrease.

Now, let me ask the Senator from Michigan if the white people of North Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi, and Florida, the States that be read about a little while ago, were not kindly disposed toward the colored people, if they were disposed to oppress them, if they were disposed to withhold :from them their just rights, if they were not trying to help them to become good and useful citizens, does he believe that the colored people would have eyer acquired these large holdings of land, and does he belieYe that in those years they would have reduced their rate of illiteracy to the extent that has been demonstrated

here they have done! From the ·fact that they have become to such an extent within the few years they have been out of slavery landowners in the South, and have within those few years so far removed themselves :from the state of dense ignorance in which they were at the time of their freedom, docs not the Senator think that is evidence that the southern people have been fair and just toward them; that they have lent them a helping hand and taken great interest in matters that affect their intellectual .and their moral and their material welfare?

l\Ir. SMITH of Michigan. I would be lacking in candor if I did not admit tllat the progress which I have cited has occurred in the South among your people, and I would not say that you have oppressed them.

Ur. SIMMONS. Would you not say we have helped them? Mr. Sll!ITH of Michigan. I think you have compressed them. Mr. SIMMONS. I do not know what the Senator means by

th~ -1\Ir. SMITH of Michigan. I think you have limited their

opportunities for growth and restricted their field of development. That is what I mean. I do not say you have oppres etl them, but you have limited their opportunities, and, notwithstanding the unfa>orable conditions which surround their race, they have gone to their task with stout hearts and the firm purpose to accomplish something for themf'elyes, and they have done it, to their everlasting credit; they now own ;p500,000,000 worth of farm property, a tribute to thelr enterprise and their courage and dauntlessness.

I do not and I won1d not cast any reflection upon the State of North Carolina or any other Southern State. I know that you are -confronted with a serious p1·oblem ; but if these colored people, so recently out of bondage, have been able to gather tog~ther in 00 years $500,000,000 worth of farm propertymore 1and than constitutes the entire State of South Carolina! think that is rather a high tribute to the Intent characteristics of their race. I have no hesitation whatever in saying it.

Neither is that the only field in which they ha-v-e excelled. The Senator fl'Om North Caroljna kiiDws that every profession is honored by colored men-teachers, lawyers, merch::mts, doctors, bankers--every line of employment and profession shares its -complement of successful negroes. If they have been able to -accomplish this under the limited opportunities which have been theirs, I say it is -vastly to their credit; and I do not understand why the Semttor does not rejoice with me in their achievements. It is greatly to their credit, but it is not to our credit if we fail to recognize it.

:Mr. Sil\UfONS. Does the Senator happen to have before him the statistics that show to what extent the colored people in Illinois have advanced in acquiring the ownership of land?

Mr. SMITH of Michigan. No; I have not any statistics on that point.

Mr. SIMJ\fONS. Has the Senator anything to show that they have made greate-r progress in agriculture, in the acquisition of homes, in education in the Northern States wh~re they are found now-in many of them in large numbers-than they have made in the South?

Mr. SMITH of Michigan. I can not speak for the State of Illinois. That State is very ably represented here, and the Senator from illinois, by whose courtesy I am speaking, can answer for himself; but I can speak for my own State. It is with pride I Etay that in one of the counties of my State there is a township where there is not a foot of land owned by other than colored farmers. In th-e townshlp of Calvin, in the county of Cass, in the State of 1\Iichigan, every farm is owned by a colored man and every officer ()f that township is a c-olored man. They have their stores and their trading posts, and they are a. prosperous "find happy people.

Mr. SIMMONS. What the Senator bas said is very interesting.

Mr. SMITH of 1\fichigan. I was tempted to do it because-

1\Ir. SI1\1MONS. I just wanted--Mr. SMITH of Michigan. Twelve little picknninnies from

the South, caught up by a beloved woman whom I knew well and transplanted from unfavorable conditions in the South to our varying climate, have grown and prospered until that dozen pickaninnies left for their chHdren, and they will leave for their children's children, the land of an entire township in the State which I have the honor to represent.

Mr. SIMMONS. I merely wish to find out from the Senator why this segregation. We do not have thnt condition down in my country. I do not understand why in his State the color;ed people are segregated to themselves and no white people live among them. The two races live in juxtaposition in my country.

1914oJ UONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. 3045 Mr. SMITH of Michigan. They were not segregated by law. Mr. SIMMONS. Will the Senator explain why that is the

~ase? Is there any need for it? Mr. SMITH of Michigan. The Senator knows that there are

sections in the Senator's own State which colored men seem to prefer to other sections.

Mr. SUf IONS. The section in which they were residing at the close of the war--

1\Ir. SMITH of Michigan. Exactly. Mr. SIMMONS. In the eastern part of the State; but they

are very largely scattered all over the State. Mr. SMITH of Michigan. Why were they residing there? Mr. Sil\fMONS. They are not there segregated. Will the

Senator state why they are segregated in his State from the whites?

Mr. SMITH of Michigan. They have segregated themselves. Mr. SIMMONS. Why have they segregated themselves? Mr. SMITH of Michigan. Because there was opportunity for

their betterment; they have their schools and their churches and their own societies. The same situation exists in North Carolina. .

1\fr. SIMMONS. Not to any considerable extent. IUr. SMITH of Michigan. I did not rise for the purpose of

getting into any controversy with the Senator from North Carolina, because I know this is a very difficult and vexatious problem. but I do not see how you can in frankness and in justice ask us to differentiate between people who are to be the beneficiaries of our law. Why not apply these experimental tests and training so that all will get the benefit of it? The Senator says that the white agent would not perhaps enjoy instructing the colored farmer, if I caught his words correctly.

Mr. SIMMONS. No; the Senator is entirely mistaken. Mr. SMITH of Michigan. I thought I caught his words cor

rectly. Mr. SIJ\11\IONS. I said that the white demonstrator would

haYe just as much interest in instructing the colored farmer as he would in instructing the white farmer, because I said that the landowners and the community are just as mu~h interested in the colored man making a good yield from his crop as they are in the white man making a good yield. Therefore the white demonstrator would have the same interest to help the colored man to better methods of farming that he would have to help the white man. The Senator misunderstood me.

Mr. SMITH of Michigan. Does the Senator from North Carolina believe that the colored farmer in the South will get his full benefit from this appropriation?

1\fr. SI.Ml\IONS. I have not the slightest doubt, Mr. President, that if this bill passes the colored farmers of North Carolina and of the South, whether they are tenant farmers or owners of their own little farms, will get identically the same benefit from the insh'Uctions that will be given by the department, State and National, in farm demonstration work that the white people will get. There will not be the slightest difference in the world.

1\Ir. SMITH of lllichigan. There are two and one-third mlllions of colored people now engaged in agriculture. They ought to have some consideration. I hope they wiD get it, and, as far as my vote goes, I will see that they do.

.Mr. SUITH of Georgia. 1\fr. President, I should like to submit to the Senate, if the Senator from nlinois will allow me-

1\fr. SHERMAN. Certainly. Mr. SMITH of Georgia. A proposed unanimous-consent agree

ment to vote to-morrow; but I do not want to formally submit it until I ascertain whether or not Senators present object to it., because it is useless to have a roll f'<ill and bring all Senators here if anyone present objects. What I propose is this:

It is agreed by unanimous consent that not later than 4 o'clock on February 7 the Senate will l}t'Oceed to the consideration of House bill 7951, and during that calendar day vote npon any amendment that may be pending or any amendments that may be oiiered and upon the bill through the regular parliamentary stages to its final disposition; and that after 4 o'clock on February 7 no Senator shall speak more than once or longer than 10 minutes on the bill, nor more than once or longer than 10 minutes upon any amendment.

Mr. President, before I ask for consent to the agreement I wish to say that I expect to call the bill up at 2 o'clock promptly to-morrow, if I do not get a chance to call it up earlier.

Mr. GALLINGER. Does the Senator from Georgia, in his proposed unanimous-consent agreement, specify the calendar day?

Mr. S!tUTH of Georgia. I specify the calendar day. Mr. GALLINGER. I think it ought to be the calendar day. Mr. SMITH of Georgia. I have ::::o framed the request. I

know the Senator from South Dakota [Mr . .STERLING] wishes to take Ionge1· than 10 minutes, so I was going to suggest that

we will have 2 hours with unlimited debate, and perhaps the Senator can present his argument during that time.

Mr. STERLING. I expected to say what I have to say in offering my substitute for the pending bill, but that would depend upon when the amendments should be disposed of. It the amendments shall be disposed of before 4 o'clock, so that I can previous to that time offer my substitute, I suppose I shall have time enough to speak upun it; but i should like a little longer than 10 minutes for that purpose. I think perhaps 20 minutes would be as much time as I would wish in which to present the substitute and to speak with reference to it. I think, Mr. President, that I am willing to take the chances in regard to the rna tter.

Mr. ROOT. Mr. President, may I make a suggestion to the Senator from Georgia?

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. I should like to have the Senator do so. ·

Mr. ROOT. Would it not · be wise to call this bill up immediately after the reading of the J"ournal to-morrow, fix a time for voting on the pending amendment offered by the Senator from Washington [1\fr. JoNEs], and then let the remainder of the unanimous-consent agreement stand?

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. I am willing to make any satisfactory arrangement so that I can dispose of the bill to-morrow.

Mr. ROOT. That would obviate the difficulty of the Senator from South Dnkota [Mr. STERLING], who does not want to offer his substitute and to speak upon it until he knows what is done with the amendments to the bill.

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. When I suggested this morning a unanimous-consent agreement, Senators declared that the suggestion to ha-ve a unanimous-consent agreement to vote during the same day that the suggestion was made- was unheard of, and I am just a little afraid that, if I wait until to-morrow, the same view might be again taken.

Mr. ROOT. SUJ)pose the Senator makes it that the bill be called up to-morrow immediately after the reading of the Journal; that a vote be taken upon the pending amendment at 2 o'clock ; and then let the vote be taken u~n the other amendments under the 10-minute rule, beginning at 4 o'clock?

Mr. SMITH ot Georgia. I am afraid I would find objection from the Senators who are interested in the resolution which has gone over until to-morrow. The Senator from Nebraska [Mr. Noxrus] is in charge of the resolution which we had under discussion to-day, and which went over without prejudice until to-morrow. I will say to the Senator from New York that his suggestion would be perfectly agreeable to me if I should not run against an objection from a different source.

Mr. BRANDEGEE. May I ask that the proposed unanimousconsent agreement be restated to-the Senate?

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. I will restate it, so that the Senator will catch it at once. It is that at 4 o'clock to-morrow we proceed to vote upon the bill and the amendments through the parliamentary stages; that after 4 o'clock no speeches UJ)On the bill or upon any amendment shall be longer than 10 minutes; and that we shall dispose of the bill during the calendar day of to-morrow.

Mr. JONES. Mr. President, I wish to make a suggestion to the Senator from Georgia. Why not make it 3 o'clock, and then giye 15 minutes debate on amendments? That would probably meet the situation with reference to the Senator from South Dakota [Mr. STERLING].

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. If that meets the approval of Senators present, I will change the request for a unanimous-consent agreement to 3 o'clock and allow 15 minutes debate on amendments.

Mr. BRAl\TDEGEE. Of course that means that we might haye to sit here until 12 o'clock to-morrow night?

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. Yes; but I hope not. Mr. BRANDEGEE. I hope not, too. Mr. Sl\fiTH of Georgia. I promise not to take a great deal

of the time myself. Mr. SMOOT. Do I understand that the Senator's proposition

refers to the legislative day or the calendar day of to-morrow? Mr. SMITH of Georgia. It refers to the calendar day. Mr.

President, I first ask that any Senators who have any suggestions to make upon the matter may do so. I am willing to accept the suggestion, beginning at 3 o'clock, to limit speeches to 15 minutes. If there is no objection on the part of any Senator present to that suggestion, I will put it in that formal shape and send it to the Secretary's desk.

The VICE PRESIDENT. Under the ru1e, the Secretary will call the roll.


The Secretnry called the roll, ·and the following Senators answered to their names : Ashurst Gronna Brady Hitchcock Brandegee Hollis Bristow Hughes Bryan James Chamberlain Johnson Chilton Jones Clapp · Kenyon Colt Kern Cummins Lee. Md. Dillingham Lodge Fall Martin, Vn..

Nelson · New lands Oliver Overman Owen rage Poindexter nansdell Root Saulsbury Shafroth

Simmons Smith, Ariz. Smith, Ga. Smith, Mich. Smoot Stephenson Sterling Swanson Thompson Vardaman Walsh Weeks

Fletcher Martine, N. J. Sheppard Sherman Shields Gallinger Myers

1\Ir. CHAMBERLAIN. [Mr. LANE] is detained Senate.

I desire to state that my colleague from the Senate on business of the

Mr. KERN. I desir~ to announce that my colleague [Mr. SHIVELY] is unavoidably. absent.

Mr. GALLINGER. I Q.esire to state that the junior Senator from Maine [1\Ir. BURLEIGH] is unavoidably absent.

Mr. CHILTON. I desire to announce that the Senator from Alabama [Mr. BANKHEAD] is unavoidably absent from the Senate.

The VICE PRESIDENT. Fifty-four Senators have answered to their names. There is a quorum present. The Secretary will state the proposed unanimous-consent agreement.

The Secretary read as follows: It Is agreed by unanimous consent that on Saturday. February 7,

1914, Immediately upon the conclusion of the reading of the Journal, . the Senate will proceed to the consideration of the blll H. R. 7951,

to provide for cooperative agricultural extension work, and that at not later than 3· o'clock p. m. on that calendar day the Senate will proceed under the 15-mlnute rule, that will permit no Senator to speak more than once or for a longer period than 15 minutes upon any amendment that may be pending, any amendment that may be offered, and upon the bill through the regular parliamentary stages to its final disposition.

1\Ir. SMITH of Georgia. Mr. President, that is not the request for unanimous consent which I submitted. My writing may be a little difficult to read. This is the propose-d unanimous-consent agreement which I read to the Senate:

It is agreed by unanimous consent that not later than 3 o'clock on February 7 the Senate will proceed to the consideration of House bill 7951, and during that calendar day vote upon any amendment that may be pending, any amendment that may be offered, and upon the bill through the regular parliamentary stages to its final disposition, and that after 3 o'clock on February 7 no Senator shall speak more than once or longer than 15 minutes upon the bill, or more than once or longer than 15 minutes upon any amendment.

The VICE PRESIDENT. Is there objection? Mr. BRA.NDEGEE. 1\fr. President--Mr. SHERMAN. I wish to inquire if that applies to the time

in this legislative day, or does ·it begin to-morrow? 1\!r. LODGE. To-morrow. Mr. SMITH of Georgia. Only after 3 o'clock to-morrow. Mr. BRA.NDEGEE. Who has the floor, Mr. President? The VICE PRESIDEl\'T. The Senator from Connecticut has

the floor. 1\Ir. BRA.NDEGEE. If I have the floor, Mr. President, I

should like the privilege of saying a few words. If I caught the language of the agreement as proposed by

the Senator from Georgia, it provides that not later than 3 o'clock to-morrow we will proceed with the consideration of this bill. That fixes no definite time for beginning the consideration of it.

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. It is already the unfinished business, and can be taken up at 2 o'clock; but if the Senate were willing we might take it up earlier than 2 o'clock.

Mr. BRANDEGEE. That would require another unanimous consent.

Mr. Sl\IITH of Georgia. No. Mr. BRA.NDEGEE. Why not? Mr. SMITH of Georgia. We can take it up earlier than 3

o'clock. The agreement provides not later than 3 o'clock. The object of the proposed unanimous-consent agreement is to pro'ide that after 3 o'clock debate on the bill and amendments shall be limited to 15 minutes, that not more than one speech shall be made by any Senator on the bill or any amendment, and that the bill be disposed of during the calendar day.

Mr. BRANDEGEE. I do not object to that part of it. Mr. SMITH of Georgia. The bill is already the unfinished

business and can be taken up at 2 o'clock, or we can take it up even earlier during the day. The proposed agreement says "not later than 3 o'clock."

1\fr. BRANDEGEE. I ask the Secretary to re-nd the first part of the proposed agreement again. I understand the last part of it.

The Secretary read as follows : It is agreed by unanimous consent that not later than 3 o'cloclc on

:11pr¥~~}_2__the Senate will proceed to the consideration of House

Mr. ROOT. Mr. President, would not that displace this bill as the unfinished business?

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. Not at all. The VICE PRESIDE~'T. The Chair would be compelled to

rule that it would, in the opinion of the Chair. Mr. SMITH of Georgia. That would be unfortunate for the

bill. 1 suppose that I should yield, then, to the opinion of the Chair without regard to my own continuing opinion.

Mr. CUM.l\IINS. Mr. President, let me suggest to the Senator from Georgia that he say "not later than 2 o'clock" as the time to take up the bill, and that after 3 o'clock the conditions which he has provided shall prevail.

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. I am willing to do that. Mr. GALLINGER. That is >ery much better. The Senator

could move to take it up at 1 o'clock under the rule, so that not later than 2 o'clock wouJd be entirely proper.

Mr. S~1ITH of Georgia. Then I will change the request for unanimous con ent so as to read "not later than 2 o'clock."

The VICE PRESIDENT. Is there objection? l\fr. BRANDEGEE. Mr. President, unanimous consent has

already been given that the resolution offered by the Senator from Nebraska [Mr. NoB&IS] should go over until to-morrow without prejudice.

1\Ir. SMITH of Georgia. Yes. Mr. BRANDEGEE. Suppose that resolution is under consid-

eration at 2 o'clock? 1\Ir. GALLINGER. It would fall. Mr. SMITH of Georgia. It would then be displaced. The VICE PRESIDENT. '.rhe Chair can answer that ques

tion. The resolution of the Senator from Nebraska should have gone to the calendar, but, by unanimous consent, it was permitted to lie on the table as a resolution coming over from the preceding day. .

Mr. BRANDEGEE. And that would be superseded by the proposed unanimous-consent agreement of the Senator from Georgia if it were entered into?

The VICE PRESIDENT. Or by the unfinished business. Mr. BRA.NDEGEE. The Chair ruled, I understood, that the

proposed agreement, if entered into, would supersede the unfinished business?

The VICE PRESIDENT. Yes; because it was put off until 3 o'clock.

Mr. BRISTOW. 1\fr. President, I will ask the Senator from Georgia if he will not make it the legislative day--

Mr. GALLINGER and others. Oh, no. Mr. BRISTOW. So that we will not have to stay here until

late at night. There is no occasion for night sessions thus early in the session.

Mr. SMITH of Georgia. There are Senators here who have to be away on Monday. The Senator from Iowa [l\Ir. CuMMINS] has to be away on 1\Ionday, and a number of Senators have asked me to make it the calendar day. I do think we ought to finish the bill by 6 o'clock to-morrow.

The VICE PRESIDENT. Is there objection to the request of the Senator from Georgia? The Chair hears none, and the agreement is entered into.

The unanimous-consent agreement as finally entered into is as follows:

It Is agreed by unanimous consent that at not later than 2 o'clock on February 7 the Senate will proceed to the considet·ation of House bill 7951, and during that calendar day vote upon any amendment . that may be pending, any amendment that may be o!rered. and upon the blll through the regular parliamentary stages to its final disposition and that after 2 o'clock on February 7 no Senator shall speak more' than once Ol" lnng~r than 15 minutes upon the bill, ot• more than once or longer than 15 minutes up?n any amendment.

EXECUTIVE SESSION.

:Mr. KERN. I mo>e that the Senate proceed to the consideration of executive business.

'.rhc motion was agreed to, and the Senate proceeded to the consideration of executive business. After 10 minutes spent in executive session the doors were reopened.

DEATH OF REPRESENTATIVE BREMNER, OF NEW JERSEY.

A message from the House of Representatives, by J. C. South, its Chief Clerk, communicated to the Senate the intelligence of the death of Hon. RoBERT GuNN BREJ.!NER, late a Representative from the State of New Jersey, and transmitted resolutions of the House thereon.

The VICE PRESIDENT. The Chair lays before the Senate resolutions of the House of Representatives, which will be read.

1914- CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. 3047. The Secretary read the resolutions (H. Res. 400), as follQws:

IN THE HOUSE OF RJ:U'RESE:NTJ.TIVES, · February 5, 1914.

Resolved, That the Holllle has heard with profound sorrow of the death of Hon. ROBERT GuYN BB.ElMh"'En, a Representative from the State of New Jersey.

Resolved, That a committee of the House, with such Members of the Senate as Dlll.y be joined. be appointed to attend the funeral.

Resolved, That the Sergeant at Arms of the House be authorized a.nd directed to ta.ke such steps as may be necessary for carrying out the provisions of these resolutions, and that the necessary expenses in connection therewith be paid out of the contingent fund of the House.

RC3olved, That the Clerk communicate these resolutions to the Senate and transmit a copy therecf to the family of the deceased.

Mr. HUGHES. I offer the resolutions which I send to the desk, and ask unanimous consent for their present consideration.

The resolutions (S. Res. 265) were read, considered by unanimous consent, and unanimously agreed to, as follows:

Resolved, That the Senate has heard with profound sorrow the announcement of the death of Hon. RoBERT GUNN BREMNER, late a Representative from the State of New Jersey.

Resolved, That a committee of six Senators be appointed by the Vice President, to join a committee appointed by the House of Representatives, to take order for the superintending of the funeral of Mr. BREM:r.'En at Passaic, N. J.

' Resol,;ed, That the Secretary communicate a copy of these resolutions to the Rouse of Rcp.resentatives.

The VICE PRESIDENT appointed under the second resolution as the committee on the part of the Senate :Mr. MARTINE of New Jersey, Mr. HUGHES, 1\ir. V .A.BDAMAN, Mr. HOLLIS, Mr. CLAPP, and i\1r. STERLING.

:Mr. HUGHES. Mr. President, I desire to give notice that at a \:tuture day I shall ask the Senate to set aside a time in which to • consider resolutions on the life and public services of Reprersentative BREMNEr.. .As a further mark of respect to the memory of the deceased, I move that the Senate adjourn.

, The motion was unanimously agreed to, and (at 5 o'clock and :55 minutes p. m.) the Senate adjourned until to-morrow, Saturt.day, February 7, 1914, at 12 o'clock m.

NO:\fiN.ATIONS.

1il:r:ecutive nominations ·received by the Senate Februa'1J 6, 1914. JUDGE oF THE UNITED STATEs CounT FOR CHL~A.

Charles Sumner Lobingier, of Omaha, Nebr., to be judge of the United States Court for China, vice Rufus H. Thayer, resigned.

REGISTER OF THE LAND OFFICE.

J. L. Cal>ert, of Guthrie, Okla., to be register of the land oflice at Guthrie, Okla., vice Lawrence N. Houston, resigned.

RECEIVER OF PuBLIC MONEYS.

.Alexander X Campbell, of Grandfield, Okla., to be receiver of public moneys at Guthrie, Okla., Yice Hugh Scott, resigned.

.APPOINTMENT IN THE ARMY.

ReY. Ignatius Fealy, of the District of Columbia, to be chaplain with the rank of first lieuten:rn.t frorr: February 3, 1914, vice Chaplain John A. Ferry, Coast Artillery Corps, resigned October 9, 1D13.

PROMOTIONS IN THE ARMY.

CAVALRY ARM.

Capt. Charles J. Symmonds, Twelfth Cavalry, to be major from February 4, 1914, nee 1\faj. John P. Ryan, Sixth Cavalry, retired from active sernce February 3, 1914.

First Lieut. Jens E. Stedje, JJ'ourth Cavalry, to be captain from February 4, 1D14, · vice Capt. Charles J. Symmonds, Twelfth Ca-valry, promoted.

PROMOTION IN THE NAVY. Col. George Barnett to be Major General Commandant of the

.1\Iarine Corps for a period of four years from the 25th day of 1February, 1914.

POSTMASTERS.

ALABA!I.A..

Charles E. Hoskin to be postmaster at Montevallo, Ala., in place of Frank F. Crowe, resigned.

David A.. Hughes to be postmaster at Attalla, Ala., in place of John J. Stephens, resigned.

ALASKA..

. John F. Henson to be postmaster at Douglas, Alaska, in place of Richard l\IcCermick, resigned.

ARKANSAS.

Robert H. Smiley to be postmaster at Hot Springs, Ark., in place of Fred :ID. Johnson. Incumbent's commission expired January 26, 1914.

ARIZONA. L. R. Bailey to be postmaster at Bisbee, Ariz., in place of

Michael E. Cassidy. Incumbent's commission expired January 24, 1914.

FLORIDA.

Willie C. Caldwell to be postmaster at Jasper, Fla., in place of George W. Duncan, removed.

GEORGIA.

Julia Fleming to be postmaster at Sparta, Ga., in place of Julia Fleming. Incumbent's commission expires February 21, 1914.

ILLINOIS.

Marion C. Cook to be postmaster at Duquoin, Ill., in place of Harry B. Ward, resigned.

William H. Evans to be postmaster at O'Fallon, Ill., in place of William A. Koenigstein. Incumbent's commission expired February 4, 1914.

John Jakie to be postmaster at Oissna Park, Ill., in place of Henry B. Harvey, resigned.

Joseph 0. Smith to be postmaster at Manteno, ill., in place of James W. Breen. Incumbent's commission expires February 18, 1914.

INDIANA..

William H. Bennett to be postmaster at Monon, Ind., in place of Stanley S. Tull, removed.

Frederick A. Emerson to be postmaster at .Angola, Ind., in place of R. E. Willis. Incumbent's commission expires February 22, 1914 .

Leonard L. Graves to be postmaster at Thorntown, Ind., in place of Lewis Miller. Incumbent's commission expires February 15, 1914.

Charles H. Havens to be postmaster at Kokomo, Ind., in place of William H. Arnett. Incumbent's commission expires February 22, 1914.

L. B. Humphries to be postmaster at Rockville, Ind., in place of John H. Spencer. Incumbent's commission expires February 15, 1914.

Francis A. McMullen to be postmaster at Elnora, Ind., in place of Jonas E. Pershing. Incumbent's commission expires February 9, 1914.

Frank W. Macoughtry to be postmaster at .Attica, Ind., in place of Harry C. Martin. Incumbent's commission exr)ires February 22, 1914.

Albert S. Mingle to · be postmaster at Pendleton, Ind., in place of R. L. Ross. Incumbent's commission expires February 22, 1914.

Arthur C. Ronk to be postmaster at Ladoga, Ind., in place of John W. Lough. Incumbent's commission expires February 1'5, 1914.

Clarence P. Wolfe to be postmaster at New Harmony, Ind., in place of Morris B. Pote. Incumbent's commission expires February 15, 1914.

IOWA.

N. C. Butler to be postmaster at West Branch, Iowa, in place of C. H. Wickersham, removed.

W. H. Robb to be postmaster at Creston, Iowa, in place of Scott Skinner. Incumbent's commission expired February 4, 1914.

K.A.NSA.S.

Joseph J. Landes to be postmaster at Kirwin, Kans., in place of Alexander Barron. Incumbent's commission expires Febauary 28, 1914. .

T. J. Martin to be postmaster at Wetmore, Kans., in place of Redman A. De Forest. Incumbent's commission expired February 2, 1914 .

C. W. Spencer to be postmaster at Sedan, Kans., in place of Daniel Stough. Incumbent's commission expires February 18, 1914.

Owen C. Wasson to be postmaster at Peru, Kans. Office became presidential January 1, 1914.

MAINE. Richard P. Harriman to be postmaster at Bucksport, 1\Ie., in

plaee of Edward L. Beazley, resigned. MASSACHUSETTS •

Hiram A. Cowell to be postmaster at Wrentham, Mass., in place of Harrison V. Hap. Incumbent's commission expired December 14, 1912.

Daniel J. Dempsey to be postmaster at Millbury, Mass., in place of Nathan H. Sears. Incumbent's. commission expires February 21, 1914.


Sydney Harrocks to be postmaster at Westminister, Mass. Office became 11residential October 1, 1913.

Edward J. Hayden to be postmaster at Athol, Mass., in place of Festus G. Amsden, resigned.

Eugene D. 1\Iarc:tiesseault to be postmaster at Spencer, Mass., in 11lace of Harry S. Tripp·. Incumbent's commission expired February 4, 1914.

MICHIGAN.

William G. :Mehrens to be postmaster at Kearsarge, Mieh., in plnce of Fernando D. Petermann. Incumbent's commission expired January 25, 1914.

Irn G. l\Ietcalf to be postmaster at Morenci, Mich., in place of Charles 1\I. Butler. Incumbent's commission expired December 14, 1912.

MINNESOTA.

· George G. Allanson to be postmaster at Wheaton. Minn., in place of Edward F. Joubert. Incumbent's commission expires February 11, 1Dl4. · William L. Poseley to be postmaster at Renville, Minn., in place of Ferdinand H. Berning. Incumbent's commission expired January 11, 1914.

0. W. Ramsdell to be postmaster at Akely, Minn., in place of Charles Scheers. Incumbent's commission expired February 4, 1914.

Will J. Sarff to be postmaster at Eagle Bend, Minn., in place of Edward V. 1\Ioore. Incumbent's commission expires February 21, 1914.

MISSISSIPPI.

Walter L. Collins to be postmaster at Union, Miss. Office became presidential January 1, 1D14.

T. H. Sharp to be po tmaster at Columbus, Miss., in place of John T. Wood. Incumbent's commission expires February 15, 1Dl4. .

MISSOURI.

Frank Freytag to be postmaster at St. Joseph, Mo., in place of Laurence 0. Weakley. Incumbent's commission expires Febrna ry 21, 1914.

Charles C. Hamilton to be postmaster at 1\Iarsh:field, Mo., in place of .Henry Gilbert. Incumbent's commission expired February 1, 1914.

Henry Macom to be postmaster at Poplar Bluff, 1\Io., in place of Warren S. Randall. Incumbent's commission expired February 4, 1914.

MONTANA.

P. M. McLean to be postmaster at Ekalaka, l\Iont., in place of Jay E. Wilson, resigned.

NEllRASKA.

J. I. Corley to be postmaster at Weeping Water, Nebr., in place o:t George H. Oli•e. Incumbent's commission expires February 14, 1914.

G. R. Eno to be postmaster at Co1legeview, Nebr., in place of Charles H. Hodges. Incumbent's commission expired January 31, 1914.

NEW HAMPSHIRE.

Arthur J. Holden to be postmaster at Keene, N. H., in place of Ben 0. Aldrich. Incumbent's commission expires February 16, 1914.

NEW JERSEY.

. James A. Cleary to be postrrulster at Lambertville, N. J., in place of James D. 1\Iackay. Incumbent's commission expires l\fa1•ch 8, 1914. . Thomas J. Foley to be postmaster at Gloucester City, N. J., in place of David l\1. Anderson. Incumbent's commis ion expired January 24, 1914. . William E. Maxwell to be postmaster at Somerville, N. J., in place of John G. Gaston. Incumbent's commission expires March 8, 1D14.

R. J. Quince to be postmaster at Sussex, N. J., in place of Amasa W. Bedell. Incumbent's commission expires February 22, 1914.

William Slattery to be postmaster at Raritan, N. J., in place of George W. Hope. Incumbent's commission expired January 28, 1Dl4. · Andrew F. Stout to be postmaster at Lawrenceville, N. J., in place of Nathaniel H. Furman. Incumbent's commission expires February 11, 1014.

Howard .J. Tomble on to be postmaster at Williamstown, N.J., iu place of Eli R. Marsh. Incumbent's commission expires February 11, 1914.

NEW YORK.

William A. Buckley to be postmaster at Rochester, N. Y., in place of Joseph A. Crane, removed.

Charles L. Doolittle to be postmaster at Montour Falls, N. Y., in place of Fred J. Dunham, removed.

Francis J. Mulgannon to be postmaster at Hempstead, N. Y., in place of DeWitt C. Titus, removed.

Albert C. Salisbury to be postmaster at Waterv~lle, N. Y., in place of F. H. Coggeshall, deceased.

George Thomas to be postmaster at Pittsford, N. Y., in place of Adam N. Finucan. Incumbent's commission expired December 20, 1913.

NORTH CAROLINA.

Luther E. Huggins to be postmaster at Marshville, N. C. Office became presidential January 1, 1D14.

NORTH DAKOTA.

Grace E. Dumont to be postmaster at Antler, N. Dak. Office became presidential October 1, 1D13.

Martin 0. Hagenson to be postmaster at Scranton, N. Dak. Office became pre idential January 1, 1914.

Henry E. Stoskoff to be postmaster at Wildrose, N. Dak. Office became presidential January 1, 1914.

OHIO.

W. H. Chilcote to be postmaster at Edgerton, Ohio, in place of E. D. Killinger. Incumbent's commission expired January 24, 1914.

John N. Petersen to be postmaster at Delta, Ohio, in place of Chester R. P. Waltz. Incumbent's commission expires February 24, 1914.

OKLAHOMA.

0. E. Butler to be postmaster at Gro\e, Okla., in place of William J. Forbes. Incumbent's commission expired December 20, 1913.

1\Iark J. Courtney to be postmaster at Copan, Okla. Office became presidential January 1, 1914.

A. L. Davenport to be postmaster at Holdenville, Okln., in place of Edmond Arnold. Incumbent's commission expired :E'ebruary 1, 1914.

PENNSYL V .A.NI.A..

Joseph S. Cole to be postmaster at l\fillville, Pa., in place of Jo~eph C. Eves. Incumbent's commission expired December ll>, 1913.

'l'homas 0. Humphrey to be postmaster at Sharon Hill, l'a .. in place of David Dalton. Incumbent's commission expired December 20, 1913.

Harrison J. Kromer to be postmaster at l\Ierion Station, Pa., in place of Harrison J. Kromer. Incumbent's commission expired January 24, 1914.

James R. l\fowry to be poNtma~-tf.r at Derry, Pa., in 11lace of John on D. Neely. Incumbent's commission expired January 17, 1914.

John S. Roberts to be postmaster at Linwood Station, Pa. Office became presidential October 1, 1913.

Rhamanthus 1\I. Stocker to be postmaster at Honesdale, Pa., in place of Martin B. Allen. Incumbent's commission expired April 19, 1Dl3.

RHODE ISLAND.

Honore Archambault to be postmaster at Arctic, R. _I., in place of Moise :Meunier. Incumbent's commission expired Jannary 31, 1D14.

Charles Quinn to be postmaster at Phenix, R. I., in plnce of Walter A. Hill. Incumbent's commission expired Fehrnary 1, 1Dl4.

SOUTH CAROL IN A.

J. Elizabeth Meehan to be postm..'lster at Chesterfield, S. C. Office became presidentinl January 1, 1914.

SOUTH DAKOTA.

Lloyd L. Truesdell to be postmaster at Burke, S.Dak., in place of A. M. Church. Incumbent's commission expired January 10, 1914.

TENNESSEE,

w. A. Ghormley to be postmaster at .1\fadisonville, Tenn., in place of William R. Sloan. Incumbent's commission expires Febru:ll'y 21, 1914.

A. R. Hammer to be postmaster at McMinnville, Tenn., in place of Asa H. Faulkner, removed.

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3049 TEXAS.

R C. Crane to be postmaster at Sweet Wr.Lr, Tex., in place of 1\1. B. Howard. Incumbent's commission eJtpires February 8, 1914.

Elmer T. Gilbert to be postmaster at Caruon, Tex. Office became presidential January 1, 1914.

J. W. Hoff to be postmaster at Yorktown, Tex., in place of William J. Sta rk. Incumbent's commission expires February s, 1914.

L. A . .Meiners to be postmaster at Moulton, Tex., in place of Wenzel K. Richter. Incumbent's commission expires February 8, 1914.

·w. H. 1\fercer to be ~JOstmaster at Mineral Wells, Tex., in place of Joel D. Cranford. Incumbent's commission expires February 18, 1914. . Edna Overshiner to be postmaster at Valley View, Tex. Office became presidential January 1, 1914.

B. F. Shepherd to be postmaster at Memphis, Tex., in place of Effie L. Houghton. Incumbent's commission expires February 18, 1914.

,V. E. Thompson to be postmaster at Celeste, Tex., in place of S. T. Blackwell, resigned.

UTAH. William W. LeCheminant to be postmaster at Garfield, Utah,

in place of Robert B. Quay, removed.

VIBGINIA.

J. L. Bland to be postmaster at Westpoint, Va., in place of John S. De Farges. Incumbent's commission expires February 21, 1914.

WASHINGTON.

L. A. Dale to be postmaster at Brewster, Wash. Office became presidential January 1, 1914.

Lutetia 1\f. Fields to be postmaster at Woodland, Wash., in place of Isaac Fields. Incumbent's commission expired Janu-· ary 24, 1914.

WISCONSIN.

John D. Laughlin to be postmaster at 1\Iarion, Wis., in place of Stephen L. Perry, deceased.

A .. D. McDonald to be postmaster at Ashland, Wis., in place of Samuel S. Fifield. Incumbent's commission expired January 24, 1914.

CONFIRMATIONS.

Bxecutive nominations conji.nned by the Senate February 6, 1914.

CONSULS.

George A. Bucklin, jr., to be consul at Bordeaux, France. James Oliver Laing to be consul at Karachi, India. George N. Ifft to be consul at St. Gall, Switzerland.

RECEIVERS OF PUBLIC MONEYS.

Juan N. Vigil to be receiyer of public moneys at Santa Fe, N.Mex.

G. 'r. Stahl to be receiver of public moneys at Buffalo, Wyo.

PROMOTIONS AND ~UPOINTMENT IN THE NAVY.

Lieut. Commander Robert W. McNeely to be a commander. Lieut. Burrell C. Allen to be a lieutenant commander. Lieut. (Junior Grade) Willis W. Bradley, jr., to be a lieu

tenant. Ensign James L. Oswald to be a lieutenant (junior grade).

· Ensign Norman R. Van der Veer to be a lieutenant (junior grade).

J ohn B. Walker, a citizen of New York, to be an assistant surgeon.

PosTMASTERS. FI.ORIDA.

0 . K. Paxton, jr., White Springs.

ILLINOIS.

Thomas J. Ronin, Sycamore. MICHIGAN.

Martin Croker, Mount Clemens. HRGINIA.

:William E. Ramsey, Gretna.

LI--193

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. FRIDAY, February 6, 1914.

The House met at 12 o'clock noon. The Chaplain, Rev. Henry N. Couden, D. D., offered the fol

lowing prayer: 0 Thou who hast ever been our refuge and our strength, a

very present help in trouble, our hearts turn instinctively to Thee in this time of sorrow. The silver cord has been loos-ed, the golden bowl broken, the soul of another l\1ember of this House has crossed the great divide.

None knew him but to love him ; None named him but to praise.

His sunny smile and cheery words from a warm, sympathetic heart will be missed by us and by a host of friends in all the walks and conditions of life. Strong, brave, noble, generous, Thou hast called him to the realm from whence no traveler returns. But blessed be Thy holy name for that profound faith and eternal hope which fills our breast. He may not return to us, but we shall go to him, to be greeted once more by the warm clasp of his hand, the bright smile, and cheery voice. Be this our comfort and solace to those who are bound to him by the ties of kinship.

To live in the hearts we leave behind is not to die. The faith, the hope, the love born of Heaven will live on

forever. ~'hus may we cherish his memory. Thus may we press forward with brave and manly hearts, trusting in the undying love of a heavenly Father who doeth all things well. In the name of Him who taught us that life is stronger than death. Amen.

The Journal of the proceedings of yesterday was read and approved.

LINCOLN MEMORIAL. 1\Ir. SHERLEY. Mr. Speaker, I ask unanimous consent to

take from the Speaker's table Senate joint resolution 107 and pass the same.

The SPEAKER. The gentleman from Kentucky asks unanimous consent to take from the Speaker's table Senate joint resolution 107, relating to supervision of the Lincoln Memorial, which the Clerk will report.

The Clerk read as follows : Resol~:ed, etc., That in the exercise of its control and direction for

the construction of the Lincoln Memorial, authorized by act of Congress app_roved February 9, 1911, the commission created by said act shall des1gnate to perform the duty of special resident commissioner to represent the commission in the oversight of the work the Hon. Joseph C. S. Blackburn, J·ecently appointed a member of the Lincoln Memorial Commission, as the successor to the Hon. · Shelby M. Cullom, deceased ; and for the speciul service of the member so designated he shall be entitled to receive compensation at the rate of $5,000 per annum out of the appropriation for the construction of such memorial.

The SPEAKER. The gentleman from Kentucky asks unani· mons consent to take this joint resolution from the Speaker's . table. Is there objection?

There was no objection. The joint resolution was ordered to a third reading, and was

accordingly read the third time and passed. On motion of Mr. SHERLEY, ·a motion to reconsider the last

yote was laid on the table. CHARLES L. TBORNTO:N-L.EAVE TO WITHDRAW PAPERS.

1\fr. UNDERWOOD, by unanimous consent, obtained leave to withdraw from the files of the House without leaving copies the papers relating to H. R. 20061, for the benefit of Charles L. Thornton, no adverse report having been made thereon.

ABMY AND NAVY MEDAL OF HONOR ROLL. By unanimous consent, at the request of 1\lr. SHERWOOD, the

Committee on Pensions was discharged from further consideration of the bill (H. R. 12179) to establish in the War Department and in the Navy Department, respectively, a roll designated as the Army and Navy medal of honor honor roll, and for other purposes, and the same was referred to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

BRITISH MUNICIPAL TRADING UNDERTAKINGS (H. DOC. NO. 710).

1\fr. AD.A.l\ISON. Mr. Speaker, I ask unanimous consent that there be piinted as a House document the report of Alpert Halstead, consul of the United States at Birmingham, England, on the result of British municipal trading undertakings, which contains valuable statistical tables that seem to be of unusual importance.

I have conferred with the ·chairman of the Committee on Printing and submitted the document to him and also to the representative of the Government Printing Office. I find that 8,000 copies can be printed for $~00 and 24,000 for $300. As the

3050 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD- HOUSE. FEBRUARY 6,

article is sought by the Department of Commerce for distribution, it occurs to me that we bad better print 24,000 copies.

Mr. BARNH.AE.T. Reserving the right to object, I should like to ask the gentleman from Georgia if he has conferred with th~ Department of Commerce as to the number of copies they think they will need?

1\Ir. ADAMSON. They were very modest. I did ask them that question, and, witllout going into the details of the computation, they said they would be satisfied with 10,000 copies. Eight thousand copies can be printed for $200 and each additional thousand copies for $6.15.

Mr. BAR. .. 1HART. My recollection is that in a conversation by telephone yester·day they told me they thought 5,000 copies would be ample; and I think therefore, Mr. Speaker, with the consent of the gentleman from Georgia--

.Mr. MANN. ReserTing the right to object, do I understand that the request is to print this ·document for the use of the Department of Commerce?

Mr. ADAMSON. No, sir. They want 5,000 copies, I think, but the rest of us wonld 1ike to have a few.

Mr. MANN. If they want 5,000 copies, wby do they not print them?

Mr . .ADAMSON. They say they ·ha1"e not sufficient funds. I have a letter from the Secretary of Commerce-

Mr. MANN. If the gentleman will permit; we pass appropriation bills 'fixing the amount of the appropriation for printing in each of the departments. They always say they have not enough. Thereupon very frequently somebody comes to the House and proposes that the printing shall be done out of the appropriation fo1· printing for Congress. That is in order to let the department use its appropriation without paying for the printing that it wants done and the printing is charged to Congress. Then, after awhile the department refers to the enormous bills for printing for Congress, and poinra out how scant the appropriations are for printing for the departments.

Mr. ADAl\fSON. Mr. Speaker, I am perfectly willing to print them and take all of them ourselves and let the department look out for itself; but I should like to answer all inquiries by having :ead the letter from the Secretary of Commerce.

The SPEAKER: If there be no oojection, the Clerk will read the letter.

Mr . .ADAMSON. It is short. The Clerk read as follows :

DEPAJtT.MI:N'l' OF COMME!l.CE,

Hon. W. C. ADAMSON,

OFFICE OF Tllll SECRETARY, Washington, February 3, 191.1.

House ot Representatives, Washington, D. C. MY DEAR JUDGE ADAMSO~ : May I invite your thought for a .moment

to the inclosed letter to me from the chief of the Bureau of Foreign and Domestic Commerce and to the papers that he sends with It? These papers are, in brief, the report of Albert Halstead, consul o! the United

·States, at Birmingham, England, on the results of British municipal trading undertakings, and they contain statifltical tables that seem of unusual importance and such as would be of general public interest and usefulness. They should be made public through some governmental agency, but our department has not means at present for doing this. It has occurred to me tha-t, ns chairman of your .important committee, this is a matter that you could aslf to have printed as a public document. I s1mll be very glad if you can do so, and would suggest that if practicable It be so done.

Yours, very truly, WILLIAM C. .REDFIELD, Secretary .

.Mr. llUSSELL. Mr. Speaker, reserving the right to object, pertinent to this question of printing I want to ask tlie chairman of the Committee on Printing a question about the ru1es relating to the printing of speeches. l have found that it costs more money to get 2,000 copies of a speech printed than it does to get 5,000 copies of the same speech printed. On two occasions I have ordered 2,000 copies of a speeCh printed, and was informed that ! could get them for 1ess money if I would get 5,000 copies.

Mr. .ADAMSON. Less per thousand copies? Mr. RUSSELL. No; less for the whole number, they told me. The SPEAKER. · The Chairman of the Committee on Printing

is interrogated. .Mr. BARNHART. .Mr. Speaker, in reply to that--Mr. RUSSELL. You will find that they charge more if you

order 2,000 copies than they will if you order 5,000 copies. l\ir. H.A.MILTON of Michigan. At that ra:te, it would appear

that if the gentleman wou1d order enough copies printed, they would not cost him anything.

Mr. GARNER. l\1r. Speaker, let us have one man talking at a time. When two or .three gentlemen talk at once jt is impos-sible to understand what they say. , '

Mr. AD.Al\fSON. I yield to the gentleman from Indiana [lllr. BARNHART] to answer the question of the gentleman from Missouri~

Mr. llARNHART. Mr. Speaker, I can not answer that question. What the gentleman states is news to me. I can not unGerstand wh~ the Go"\"ernment should charge more for printing 2,000 copies of a speech than it would charge to print u,OOO copies of the same speech. If it is doin~ so, it is certainly perpetrating a wrong, and there is no business theory of which I have ever heard that would justify :my such method as that. My impression is tbat the gentleman from lii somi has misunderstood the matter, and that the rate 1)er tl10usand is less when 5,000 copies nre ordered than the rate per thousand wllcn 2,000 copies are ordered.

The SPEAKER. This has nothing to do with the request of the gentleman from Georgia, anyway.

Mr. ADA.i\fSON. It does not apply to my proposition. After the first 2,000 are J>rinted we can get other copies printed at tile rate of $6.15 a thousand. I shall be satisfied with 8,000 copies .

The SPEAKER. Is there objection to the request of the (Ten-tleman from Georgia? o

T'nere was no objection.

CONTESTED-ELECTION CASE-CARNEY AGAINST SMITH.

Mr. POST. Mr. Speaker, I desire to present a privileged resolution.

The SPEAKER. The gentleman from Ohio sends to the desk a privileged report, which will be read by the Clerk.

The Clerk read as follows: House resolution 396.

R esolved, That Claude S. Carney was not elected as a Representative to the Sixty-third Congress from the third congressional district of Michigan; and

Resolvea, That J"ohn M. C. Smith was duly elected aii a Represcntatl~e from the third congressional district of Michigan to the Sixtyf~~gi;~;~:~ and is entitled to retain the scat which he now occupies

The SPEAKER. Is this a unanimous report? Mr. POST. It is, 1\Ir. Speaker, a unanimous Teport. Tbe SPEAKER. The question is on agreeing to the resolu

tion.· The resolution was considered and agreed to. [Applause. ]

MESSAGE FROM THE SENATE. A message from the Senate, by 1\fr. Tulley, one of its clerks,

announced that the Senate had passed bill of the following title, in which the concurrence of the House of Representatives was requested :

S. 1899. An act to establish a fish-cultural station in the State of Florida.

SENATE BILLS REFEimED.

Under clause 2 of Rule XXIV, Senate bills of the following titles were taken from the Speaker's table and referred to their appropriate committees, as indicated below:

S. 3439. An act appropriating funds for the purpose of the investigation, treatment, and eradication of hog cholera; to the Committee on Agricu1ture.

S. 1899. An act to estab1ish a fish-cu1tura1 station in the State of Florida; to the Committee on the Merchant Marine and Fisheries.

S. 1983. An act to amend section 3618 of the Revised Statutes of the United States, relating to the sale of public property; to the Committee on Naval Affairs.

ENROLLED BILL SIGNED. Mr. ASHBROOK, from the Committee on Enrolled Bills, re

ported that they had examined and found truly enrolled bill of the following title, when the Speaker signed the same :

H. R . 9574. An act to authorize the Missouri, Kansas & Tex-as Railway Co. to construct a bridge across the Mississippi River near the city of Hannibal, in the State of Missouri.

PENSION BILLS.

Mr. ADAIR. Mr. Speaker, I desire to call up the conference report on Senate bill 832, granting pensions and increase of pensions to certain soldiers and sailors of the Civil War and certain widows and dependent relatives of such soldiers and sailors.

The Clerk read the conference report, as follows :

CONFERENCE REPORT (No; 225),

The committee of conference on the disagreeing votes of the two Houses on the amendments of the House to the bill ( S. 832) granting pensions and increase of pensions to certain sol<liers and sailors of the Chil War and certain widows and dependent relatives of such soldiers and sailors, having met, after full and free conference have agreed to recommend and do recommend to their respective Houses as follows:

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3051 That the House recede from its amendments numbered 1

and 2, and agree to the same. J. A. M. ADAIR, JoE J. RussELL, J. N. LANGHAM,

Manage1's on the par·t of the Hottse. BENJ. F. SHIVELY, N. P. BRYAN, P. J. McCUMBER,

Managers on the part of the Senate.

The SPEAKER. The question is on agreeing to the report. The conference report was agreed to. Mr. ADAIR. :Mr. Speaker, I now call up the conference report

on Senate bill 833, granting pensions and increase of pensio~s to certain soldiers and sailors of the Civil War and to cert::un widows and dependent relatives of such soldiers and sailors.

The conference report was read, as follows:

CONFERENCE REPORT (NO. 226).

The committee of conference on the disagreeing votes of the two Houses on the amendments of the House to the bill ( S. 833) granting pensions and increase of pensi?ns ~o certain sol<liers and sailors of the Civil War and: certam w1dows and dependent relatives of such soldiers and sailors, having met, after full and: free conference have agreed to recommend and do recommend to their respective Houses as follows :

That the Senate recede from its disagreement to the amendments of the House numbered 2, 4, 6, 16, 18, 20, litlld 25.

That the House recede from its amendments numbered 1, 3, 5, 7, 8, 9, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 17, 19, 21, 22, and 23, and agree to the sa~e.

Amendment numbered 10: That the House recede from 1ts disagreement to the amendment of the Senate numbered 10, and agree to the same with an amendment as follows:

"The name of John D. Kirkpatrick. late of Company D, Fiftysecond Regiment, and Company 0, Sixty-ninth Regiment, Ohio Volunteer Infantry, and pay him a pension at the rate of $24 per month in lieu of that he is now receiving."

And the Senate agree to the same. Amendment numbered 24: That the House recede from its

disagreement to the amendment of the Senate numbered 24, and agree to the same with an amendment as follows:

" 'rhe name of Jacob H. Gabbard, late of Company A, Fortyseventh Regiment Kentucky Volunteer Infantry, and pay him a pension at the rate of $24 per month in lieu of that he is now receiving."

.And the Senate agree to the same. J. A. :M. ADAIR, JoE J. RussELL, J. N. LANGHAM,

Managers on the part of the House. BENJ, F. SHIVELY, N. P. BRYAN, P. J. McCUMBER,

Managers on the part of the Senate.

The conference report was agreed to. 1\fr. ADAIR. 1\Ir. Speaker, I call up the conference report

on Senate bill 834, granting pensions and increase of pensions to certain soldiers and sailors of the Civil War and certain widows and dependent relatives of such soldiers and sailors.

The Clerk read the conference report, as follows :

CONFERENCE REPORT (NO. 227).

The committee of conference on the disagreeing votes of the two Houses on the amendments of the House to the bill (S. 834) granting pensions and increase of pensions to certain soldiers and sailors of the Civil War and certain widows and dependent relatives of such soldiers and sailors, having met, after full and free conference have agreed to recommend and do recommend

_ to their respective Houses as follows: That the Senate recede from its disagreement to the amend

ments of the House numbered 1, 2, 3, and 10. That the House recede from its amendments numbered 4, 5, 6,

7, 8, and 9, and agree to the same. J. A. M. ADAIR, JOE J. RUSSELL, J. N. LANGHAM,

Managers on the part of the House. BENJ. F. SHIVELY, N. P. BRYAN, P. J. 1\IcCuMBER,

Managm·s on tlte pa1·t ot the Senate. The conference report was agreed to.

PRIVATE CALENDAR.

1\Ir. POU. Mr. Speaker, I move that the House resolve itself into Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union for the consideration of bills on the Private Calendar.

The motion was agreed to; accordingly the House resolved itself into Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union, with Mr. ADAIR in the chair.

Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, this is the first day that there bas been any opportunity for the consideration of bills from the Committee on Claims. · I therefore move that the committee proceed first to the consideration of those bills reported by the Committee on Claims.

1\fr. 1\fANN. It is also the first opportunity that other bills have had.

Mr. POU. But this is claims day, under the rule. Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. Mr. Chairman, I think the

language of the rule provides that claims shall have preference on this day. ·

Mr. MANN. If the gentleman will permit, the ruling has been that bills reported from other committees than War Claims on this day can come up in the regular order, the same as claims day. That was an arbitrary ruling in the last Congress, arbitrary because otherwise these bills would never be reached at all.

Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. The gentleman says ,. it was made in the last Congress?

1\fr. MANN. Yes. The old rule before the last Congress gave preference to the Committee on Claims over war claims on a certain Friday, and war claims over claims on a certain Friday, without reference to bills reported from other committees. When you revised the rules you put in a provision that bills from the Committee on Claims and the Committee on War Claims should have the preference, which gave no opportunity for the consideration of bills reported from another committee unless there was no bill from the Claims or War Claims Committee. The Ohair ruled that it was not the intention to change the prior ruling; that the only preference of the claims bills was over war-claims bills, and the only preference over warclaims bills was the claims bills.

Mr. POU. Now, 1\Ir. Chairman, I maintain that under clause 6, Rule XXIV of the rules of the House, bills reported by the Coumittee on Claims have the preference to-day, no matter what may have been the ruling of any former occupant of the chair in the Committee of the Whole.

On every Friday except the second and fourth Fridays the House shall give preference to the consideration of bills reported from !he Committee on Claims and the Committee on War Claims, alternating between the two committees.

If the English language means anything, it means that on to-day, which is not the second Friday, which is not the fourth Friday, preference shall be given first to what? To bills reported by two committees. What two committees? The Committee on Claims and the Committee on War Claims. It seems to me that it would be impossible for the English language to make anything plainer than this, that on to-day the committee shall give preference to the consideration of bills from these two committees. Now, there is a further qualification to it that on a certain Friday prefer2nce shall be given to the Committee on Claims over the Committee on War Claims, and that on a certain Friday preference shall be given to the Committee on War Claims over the Committee on Claims. But there is no qualification to the rule that on this day preference shall be given to bills reported by the two committees named.

1\fr. MANN. What the gentleman from North Carolina says about the reading of the rule I think is correct. I think no one who reads the rule, without regard to the history of the rule, would say that the gentleman's contention was not correct. Under the old . rule, prior to the last Congress, the preference that was given under the rule was simply a preference to the Committee on Claims over War Claims, and on War Claims ove:r Claims on war-claims day. I called the attention of the House in the last Congress to the fact that under the rule as proposed then there would be no opportunity for the consideration ot reports from another committee than claims and war claims if the rule was strictly construed.

Mr. HARDWICK. Will the gentleman yield? · Mr. MANN. Certainly. :Mr. HARDWICK. I happened to draft this rule. and as the

rule reads and as it ought to be construed, undoubtedly on the first and third Fridays, while the Claims Committee comes first1

the other committees would have a chance. Mr. MANN. No. :Mr. HARDWICK. On the first and third Fridays these two

committees have the right of way. The rule so states in 1'bs

3052 OONGRESSION .AL RECORD-HOUSE._ FEBRUARY 6,

plainest and most nnmistakabl.e language. There can be no the Committee on War Claims reports. We ougbt not to have excuse for any contention that there is anytbing muddy about it to fight for a chance to consider bills from the Committee on or anything that is not clear or fair. On the first and third Claims on days clearly set apart to that committee. I say no Fridays the Committee on Claims and the Committee on War ot~er construction can be put upon that rule than that on toClaims alternate and hn:ve preference over other committees day the Committee on Claims and the Committee on War reporting private bills. But on the second and fourth Fridays Claims shall have preference. that is not true. l\fr. GARRETT of Tennessee. Mr. Chairman, I do not remem-

1\lr. MANN. Well, Mr. Chairman, that is an incorrect state- ber the ruling that has been referred to by the gentleman from ment of fact, because on the first and third Fridays bills from illinois [Mr. MANN]. I have a distinct recollection that such the Committee on Pensions and Invalid Pensions have the prefer- a ruling was made~ but I do not remember now what Chairman ence. made that ruling.

Unless these committees run out of bills there is no chance Mr. MANN. I do not remember who was in the chair, but for any other committee to have a bill reported on. a Friday. it was made several times~ I will say to the gentleman. The That matter was ruled upon. question was raised! by gentlemen on the Com.tcittee on Claims

Mr. HARDWICK~ l\fr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield? on several occasions . .Mr. MANN. Yes. . Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. This is the first time my atten· ;:\fr. HARDWICK. Of course that meant they would have tion has been directed specifically to- the matter.

their chanee only after these committees got through. Mr. POU. I do not find any reference to it in the digest. Mr. MAl""fN. Certainly. Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. That is since the rules were Mr. HARDWICK. The ruie meant that, and we knew that revised, at the beginning- of the Sixty-second Congress.

when we drew that in that"way. Mr. MANN. The Digest of Rules is not up to-day. Mr. MANN. Then, the gentleman ought to have advised the Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. I know that is true. Mr.

Chairman of the Committee of the Whole of that in the last Chairman, I want to submit this observation to the Ohair. I do Congress. remember very distinctly since this discussion has come up a

Ur. HARDWICK. It does not make any difference if there discussion that was had in the Committee on Rules, and a dis· has beett a mistake about it in the rnling of some Chairman of cussion that was bad on the floor of the House when the rules the Committee of the Whole in the past. were brought in at the beginning oi the Sixty-second Congress.

Ur. MANN. This matter came up several times in the last I remember very distinctly that the ~ntleman from Illinois [Mr. Congress, and every Chairman who occupied the chair ruled-- MANN] and the gentleman from Penusylvania [Mr. Dalzell] at

1\fr. HARDWICK. Can the gentleman cite the rulings? that time, during the couroo of some remarks I myself was Mr. ~IANN~ I can not cite them at this moment. making on the rules, called attention t:o the fact that this would Mr. HARDWICK. Does the gentleman remember there was give precedence to claims and war claims over those bills com-

more than one? ing from other committees. It was the purpose of the Com· Mr. lUANN. I do remember it came up more than once. mittee on Rules to do that, and it was stated, Mr. Chairman, in lUI:'. HARDWICK. We might as well settle it now again, the debate at that time that it was the purpose to do that-to

because if it was ever settled that way, it was settled wrong, put elaims and war claims, on precisely the same plane that absolutely. pensions are on now and have been ou for years. I apprehend

lU.r. POU. 1\!r. Chairman, with the permission of the gentle- that if upon a pension day some gentleman should undertake to man from illinois [Mr. 1\-IANN], having in mind the statement of call up a bill from some othe-Jr committee than the' Committees the gentleman from Georgia [Mr. HARDWICK] as to the meani~g on Pensions or Invalid Pensions, as the case might be. the point of this rule I am going to ask the Chairman to rule on this of order would be promptly made and would be sustained. The question ag~in. I do not care what the ruling has been here- language was so changed in making this rule as to, in express tofore, us I said a while ago. If anytbing on earth can be made terms, put claims and war claims upon exactly the same plane plain it is that these two committees under the rule have pref- as Pension Committee business. That was the very purpose of eren~e on certain days. I beg the attention of the Chair for it, and I think the Ohair would be not only justified but vindi· just one moment. It is not true that if the Chair rules that cated--way it means there will be no opportunity for consideration of Mr. GARNER. Compelled. other bills on the Private Calendar. The Committee on Claims Mr. GARRETr of Tennessee. Compelled, yes, to so hold. has only half a dozen bills on the calendar to-day. I do not Mr. MANN. Mr. Chairman, I remember the discussion, believe it will take over an hour to dispose of them ; it certainly although I do not remember interrupting the gentleman from ought not to. Then the other bills on the calendar can be Tennessee [Mr. GARRETT] or his statement. In the discus· considered. r do not challenge the statement of the gentleman sion about the rules at the beginning of the Sixty-second Con· from lllinois, but I do not remember the ruling to which he gress I charged that that would be the result of this rule. I refers. remember it was very vigorously denied on the other side of

l\lr. MANN. Mr. Chairman. will the gentleman yield? the House. · lUr. POU. If there was such a ruling, it was in the teeth of Ur. HARDWICK. By whom?

the language of this rule. Mr. MANN. I do not recall now. I was endeavoring to Mr. IUA.NN. .1\lr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield? make a point against the rules. Now, it is immaterial to me ~i~: ~f~:e~hB gentleman will remember this, I think: whether these bills have an opportunity to be heard or not. I

That in calling the calendar in the last Congress on private- never had any of them myself. But what will be the result? d · ~fr. POU. You have one now.

claims day, bills from other committees were considere m regu- Mr. 1\IAl\TN. I have no bill reported from the Committee on Iar order. d f I 'ght t t h b t Mr. POU. I do remember that bills were considered. My Claims, and have not ha or years. m1 wan o ave, u recollection of what occurred is this: That the point was made I have not had one yet. of which the gentleman speaks, and in order to cut the knot- Mr. POU. I think the gentleman is mistaken. I think the the Chair did not rule upon. il-l made a motion that we take Committee on Claims has a bill to which the gentleman's. up bills from the Committee on Claims, and the motion pre- name is attached as having introduced it. vaned. · l\1r. MANN. I have no doubt r have introduced many of

l\Ir. MANN. I do not say the gentleman may not have done them, but they have not received favorable consideration. Now, that, tllough r think he asked unanimous consent to do that. I am not complaining ~bout that. What wil~ be the result if

lli. POU. No: r remember distinctly that I moved on at least ' the- Chair rul.es that bill.s from other comm1ttees can. not be one dn.y and r think on two to take up the bills from the Com- taken up until all the bills rep01·ted from the Coillilllttee on mittee- ;n Claims. ' Claims are disposed of? Every old Membe~ of this _House

Mr. MANN. By unanimous consent, but the Chair ruled on knows that after ~ few weeks. the calendar 1s filled With re--. the proposition. ports of the Co~ttee on Claims, and usua~ly from the Com ..

1\Ir. POU. r will be through in just one minute. r think mittee on War Clauns. If you say that a bill . fr~m any ot~er this matter ought to be. settled now. The Committee on Claims committee can not be taken up on any. day until the claliDS and the Committee on War Claims have a g1·eat deal of work. bil~ ha:e al1 b~en disposed of ~n c:.auns day, or the ~ar The Members of the House are interested in these bills. We clrums bil~s all disposed of ~:m war-claims day, or the pens~on have been doing our best to put them on the calendar, and it is bills an. disposed. of o!l pensiOn day, why, you leave these b1lls in the interest of the early consideratfon of bills in which in the a1r and Illlght JUSt as well never report _them. . you are interested that the rule should be followed. It means Mr. HARDWICK. W~y can no~ the question of consld~rathe setting aside of two days~ and that on those days preference tion b~ raised on the Clauns Comm1tte~ aJ?-d on the Wa?r Clauns should be given to claims in which you are interested and which Comrmttee, and why can you not stop It m the- House·

OONGRESSION AL RECORD-HOUSE. 3053

Mr.. .MANN. You can Mt raise the question o:t consid~tion on tllese bills?

Mr. HARDWICK. Why not? M.r:. M..A.b"'N. ':che motion is to go into the Committee of the

Whole. ]Ujr_ HARDWICK. You can defeat that, can you not? 1\Ir. I\IA..c~. That would not help you. The motion is to go

into the Committee of the Whole for consideration o:t private bllJs under the rules. If defeated, you will not get to the other bill all da-y. You can not make a motion to go into the Committee of the W'hole on private-claims day for the consideration "Of a particular bill. There is no way of getting to it if there is anything ahead of them on the calendar. ·

Now, that matter was presented in the last Congress, and I made the same argument then that I am making now, simply for the purpose of having the matter decided. The Chair then ruled that it was not intended by the rules to change the prior rullng on the subject. Now, if the gentlemen do not desire to have the same ruling in this Congress that was made in the last Congress, the rule being the same, it is a matter of immateriality to me. I have no interest in these bills as reported from other committees. In fact, in the main I am opposed to these personal bills reported from the Committee on Military Affairs, from the Committee on Naval Affairs, and from other eommittees, to give some special preference to some officer or ex- 1

officer of the Army or the Navy oyer what other officers receive. It might just as well never be reported as to say they neyer can be considered.

Mr. HARDWICK. If the Chair is prepared to rule, I ~o not want to take any time, but there are certain observations which I would like to make. -

The OHAIR:.\L.~N. The Chnir will hear the gentleman. l\fr. HARDWICK. I will make my stntement very brief.

This rule is as plain as the English language can make it and it any chairman of the Committee ()f the Whole in the past has made any mistake or given any improper ruling on it, the time to correct it is now. The rule provides:

On e_very Friday except the second and fourth Fridays the Rouse shall g.tve preference to the consideration of bills reported from tile Committee on Claims nnd the Committee on War Claims. alternating between the two committees.

Mr. CAMPBELL. On what page is that? Mr. HARDWICK. I am reading from clause 6, Ru1e XXIV. Now, the intention of the Committee on Rules when they drew

this rule was to do just what the rule says, namely, on the second and fourth Fridays of each month to give to the Committee on Pensions and the Committee on Invalid Pensions the preference over all other committees I:el)orting b:lllil on the Private Calendar and on the first and third Fridays to the Committees on Claims and War Claims. We put them on exactly the same basis. Their claims of preference and priority rest on exactly the same language, and no Chairman of the Committee of the 'Whole can rule that war claims and claims do not have preference over all other private business on the first and third Fridays without necessarily ruling that pensions and invalid pensions lose their preference on the second and fourth Fridays of each month. The preference in each case rests on the same language. It is plain and unmistakable. There is no room for controversy about it. The gentleman from Illinois rMr. MANN] suggests it will give these bills preference. That was the very reason the rule was written that way. The gentleman from Illinois [Mr. MANN] may not prefer the rule to be written that way, but that we did not take him into consultation with reference to that, and we wrote it just as we meant it, and the House adopted it just as we meant it. And unless the Committee on War Claims and the Committee on Claims have this preference on the first and third Fridays of each month then the Committee on Pensions and the Committee on Invalid Pensions have not the preference on the other two Fridays, because the right rests on the same language in each instance and it is as plain as language can be. We changed the old language of this rule for that very purpose. We said it was fair to treat these committees exactly alike, and let the preferen<~e in each case rest on the same identical language, and there can be no doubt about it. I care not what some unnamed gentleman who may have presided over the Committee of the ;Whole in the past has ruled, when this matter was not argued out and when the point was not fairly and fully considered. It is the duty of the present oceupant of the chair to follow the rule just as it was written.

Mr. POU. Just one word, if you please. The gentleman from Georgia [Mr. HARDWICK], I think, has made it very plain that unless the Ohair construes this rule to mean that the bills from , the Committee on Claims are entitled under the rule to consideration to-day, then the Committee O;t! Claims has no

preference at all over anybody or anything. It would like~ wise be true that the Committee on Pensions will haye no preference over any ·other bill from any othei: committee.

The CHAIRMAN. rt would have a preference over the Committee on War Claims, would it not?

Mr. POU. Does the ChaiTman mean the Committee on War Ola.ims to-day?

The OHAlRMAl"{. Yes. Mr. POU. That would be true; but I contend that as a

practical result it would mean that in the face of that ruling to-day, on the point of order being made, the Chairman of the Committee of the Whole would be compelled to direct that the calendar be called from the beginning.

Now, the Committee on Claims has nearly a th.ousand bills pending before it. We haTe seven subcommittees at work all the time. The 1\fembers of this House are entitled t<> have their bills considered, and I appeal to the present occupant of the chair to construe this rule in accordance with its clear intention, as stated by members of the Committee on Rules.

What occupant of the chair has ruled to the contrary? Some unnamed occupant, on some forgotten day, may have made such a ruling, but it is not recorded anywhere, so far as it has been stated in this House. I have no recollection of any such ruling, though I will not say such a rnling was not made. The gentleman from Illinois [1\Ir. l\IANN] is always accurate, and I would not challenge his statement; but if that statement is correct, then tile time has come to change the ruling here and now.

I have not seen a Member at this House who does not agree thut a proper construction of this rule would require that bills from the Committee on Claims shall ha\e consideration to-day. Almost every- hour of the day the Committee on Claims is being cailed Ul) by Members wanting to know whether we are going to call up their bills on the following Friday. What answer can be given them, wtth nearly a thousand bills pending in that committee? Mr. Chairman, this rule should. be considered in aceordance with the clear and palpable intent of the men who drew it-that these private claims should be considered :first, and that then we should take up other bills on tlle Private Calendar.

Mr. CAMPBEiuL. Mr. Chairman, I recall that a number of years ago an attempt was made, while the Committee on Claims was considering bills, to call up a- bill that had been reported by the Oommitt~e on War Claims. That precipitated a parliamentary discussion that consumed two or three hours in the day as to whether or Mt the bill reported from the Committee on 'V,ar Clrrims was in or~er on that day.

1\Ir. MANN. If the gentleman will permit me, that was prior to , the Si:x:cy-secood Congress?

Mr. CAMPBELL. Yes; that was prior to the Sixty-second Congress.

1\Ir. GARRETT of Tennessee. Having that fact in mind at the time we revised the rules at the beginning of the Sixtysecond Qongress, we put that language in, removing it from the realm of doubt.

Mr. CA11IPBEI..~L. It happe.ned that I was in the chair at the tin1e, and I had to hold that, as the rules then existed, a report from the Committee on War Claims was not in order at that time. 'Yhether the rule as now revised accomplishes the purpuse or not, I am very sure that it was the intention of those who drafted ille rule to giye an equulity of opportunity for consideration to the bills reported Il'om both of these committees.

Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. If the gentleman will permit again, I think unquestionably it does not, because the committee in revising the rule had in mind the ruling which had been made upon pension language, and it used the same language with regard to claims and war claims that had been ru1ed upon in regard to pensions.

Mr. OAMPBELL. I am very sure that the intention was to give these bills similar status on claims day, and I think that a consistent ruling and a proper construction would give that ruling to this rule as it now reads.

The CHAIRMAN. The present occupant of the chair did not know he was going to be called upon to preside, and did not know that this question would be raL<::ed. Clause 6 of Rule XXIV pro Tides that-

On Friday of each week, after the disposal of such business on the Speaker's table as requires reference only, it shall be in o·rder to entertain a motion for the House to resolve itself into Committee of the Whole House to consider business on the Private Calendar in the follow~ ing order : On the second and fourth Fri~s of each month preference shall be given to the consid('.ration of private pension claims and bills removing political disabilities and bills removing the charge of desertion. On every Friday except the second and fourth Fridays the House shall give preference to the conside.ration of bills reported from the Committee ·on ClahDB .and the Committee on War Claims, alternating between the two committees.

3054 .CONGRESSION ..;\:L RECORD-HOUSE. FEBRUARY 6,

The present occupant of the chair does not pretend to be a parliamentarian, but as he understands the rule, and from the information he has upon the subject, he is inclined to believe that this clause means exactly what it says, and in view of that fact the Chair overrules the point of order.

Mr. :MANN. Mr. Chairman, may I be permitted to express the hope that the parliamentarian will make a note of the rule, so that we may at least hereafter have a consistent ruling, even though we change parliamentarians?

1\Ir. HARDWICK. If you go wrong once, you had better get right, no matter who is the parliamentarian.

1\:lr. MANN. The gentleman from Georgia at some future time might argue on the othe1~ side. [Laughter.]

Mr. HARDWICK. Oh, no. The gentleman from Georgia will not do that.

Mr. MANN. He was doing it two years ago.

NEW ENGLAND STEAMSHIP CO.

Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, I call up the bill H. R. 9848. The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will report it. The Clerk read as follows :

A bill (H. R. 9848) for the relief of the New England Steamship Co. Be it enacted, etc., That the claim of the New England Steamship Co.,

owner of the American steamer Commonwealth, injured in collision with the U. S. battleship New Hampshire, on or about July 7, 1912, in or near Newport Harbor, for and on account of the damage to said steamer Commonwealth by reason of said collision, may be submitted to and libel against the United States filed in the United States district court in the district in which suit ha.s been or shall be commenced by the United States to recover for the damage to the said battleship New Hampshire resulting from said collision, under and in compliance with the rules of said court sitting as a court of admiralty; and the said court shall have jurisdiction to hear and determine the whole controversy and to enter a judgment or decree for the amount of the damages sustained by reason of said collision, if any shall be found to be due, either for or against the United States, upon the same principles and measure of Uability, with costs, as In like cases in ad.miralty between private parties and with the same rights of appeal.

SEC. 2. That should damages be found to be due the said New England Steamship Co. as owner of said steamer Commonwealth, the amount o! the final jud~ment or decree therefor shall be paid out of any money in the United ;:states Treasury not otherwise appropriated : Provided, That said suit shall be brought and commenced not later than four months after the date of the passage of this act.

1\Ir. 1\IANN. .Mr. Chairman, I think there ought to be an explanation or statement given regarding the bill. I notice there is no report at all from any department on the bill.

l\Ir. STEPHENS of Mississippi. Mr. Chairman, it is very true that there is no report from any department, but it appeared to the committee that there was a collision between a vessel owned by the New England Steamship Co. and a Government vessel. The Government has filed a suit in one of the courts of New York, I believe, against this steamship company for damages. The purpose of this bill is simply to allow the steamship company to file a cross action in the suit that is now pending in order that the whole question as to liability for the accident may be determined and stated in the one suit.

It will be noted that there are several amendments. While there was nothing in writing from the department, these amendments were adopted at the suggestion of the department. The amendments are in regard to alleging that certain injuries occurred and certain damages were done. The bill as originally drafted stated that the vessel had been injured and certain damages had been suffered. These amendments were offered because of suggestions that came from the department. As I understand it, there is no objection whatever to the bill on the part of any Government official.

Mr. MANN. 1\fr. Chairman, will the gentleman yiel for a question?

The CHAIRMAN (Mr. RussELL). Does the gentleman yield? Mr. STEPHENS of Mississippi. Certainly. Mr. MANN. If this bill should pass and become a law, and

the steamship should file its cross libel and obtain a judgment on that, would it not be just like an ordinary judgment against the United States?

Mr. STEPHENS of Mississippi. It was not the intention of the committee that that should be the case.

Mr. MANN. What was the intention of the committee? Mr. STEPHENS of Mississippi. The purpose was to do as

has been done in several instances by this House, simply to allow the evidence to be heard and the matter adjusted in that particular.

Mr. MANN. It is to permit a judgment to be taken against the United States, is it not, if the facts warrant it?

1\fr. STEPHENS of Mississippi. I think that would be the effect of it, according to the way the bill reads.

Mr. MANN. The payment of ordinary judgments against the United States is provided for in the general deficiency appropriation bill. Why should you provide in this bill that this

judg~ent should be paid without taking the ordinary course of a judgment against the United St::tes?

Mr. STEPHENS of Mississippi. As I have stated, it was not the purpose of the committee that we should depart from the ordinary procedure in that respect.

Mr. MANN. Then section 2 of the bill ought to be stricken out, except the proviso, which might be attached to section 1.

Mr. STEPHENS of Mississippi. Section 2 is stricken out. Mr. MANN. I beg the gentleman's pardon. Mr. STEPHENS of Mississippi. There is a committee amend

ment striking out section 2. Mr. MANN. I do not know bow many prints of the bill there

are. · The copy of the bill which I have, as reported from the Committee on Claims, strikes out of section 2 a part of the language in line 16 and puts other language in place of it.

Mr. STEPHENS of Mississippi. The Clerk informs me that there were two prints of the bill. The later print strikes out section 2.

Ur. POU. Here it is, stricken out. Mr. 1\IAJ\TN. How is it possible for the committee to report

a bill with an amendment to a section and have the bill so printed, and then report another print of the bill with different provisions in it? It seems to me that when we get the print of a bill reported, especially where it has amendments printed in it, we ought to know that we can rely upon that, and not have the committee then tile some other bill as their report.

Mr. STEPHENS of Mississippi. The first print was an error on the part of somebody at the Printing Office.

Mr. MANN. Oh, I daresay that the Printing Office does not take the liberty of striking out the language in section 2-

Suit shall be brought and commenced-And inserting in lieu thereof the wordsCross libel shall be filed-Without warrant for it. It would be a serious reflection

upon the present administration of the Printing Office to say that they undertake to amend bills of the Ho.use when reported. When we get these copies of bills, I think we have a right to know whether they are correct or not. I obtained a copy of the bil1 and of the report, and it did not show that it was proposed to strike out section 2. I took the print of the bill which came in the ordinary course. I do not know how many prints there may have been since.

Mr. STEPHEJNS of Mississippi. I think this is the last print.

1\Ir. MAJ\TN. The gentleman thinks so, but, then, we have no guaranty of that.

Mr. STEPHENS of Mississippi. It is the one that is before the House now that we are called upon to act upon.

Mr. MANN. When a bill is reported, I do not know by what authority the clerks at the desk substitute another bill. I do not know where the clerks get authority, when a bill is reported to the desk, to substitute some other bill that somebody may bring to them.

Mr. HOWARD. May I ask the gentleman a question? Mr. STEPHENS of Mississippi. Yes. Mr. HOWARD. Was there not some finding of a maritime

board on this case? 1\Ir. STEPHENS of Mississippi. I think not. 1\Ir. HOWARD. Was there no investigation made by any of

the maritime authorities? Mr. STEPHENS of Mississippi. As far as I am informed,

there was not. However, a suit has been instituted by the Government against this priv'ate company, and they simply ask the right to file a cross libel so that the whole matter may be determined in that one action.

The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will report the committee amendments.

The Clerk read a·s follows : Page 1, line 4, after the word " Commonwealth," insert the words

"alleged to have been." The amendment was agreed to. Also the foUowing committee amendment: Page 1, line 8, after the word "the," insert the word "alleged." The amendment was agreed to. Also the following committee amendment: Page 1, line 10, after the word "and," insert the word "cross." The amendment was agreed to. · Also the following committee amendment: Page 2, line 10, after the word "appeal," insert the words "Pt·ovided,

'rhat said cross l!bel shall be filed not later than !our months after the passage oi' this act."

The amendment was agreed to. Also the following committee amendment: Page 2, lines 13 to 19, Inclusive, strike out aU of section 2.

1914 .. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3055 The amendlll€nt was .agreed to. Mr. STEPHENS of ~lississippi I move tllat the bill as

amended be Jaid aside to be reported to the Hous~ with a fayorable recommendation.

The motion was agreed to. ORDER OF !BUSL"'l'ESS.

Ur. POU. Mr. Chairman, I presume that the Clerk will call up these bills reported by the Committee on Claims, in accordance with the ruling, and I call up House bill 3468. That is the next bill.

Mr. 1\fANN. No; that is not the next bill. The CILHRl\IAN. Under the ruling which has been made,

the Chair thinks the committees would have the right to alternate.

nr:r. POU. I beg the pardon of the Chair. The ruling of the previous occupant of the chair [Mr. ADAIR] was that on -to-day bills from the Committee on Claims should be considered.

Mr. MANN. Number 19 on the Prirnte Calendar is next. Mr. POU. With the permission of the gentleman, I will ex

plain that the previous occupant of the chair ruled that on next Friday the Comm1ttee on War Claims should have preference, but that on to-day bills reported by the Committee on Claims shall have preference. I made a mistake in the ::lUmber of the next bilL I should have called up H. R. 7633.

The CHAIRMAN. The Chair now understands that the gentleman's statement is correct. The cferk will report the next bill on the calendar reported from the Committee on Claims.

CHARLES W. HAMMOND. DECEASED.

The Clerk read the bill (H. R. 7633) for the relief of the personal representatire of Charles ·w. Hammond, deceased, as fo11ows:

Be it enacted, etc., That the Secretary of the Treasur{ of the United ~tates is hereby authorized ~nd directed to pay, out o any money in the 'Treasury not otherwise appropriated, to the personal representative of Charles W. Hammond, deceased, the sum of $68 for services in carrying the mail between Macon and Albany, Ga., in 1860 and 1861.

1\Ir. SCOTT. Mr. Chairman, I desire to say with reference to this bill that while I was present at the meeting of the committee, I was called away just before the adjournment of the committee and before this matter was taken up. At the following meeting of the committee another bill of like character was brought to the attention of the committee and a question arose as to what the precedents had been, and that led to some investigation relative to the class of claims represented by this bill. This bill on its face represents a claim of the per-sonal representatives of Charles W. Hammond for $68, but .I find that it is but one of a very large class of claims and tha-t there were some other bills of the same class, I do not know how many, pending. In the Claims Committee there is a list of these claims aggregating between $200,000 and $300,000. They grow out of the circumstances occurring shortly after the beginning of the late Civil War, when the postal service was abandoned in the South. As a result there are a great many hundreds, possibly thousands, of claims throughout the South of this character, all of which are apparently for small amounts, but which in the aggregate amount to between $200,000 and $300,000. These claims have been before Congress at different times during the last half century, and for some l"eason have not been acknowledged. Before the bill is passed I believe th:::t the matter is of sufficient moment for the present Congress to hear and consider the reasons which controlled previous Congresses on this class of bills.

Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, with the consent of my colleagues on the committee, I will ask that the bill be passed over for the present.

l\1r. DENT. Does the gentleman mean until the next can? , · Mr. POU. Yes; until the next claims day. - The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman from North Carolina asks unanimous consent that this bill be passed over, without prejudice. until the next claims day. Is there objection?

There was no objection. HEIRS OF SAMUEL H. DONALDSON.

The next business on -the Private Calendar wai'J the bill {H. R. 34.68) for the relief of the heirs of the late Samuel H. Donaldson .

The Clerk read the bill, as follows: Be it enacted, etc., That the Secretary of the Treasury be, and .he

hereby is, authorized and directed to pay, out of any money in the Treasury not otherwise appropriated, to the llelrs of the late Samuel H. Donaldson, who died !rom injuries receiYed in the performance of his tlutles under the appraiser or merchandise at the port of New York, the sum of $5,000.

With the following committee amendment: In line 8, &trike out the figures " 5,000 " and insert the figures

" l,tiOO."

.1\fr. MA.l\'N. 1\lr. Chairman, I think that perhaps the policy of the committee and Congress ought to be established, in a way, with ref-erence to this class of claims. This is a personal-injm:y claim on account of the death of an employee of the Government. The bill provided for $5,000, but the committee reports an amendment making it $1,500. May I ask my distinguished friend from North Carolina whether $1,500 is intended, in a way: at least, as a year's salary?

Mr. POU. It is not. Mr. MANN. Upon what theory does the committee fix: the

amount? :1\fr. POU. On the theory, Mr. Chairman, that the committee

heard the evidence and thought that $1,500 was a very moderate amount to pay the heirs or the personal representatives of this man, on account of death without any fault on his part.

-I will say to the gentleman that the Commitee on Claims has had up the same question which was discussed here during the last Congress. We have decided that whatever may be the opiillon of individual gentlemen, so far as we are concerned we propose in the absence of a general law, to hear tl:.ese cases, I and wherever it appears that under similar circumstances a public service corporation would have been liable in damages, ' we propose to hold the Government Hable. In other words, we have determined, and I think I can speak for the entire committee, both "Republicans and Democrats, because I am glad to say there never has been any politics in any way in the com- • mittee since I have been chairman-we have decided that it is not fair or just for the Government to hide behind its sove:reignty w.hen a public-service corporation would have been liable under a ·given statement of facts.

Now, we have gone further than that, and I think we ought to be sustained by the House; we have said that wherever it appeaxs that an employee of the Government loses his life or is injured without any negligence whatever on his part, the Government should allow reasonable compensation, and if the policy of this country has not reached the point of making public-service corporations liable in such eases, I believe the day is near at hand when it will. .

Here is a typical case. Here is a laborer who was getting perhaps $3 a day-for the moment I do not recollect how . much-who, with,out any fault on his part, in the discharge of his duties lost his life. He had several little children dependent upon him. He had a wife at the time who has since died, largely, it was believed, on account of the shock that was inflicted upon her by reason of his sudden death. Here is a man who loses his all without any fault on his part. It would not be right to appraise the amount that the Government would . pa..v him in accordance with the daily wages he was receiving.

The Committee on Claims said it be-lieved the House would sustain us in this position. We think there ought to be a general law, but, in the absence of a general law, so long as we are for-eed to consider these cases we propose to do what is just and right. Here is a man, without any fault on his part, loses his life, and we say $1,500 is not only not too much but it is, perhaps, not as great an amount as the family ought to have under the circumstances.

Mr. COX. Will the gentleman yield? · ! l Mr. POU. Certainly. Mr. COX. Did not the House pass a. bill in the last Congress

giving a lady $8,000 who got injured down here in the Census Ofilce?

Mr. POU. The House did. The House passed a bill giving a woman $8,000 because, without any fault on her part, she had the scalp torn from her head; and I will say to my friend that this country is waking up upon this subject, and ought to wake up; and the Committee on Claims can do no better service, in my humble judgment, than to report these bills and thereby emphasize the necessity for a general law.

Mr. KELLY of Pennsylvania. How does the Committee on Claims make the basis for paying these claims?

Mr. POU. There is no basis, except to give what we think a· jury would probably assess in the same circumstances.

Mr. KELLY of Pennsylvania. There is no particular standard?

l\Ir. POU. No. I can not explain the basis upon which the 1 committee acts in any better way than to repeat, we are trying. to do what we believe to be fair and right. I will say just one ' thing more and then sit down, with the gentleman's permission.

Mr. JI.I.Alli'N. I have no objection to the gentleman from North Carolina proc€eding in my time. ·

Mr. POU. I want to say to the gentleman from illinoiS [Mr. :MANN] that we may as well ha-ve an understanding about this matter here and now, and I am sorry there is not n. larger attendance of the House present. We have a number of these bills. There are others coming in, and I make the predic-

3056 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. FEBRUARY 6,

tion-I ha-ve no authority to speak for the entire committeethat in eYery instance where it a!)pears that a laborer, an employee, a servant of the Government, was injured or lost .his life without any fault on his own part we shall put the bill on the calendar with a favorable report. Whether you gentlemen will sustnin us we do not know, but we are going to put that proposition up to you in tlle hope that in the course of time a general law may be passed to co-ver all of these cases and relieve the Committee on Claims from tlle necessity of their consideration.

Mr. LA.1"\GLEY. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield? Mr. POU. Yes. Mr. LAl~GLEY. I did not hear the first part of the gentle

man's statement, but to guide me in preparing for the consideration of the committee certain cases I have in mind I will ask the gentlemnn if the committee has fixed a rate of compensation in such cases?

:Mr. POU. No; we have not. We have no rule to go by except this: We hear the evidence, constitute ourselves in the nature of a jury, an<J, recommend to tllc House that it pay a fair and just amount.

1\fr. LAl'GLEY. The annual compensation an employee might ha1e been receiving will not control the committee then?

1\lr. POU. Of course, that enters as an element into our consideration, but I will say to the gentleman that there are cases in which the family of a man who receives $2 a day or $3 a day and who loses his life ought to get more than the family of a man who was worth a large amount of money.

Mr. LANGLEY. I thoroughly agree with the gentlemnn in th~ •

Mr. POU. 1Ye do not propose to be go-verned by the compensation of the laborer or employee, because, take, for instance, the case of a man who is worth $100,000 who loses his life. In that case his family would receive probably 5 per cent on tlle amount of money he was worth, or an income of, say, $5,000. Then take the case of another man who gets three or four dollar · a day. He loses his life and his family may be deprived.

Mr. LANGLEY. I ha-ve a case in mind where a deputy marshal was killed in my district-killed in the line of duty, without fault on his part. He lea-ves a widow and several small children, and they are practically destitute; and, if I can, I want to get at the idea of the committee as to the compensation in such a case, where the family is left in that condition. Also, what is the r\Jle where such a deputy is permanently injured, in the same circumstances? I have a case of that kind also.

Mr. POU. I can only state to the gentleman that I have answered before that the committee has no hard and fast rule, ancl I do not think it will adopt any. We merely bring in reports · which we think as nearly respond to the principles of equity and right in a given statement of facts as possible.

1\Ir. COX. And let each case stand or fall upon its own merits.

Mr. POU. Yes. Mr. TALCOTT of New York. Mr. Chairman, does the gentle

man think that a general law would be desirable, at least on tlle general principles of a workingmen's compensation law?

1\Ir. POU. I do not believe that a general law can be worked out in equity that is dependent upon the wages a man recei1es. That is the point I am protesting against, because there are cases where a man gets nothing at all, where his family ought to get more than the family of a man of means. But I am saying that the Committee on Claims has a tremendous task. We shrink fTom it when we see the number of bills, but we propose to do the best we can until Congress in its wisdom sees fit to appoint some agency which will determine these matters in contro1ersy or provide some general compensation act applying to employees of the Government.

l\fr. HOWARD. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield? l\fr. POU. The gentleman from Illinois [1\Ir. MANN] has the

floor. l\fr. HOW .A RD. Oh, I beg the gentleman's pardon. ~Ir. MANN. Mr. Chairman, up to within a few years ago it

had not been the policy of the Government of the United States, or in most instances, at least, the policy of the various States, to pay compensation for personal injuries in any case. Of course, occasionally there was a yariation from that policy, as in the case of the United States in the Ford Theater disaste::.· of some years ago. Congress in that case did make provision for the payment of compensation on account of death and injury there. It never had been the policy of the Committee on Claims prior, I believe, to the Sixty-first Congress, or possibly the Sixtieth Congress, to report any bills making any compen·Sation for the personal injury of Government employeP.s or of other persons who wero iujtB'ed through the negligence of Gov-

ernment employees or officinls. In the Sixtieth or the Sixtyfirst Congress, or possibly earlier, we passed a bill making compensation in certain hazardous employments of the Government, fixing the limit of one year's pay for persons who ·were injured in the service where the injury lasted <1uring the course of a year, and making compensation for an amount of pay due to a person where the injury lasted over 15 days. That was a distinct departure from the hitherto policy of the Government, along the more modern ideas of humane treatment.

I take it that the reason the Government in the first instance did not undertake to make itself liable for personal injuries was because in trying a case ·before a jury or a court, or, I might add, before this distinguished body of Representatives, the Government as a rule does not have much chance against the sympathy plea of somebody who has been injured or of survivors of somebody who has been killed in the Government service. .

Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman permit me to ask him a question?

Mr. M.ANN. Certainly. Mr. FOU. Take this case, for instanee-1\Ir. UA.l~. I shall discuss this case later. 1\Ir. POU. I was merely wanting to ask the gentleman if he

thinks we made lll;l error in giving this man $1,500? 1\fr. MANN. I will say to the gentleman I do not. I am not

complaining about the action of the committee in this case at all.

Then, after we had passed this general law, which applied only to certain llazardous occupations, we extended the general law to several additional hazardous occupations, always confining the total amotmt, or the upset amount, to one year's salary. I do not say that that is a just method for arriving at compensation. It was a method, and indicated the de ire of th~ Government to do something along those lines. Following that, the Committee on Claims in the next Congress, I think, succeeding the passage of this general law, reported in bills for employees engaged in the same hazardous occupations who had been injured before the law was passed, because the law applied only to those who were injured thereafter, but in each case confining their report to what would have been allowed under the general law if the person had been injured after the passage of the general law, the upset amount being one year's salary. In a very short time the Committee on Claims, moved by sympathetic and humane motives, concluded that one year's salary for some of these people was not enough, and so they reported more than one year's salary. Then the Committee on Claims was enabled to distinguish, where a man had actually been killed, between a hazardous occupation and one which was not hazardous, because they took the theory that if the man 1:ns killed, in his case, at least, the occupation was hazardous. A.nd they went outside of the classes provided under the general law and commenced to appropriate the same amount that would ha1e been gi1en to the person if the person had been injured in a hazardous occupation. Then they soon increased the amount.

I am not complaining, gentlemen, understand. 1\!eanwhile we had a commission appointed in reference to compensation of employees of the interstate transportation interests. They made a report recommending the passage of the bill, which, as I understand now, is probnbly as near defunct as perhaps legislation can get. Following that, the Committee on the Judiciary had some one of their members prepare ~ bill, which I think was first introduced by my colleague from Illinois [l\Ir. STERLING], then a Member of the House, which made compensation along the same liues for Government employees that had been recommended by the commission for employees o! the railroad.

I noticed the other day with pleasure that the distinguished gentleman from Alabama [:Mr. CLA.YTvN], the chairman of the Committee on the Judiciary-unless I am mistaken-reintroduced that bill, or at least introduced a bill, for the purpose of making compensation to Government employees generaJly. I quite agree with the proposition that we ha-ve reached that stage where, whether it is desirable to stop it or not, you can not stop it. From my own standpoint I ~1o not think it is desirable.

The other day we incorporated into the Post Office n.ppropriation bill, with some parliamentary :;kill, a proposition, which remained in, to pay postal employees up to the limit of $2.000 for death or a year and a half salary for injury, if the injury lasted that long. .

:Mr. BARTLETT. :May I interrupt the gentleman a moment? Mr. MANN. Certainly. Mr. BARTLETT. We had prior ~o that time a ·law which

paid the railway postal clerks $2,000. Mr. MAl\TN. · We had prior to that :ime a law which pahl the

postal clerks $2,000. It was made $2,000 on my motion. ·It was

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-_ HOUSE. 3057 Sl.OOO, and one day in the House I made a motion to amend by making it $2,000, and nobody voted ngainst it, I believe. It might properly be made more. .

Now, I do not know how the Committee on Claims reached tile amount it recommends, except as stated by the gentleman from North Carolina [Mr. Pou]. The amount in this case is not exorbitant, being $1,500, but it is quite evident that tile proce<lnre indicated by my friend from North Carolina [Mr. Pou] was hardly followed in this case. What did they have before them? A few statements from people who were not Government officials. The Government side of the case was not heard at all. There was no presentation by anybody in behalf of the Government against the allowance of the claim or as to the amount that should be allowed, and this distinguished committee only followl:'d the report that had been made by a prior distinguished Committee on Claims.

Mr. POU. I will say to the gentleman that in every instance the Committee on Claims inquires of the department whether jt has any facts, and if the department can give us any information we act upon that information.

Mr. MANN. I will say to my distinguished friend from Korth Carolina of course I do not know what information the committee had. All I can judge from is the information the committee reports to the House. In this case the committee reports to the House that it recommends the passage of the bill and· adopts a report made in the last Congress. And all the information-and they point to a number of statements-all the information in the report which was made in the last Congress is from parties interested, or from a police official, or something of that sort, in New York City, with no statement at all on behalf of anybody representing the Government, and no report called for from the Treasury Department as to the facts alleged by the claimant in this case.

Mr. BARTLETT. May I interrupt the gentleman? Mr. MANN. Certainly. Mr. BARTLETT. The gentleman knows that in England they .

have a compensation act covering all Government employees and all employees in the various corporations?

Mr. MANN. I am not familiar with it, but if the gentleman makes that statement about it I will accept it.

1\lr. BARTLETT. There was such an act passed by the English Parliament, which provides for payment of employees who are injured, both in the Government service and in various corporations outside of the Government.

I want to call attention to that for the purpose of saying that that act fixes the compensation to injured employees, or employees who are killed, along the line that has heretofore been suggested !Jy the gentleman from Illinois, fixing the risk to those engaged in hazardous employment. It seems that the act that did not pass the House last Congress, known as the workmen's compensation act, relating to employment on railroa<ls, fixed it along the line of what the man was receiving, both as to compensation for his injpries and compensation to his family if be was kiUed, or to those dependent upon him.

Mr. M.A1>."'N. As I recall the workmen's compensation act, it does not base the amount so much on what he is receiving as on what the injuries were that he received.

:Mr. BARTLETT. In case of death the cojllpensation was fixed at one-half of what he was receiving, which was paid for four yeFtrs. That is true.

Mr. MANN. I thought in case of death a certain amount was pr,:>vided to be paid to those dependent on the deceased for a series of years.

Mr. BARTLET".r. Yes . . One-half of what the deceased had been receiving was to be paid to his dependents for a term of four years. The maximum was $100 a month, I believe, and the minimum $50.

Mr. TALCOTT of New York. And it was provided that the money should not be paid to the families of the deceased unless they were dependent and the children were under 16 years of age?

Mr. BARTLETT. Yes. Mr. DIES. They also have an old-age pension system in

England, have they not? 1\Ir. BARTLET".r. Yes; and a service pension also. Mr. M.A1\"'N. Mr. Chairman, I do not want to detain the

committee, but I want to call attention to another proposition in reference to this subject. I recently introduced a bill to provide for payment of some amount to a letter carrier who was injured in the Postal Senice. I do not know whether he should recei,·e anything or not. I asked the distinguished chairman of the committee to refer that bm to the Post Office Department for information, which be most courteously did. 'l'he Post Office Department reported no information at an ou the bill aud made no im·estigatiou .of the facts alleged-in the bill or ·in

reference to the injury uhlch was alleged to have occurred, but, reported that they did · not believe the bill . ought to pass, because they were opposed to these personal bills and thought that there should be general legislation. -

Well, I agree with the Post Office Department in that respect-that it is more desirable to have general legislation than to ha-re personal legislation, although I fail to distinguish between this case or other cases where there is personal legislation and the bill which I introduced, so far as personal legislation is concerned, because I apprehend that Congress will not pass a law allowing compensation for injuries which have already occurred.

I would like to ask my di1. · ~nguished friend, the chairman of this committee [Mr. Pou], without endeavoring to commit him in any way whatever, whether he thinks t.hat a postal employee who may be injured in the service or who may be injured in the service before a law passes giving compensation generally is to be barred because the Post Office Department thinks there ought to be general legislation instead of personal legislation, while the employees of the Treasury Department are to be paid compensation in case of personal injury by personal bills?

Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, I do not hesitate at all to answer the gentleman. The committee does not act upon the recommendation of the department at all. The recommendation of the department is merely advisory, and I can see no reason for any distinction or discrimination. I will say to the gentleman that I have no doubt that the bill which he has introduced will have fair consideration--

1\Ir. 1\fANN. I know that--1\Ir. POU. And if the facts justify there will be an early and

favorable report 1\fr. l\f.Al\TN. Mr. Chairman, personally I believe that the

liability act that we have is not a fair one. It was, it is true, a step of progress when enacted . . But I do not think a year's pay, especially for a laboring man who is killed in the Government service through no negligence of his, who leaves perha11s a widow and small children, is a sufficient compensation if we nre to make any compensation at all. [Applause.]

I am glad to know that in this bill it is not provided that this man's children shall be paid so much as "compensation" for llis death. I remember seeing bills discussed here where the bil1s provided that some widows or children should be paid $300 "for compensation" for the death of their husbands and fathers. Well, that was a form, but it was a bad form.

1\Ir. BARTLETT. It happened to be a legal form. That is what the law calls it in a suit between an employee and an employer.

1\fr. l\1ANN. I understand; and I believe we should pay more, and I believe we ought to pass something in the nature of the Clayton bill.

1\lr. BARTLETT. This is true, that all amounts not paid ns compensation must be paid out as gratuities by a generous Government.

1\fr. 1\IANN. Yes. This is a generous gratuity. 1\Ir. BARTLETT. That is it. .Mr. HOWARD. Mr. Chairman, in this connection I desire to

make just a few observations, based upon my experience since I llave been a Member of this House.

I never was more thoroughly convinced in my life than I am at this stage of my experience in thls House that there ought to be some general legislation to relieve Congress from the consideration of bills of this class. In the first place, it takes up a very great amount of the time of Congress to pass them, and in the second place there is not one person out of one hundred, usually, who is injured who knows the course of procedure he should take to get compensation for any injury that he may incur while in the employ of the Government without any fault of his.

Further than that, I have another objection to legislation of this sort. and it is the manner of arriving at the amount of compensation to !Je paid. As has been suggested by the gentleman from Illinois [l\Ir. M.ANN], the Government's side, as a rule, is not heard, and probably those who furnish the evidence upon which the Committee on Claims acts have furnished biased evidence; that is, they have sympathy with the Hife or children of the deceased employee of the Government. These statements are not made under oath. They are not verified in any way, except that the chairman of the committee very properly refers a particnlar claim, when some Member .introduces it, to the department, and that department in turn reports to the committee its approval or disappro>al of the claim.

1\Ir. DIES. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield for .just n question?

The CHAIRMAN. Will the gentleman yicld1 .

3058 CONGRESSION .A.L REOO~-HOUSR. FEBRUARY 6,

Mr. HOWARD. Certainly. Mr. ·DIES. Do I understimd the gentleman's position to be

that he would subscribe to a general law embracing all the employees of the Government and providing compensation to all .injured employees o:f the Government, or their beneficiaries in case of death, or that he objects to a particular class of claims! Would he exclude n portion of the Government employees or would he embrace them all in a general law?

Mr. HOWARD. My idea is that all injured employees of the GoYernment ought to be put upon the same basis with the employees of any private corporation in this respect. that i:f the injured employee did not contribute to the accident by his own negligence, he ought to have a court that he can go into, whether he is working for the Gov"€l'nment or not; he ought to have a court to which he ean go, where he can establish his claim in a regular way· by the submission of the sworn testimony of himself and his witnesses, and where the Government itself can go with like evidence and be heard.

Mr. DIES. Would my colleague have that court given jurisdiction to decree final jndgment against the Government in the case he mentions.?

Mr. HOWARD. I should not see any objection to it. If we can not get a court of that character, that would mete out equal and exact justice, then our whole judicial system is wrong, because thousands of the claims of the people are being passed on daily by the courts that have competent jurisdiction.

Mr. DIES. Considering the slight sympathy we find here on the part of this body for the Treasury- of the United States, what sized verdicts do you think would be rendered down in Georgia against the Government of the United States in favor of men who were injured?

Mr. HOWARD. I will say that.! have seen just as outrageous verdicts rendered against certain public utility corporations in my experience as a Ia wyer, as I could ever hope to see rendered against the Government of the United States.

Now, the question of determining the value of a man's life is arrived at in a certain way by the courts of this country. They take the age at which he was injured and his earning capacity, and from those they compute what his life would be worth and reduce it to a cash basis. and they predicate the judgment, after the rendition of· the verdict of the jury, upon evidence of a competent character to show the value of that man's life~ Now, this committee in this particular case have rendered a decision in which they say that the children of the deceased are entitled to recover $1,500. In glancing at the facts in this case I notice that this man was 34 years old. If he was earning as much as $2 a day the payment of $1,500 to these little orphan children, ane 4 years old, one 7, one 9, and the other one 12, is not a<lequate compensation for the loss of the life of their father, which occurred without any fault of his.

The Government of the United States should not be niggardly with its employees when they are killed in the discharge of their duty, and it ought not to be niggardly, but it ought to treat them just as the courts of the country would treat them if they were working for private corporations.

Mr. Chairman, I will give the chairman of the committee the benefit of a case within my own knowledge. There is a gentleman working in the Atlanta post office, a splendid man, who lms spent 20 years in the service of the Government. He got into an elevator in the post-offiee building. That elevator was being run by a negro who was addicted to the use of cocaine. He was very much under the influence of that drug, but this old man did not know there was anything the matter with him. He got in the elevator, and the negro started it before he could get in, and as a result he was caught and had his hip crushed, his leg broken, and without any fault on the part of that old man he su!fered this injury and the loss of his salary for nearly 18 months.

Mr. DIES. What does the gentleman from Georgia think would have been a suitable verdict in that case? ·

Mr. HOWARD. He was about 56 years old when he was hurt, and I will say to the gentleman that if he should come in contact with a railroad engine in my State at a public crossing and should be similai'ly injured, I should consider myself licked in the trial of that case if I did not get him at least $6,000 or $7,000 verdict. Yet the Government of the United States not only refused to pay that faithful old employee his salary, which amounted to less than $100 a month, during the 18 months that he was lying upon a bed of pain and suffering~ but to this good hour he has not recovered a cent from the Government. How

· could he recover? He could not recover unless he had some Mem•ber of Congress close enough to him to take an interest in him, to introduce a bill for him and work for it before the Committee .on Claims and present bis ca~

Mr. YOUNG of North. Dakota'. Is it not a: fact that most of these parties who bring claims against the Government bring them through attorneys, and that the attorneys receiye a porti011 ot the amount that is voted oy- CongTess?

Mr. HOWARD. I do not know about that . · Mr. YOUNG o:f North Dakota.. In a case like this, if the

amount recommended for this man Denalds.on, $1.500, is agreed to, is it not fair to assume that a certain portion of: it is going to the attorneys, and that his fam±Iy will not receive all of that amount, and is not that one reason why this amount of $1.500 is not excessive?

Mr. HOWARD. I do not consider the amount excessive. In fact, I am talking about the proposttian that it is not enough, if he is entitled to anything. I do not know ahou.t the practice of lawyers representing claims before the Comn:rittee on Claims--

Mr. POU. I will say to my friend from Geo~a that there are very few of these personal injury cases in which there is any lawyer involved. We tlSIUllly wo1'k up these matters ourselves, and I may say that I d-o not believe. any lawyer appears before us or has anything to do with these claims in 15 per ~ent of the cases.

M:r. LANGLEY. It is nut necessary that they should appe:u; is it?

Mr. POU. Of course, we do nat need the help of lawyers. Mr. HOWARD. Oh, lawyers need no defense with me. I

believe that the lawyers do m0.re good in this n-e.rld than uny, other class of men on earth, ex£ept the preacl:u?r -. [Applause and laughter.] Some folks who are not la.wyers might not believe. that; but, as a matter of fact, I doubt -very seriously whether there is a lawyer up_an this floor ho would in the least doubt that statement~

Mr. LANGLEY. We admit it. Mr. ESCH. They admit it Mr. LOBECK. They must hang together, or they might hang

separately. [Laughter.] Mr. HOWARD. I do not know about hanging together, but

sometimes we fall to bang some fe.llow that ought to be hanged. The gentleman asked me wheth-er the lawyers might not get in, if we established a court of some sort for the consideration of these claims. There ought to be some sort of a court that would be open to claimants of this character, so that it would be advertised to the world that if you are injured in the service of the Government in the discharge of your duties yo'ij can go to some tribunal and get justice. And it ought not to be dependent upon your personal acquaintance or your influence with your Congressman or your Senator. Now, there is this old man that I spoke of a moment ago-

Mr. DIES. . I want to know if my friend from Georgia would include the employees of the Army and Navy, soldiers in the line and sailors in the Navy?

Mr. HOWARD. Why, my good friend, they have alreadY. been embraced. If you look at this pension bill that is com· ing up-

Mr. DIES. I am talking about those who are serving in the Army and Navy at the present time. Would you embrace those also as Government employees?

Mr. HOWARI). Why, Mr. Chairman, they are all taken care of. There is no man in the service of this Government in the Army or the Navy who, if. he were killed to-day in the line of duty, somebody would not get paid for his life more than these poor children of this man Donaldson are getting from this bill.

Mr. DIES. Will the gentleman yield? Mr. HOWARD. Yes. Mr. DIES. I am afraid my friend does not comprehend my

question. He would have this court established to have the cases tried before a jury where the accident occurred, rendering the verdicts against the Government on behalf of the employee. Would he have that embrace the soldiers of the Army and the sailors of the Navy?

Mr. HOWARD. No; I would not have it embrace the military or naval forces at all. It ought not to do it.

Mr. SISSON. Why not? Mr. HOWARD. Because the disability of a. soldier or a

sailor and all such claims ought to be passed on by the War and Navy Departments, because they would be in a better position to know the record of that particular soldier or sailor than anybody else.

Mr. GREEN of Iowa. Will the gentleman yield? Mr. HOWARD. Certainly. Mr. GREEN of Iowa~ I suppose the gentleman is aware

that there are now pending one or more bills before the House for a general compensation act for Government employees, and on the scale of a similar compensation act that was introduced for the benefit ot the railwaY. employees~ ·

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3059 Mr. HOWARD. I am glad to know that there is to be some

sort of compensation law for this class of Government employees. But in the last Congress, with 30 minutes' debate, with not more than 10 Members of this great body ever reading oue line of the bill, an employees' compensation act was rammed through tllis House that took the right of trial by jury from 3,000,000 American citizens, without an elective clause in it where they could have determined their cases by trial by jury.

Mr. DIES. Will the gentleman yield once more? Mr. HOWARD. Yes. Mr. DIES. Along with this compensation proposition for in

jury to Government employees is another proposition to pension an the aged employees of the Government, those who are no longer strong enough to render the service for which they are employed. Is my friend prepared to subscribe to pensions for decrepit Government servants?

1\lr. HOWARD. Not as long as I retain my present weak mentality. I will never vote for that kind of a law.

Mr. DIES. Does the gentleman think as a matter of gratuity and sympathy the Government should pay the employees injured in its service? If he does, why would he not be willing to pay the faithful employee, who has grown old in the service and can no longer serve the Government, something to retire upon in his old age?

Mr. HOWARD. The two propositions are different. In one you teach the Government employee who goes into the service or you say to him, "Have all the pleasure you can while in the service, you are young and active, spend all your money and throw it away, do not practice frugality and when you get old, although we have given you a good salary all your life because you haye worked for the Government we will put you in a different position than any other peop\e who pay taxes. We will give you enough to live on in your old age."

I think it would be the worst example that could be set on the face of the earth to let these civil-service employees of the Government understand that when they are decrepit and too old to follow work for the Government that they should receive a pension for the balance of their days.

But, I am in favor of this and I would vote for it to-day if I had the opportunity, and I would go back to my people with absolute certainty that they would approve it. I would, so far as I could, equalize the salaries of the Government employees and give them a salary that they could live on. I would not predicate their promotion in these departments upon the influence of some United States Senator or some Congressman to have him promoted over some man who had a better record because the other fellow did not have any influence. That is being done every day and Members know it.

But that is beside the question. The question I rose to address myself to the House upon was the method of procedme in the collection of damages against the Government of the United States for personal injuries where the employee is involved. I concur with the gentleman from Iowa [Mr. GREEN] and the gentleman from Illinois [Mr. MANN] that there ought to be some legislation of some sort where these injured employees can go and adjust their claims against the Government just as they could if they were injured by a private corporation:

1\lr. SISSON. Mr. Chairman, I do not know where the legislation along this line is going to end. But I draw a line of distinction between the cit~en working for a private corporation and one working for the Government. I do not believe it should permit the Federal Government to select out a class that happens to be fortunate enough to get their names on the pay roll and when they are injured pension them or their family, or when they die in the service or grow old in the service that they are to receive from the balance of the people of the Nation a part of what they, the taxpayers, earn. For this reason, if these men in this class are entitled to this favor at the hands of the GoYernment, performing some service directly for the Governme~t and paid for directly out of the Treasury, they are performmg no more necessary, useful, or essential function for the existence of the Government than is the man working in private life, working on the farm or in the factory or in the mine. There is no reason why you should make officeholders a favored class and should pay them when unfortunate and not pay the man on the farm or in the factory or in the mine and all the ch·il pursuits of life.

Mr. POU. Will the gentleman yield? Mr. SISSON. Certainly. .Mr. POU. That is the very reason why it is contended by

the committee that these claims ought to be paid. A man working in the mine or in the factory who is hurt has a right of action against the mine or factory owner, whereas the Government hides itself behind its sovereignty and says because it can not be sued, no rna tter how the man was injured, he shall

not have anything. That is the thing which the Committee on Claims says is not right.

Mr. SISSON. There is a distinction between a man working for a corporation or for an individual and for a man working for the Government, for this reason: The Government must exist and exist only through its agents, who only assume duties devolving upon them by law. The officeholder is not a master of those under him and the doctrine of master and servant can not apply. The officeholder, from President down to the lowest

·official, is nothing more or less than an employee of the Government of the United States, an employee of the masses of the people, doing only those things required of him by law to do. He can not direct his course; he can not direct his conduct ; he can not be in any way responsible for the methods that the officeholder may pursue. But in civil life the laborer does the work imposed upon him by order of his employer who is solely responsible for these orders and the condition of the tools, appliances, and machinery used by the laborer. In the Government certain duties set out in the statute are performed with the full knowledge of what those duties are, and the employee of the Government assumes all the risks of that employment.

The doctrine of negligence can not be imputed and never has been imputed to the whole people, because the whole people may not respond in damages; but a man who controls his own private business, who has the direction of it and the employment of men under it, has the opportunity to pro\ide safe machinery and safe places for his men to work. T·hat invoh·es a different proposition from all of the people of the United States, who can not and ought not to be put in a position where they themselves will respond to the negligence of the officeholder over whom they themselves can have no control and direction.

Mr. HOWARD. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield? Mr. SISSON. Yes. Mr. HOWARD. What is the Government of the United

States, if it is not a gigantic corporation, with a hundred million stockholders?

Mr. SISSON. There is a great deal of difference between a corporation which is, in a sense, the agent of the people in a governmental capacity and a corporation organized by virtue of the law of the sovereign for the purpose of transacting business in a certain way and for the purpose of profit. The Government can impose conditions on the corporation, can impose conditions on men engaged in business, and can require that in doing this line of business for profit you must assume certain obligations. If the Government officials should provide an unsafe building or an unsafe elevator, and a latent defect was unknown to the employee, there might be some equity in the Government respqnding in damages if the employee was' injured without negligence on his own part. But the great trouble is that the responsibility of the official is such that you can not punish him, because he loses no money by his own carelessness; it simply comes out of the people. When a man owns stock in a corporation he himself is punished, because he suffers financial loss, and it is in the nature of a punishment administered to him in order that he shall properly conduct his business. But here in this case the official of the Government has no responsibility of that kind attaching to him. He suffers no financial loss, ahd there is no inducement to him to be as careful as he would be in the case of a man owning stock in a corporation and electing officials to make money.

Mr. HOWARD. Will the gentleman yield? Mr. SISSON. I yield. .Mr. HOWARD. Does the gentleman contend that a corpora

tion is not liable in damages because of the negligence of an agent? -

Mr. SISSON. Absolutely, because the corporation also has to do business; but the stockholder himself must be responsible for his agents, and then the stockholder himself loses money by it; but a Government official himself does not lose anything by carelessness; it comes out of the taxpayer. The official is not interested in the corporation in a financial way.

Mr. HOWARD. Does the gentleman contend that if your agent-and he is the agent of the gentleman, and he is my agent, and the agent of every citizen of this country-is negligent, so negligent that he causes the death or the injury of an employee-does the gentleman contend that then the Government of the United States ought not to pay to the employee an adequate compensation for an injury caused by the negligence of the agent of the Government?

Mr. SISSON. But the gentleman has two propositions entirely mixed. The gentleman has me, a person, mixed with the Government.

Mr. HOWARD. But the gentleman is a stockholder in the Government.

3060 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-ROUSE. FEBRUARY 6,

Mr. SISSON, Oh, I am no stockholder in the Government in any sense of the word.

l\1r. HOWARD. But the gentleman is obliged to be a stockholder.

M.r. SISSON. There is no such thing as stock in a Government. That is the great trouble about the whole preposition. Men get confused with such comparison, for government is not established for profit, but for the good of the people. ·

Mr. HOWARD. The capital stock of this Goy-ernment is the amount of taxes levied on the people. That is the capital stock, and the gentleman contributes toward that, and that makes him a stockholder

Mr. SISSON. The genUeman is mistaken. As a matter of fact, there is no such thing as stock in a government. This tax is a contribution or burden imposed upon a citizen and never pays a dividend, but takes from the citizen a part of what he earns to support the Gove:rnment. There is no such thing as a man having property value in a government. The Government itself does not own a cent or a penny of property, except what it takes from the people. The only thing that the Government owns is what it takes away from the people. Even the pul>lic land belo~os to all of the people. The Government is made up of servants who perform certain duties imposed upon them by law. You have an agent in the White House and agents in this House and agents over there at the other end of the Capitol and agents on the Supreme Court bench. Those three different branches constitute the Government of the United States.

Mr. HOWARD. The distinguished citizen in the White House is the President of the coq>oration, and we at"e the board of directors. There is no b:ouble about that. It is a completely organized corporation..

Mr. DIES. But the gentleman is bound to admit t)lat it is not a corporation for profit.

Mr. HOW.ARD. Not at all. It is: a corporation usually for loss, but your profit and my profit in this great governmental corporation is the protection afforded me by it as a citizen and the blessings I enjoy by virtue of that citizenship.

1\Ir. SISSON. Mr. Chairman. I must decline to yield further. 1\Ir. HOWARD. But the. gentleman has an hour. Mr. SISSON. But I do not want to consume the hour. The

gentleman from Georgia [Mr. HowARD] is entirely wrong in assuming that the Federal Government and the people in their sovereign capacity ever can occupy the same relation to its employees that a corporation does to its employees, because the officials of the Government are not in the nature of a board of directors. They are servants performing duties imposed by law. The.y are the people who are controlling the Government and administering the laws of the Government.

The employee himself, to a certain extent, is just as much an agent of the Government, having certain_ duties devolving on him, as is the President of the United States. You may as well say that the President of the United States, if he is injured in the line of duty, shall be paid because of the- fact that he occupies a position as an official, and yet the man who directs a corporation, the man who controls the institution for a private corporation, he himself directing the movement, is not guilty and can not be guilty of such. acts as would cause the corporation to be liable to him, because he assumes the responsibility of management and control, and on the doctrine . of liability the man who controls another man, who directs another man, who himself controls the movements of another, and the place where he shall work-because of the fact that he is permitted to have this right-we say you ought to be responsible in damages if you are negligent and cause an injury. This hurts him, and it makes him more careful. It makes him provide good, safe places for the men to work. But with the Federal Government you have an entirely different proposition, because the Federal Government can act only through its agents. It acts only through those men who are elected to office, and then the Government itself ought not to be in a position where it shall be controlled under exactly the same conditions as a business institution is. The old adage that "the King can do no wrong " finds lodgment in this principle. In America the whole people can do no wrong. You can not impute negligence to it. You may impute negligence to the officials as persons. You may sue them, but you can not impute their negligence to all the people.

I do not want to put the Government in the same class with business institutions, and let the taxpayers of this country be submitted to judgments of all kind and character that may be obtained. But if you do; if you shall ever hold that a man doing sertice for the Government shall have the right to go into a court and recover from the balance of tile taxpayers w.ho are not so fortunate as to be connected with the pay roll, then

you must do as they have ·done in England and other free countries, go a step further and include every man performing his duty in private life, because he is just as much a part of the Government and as essential to the exi tence of the Goyernment as the man who holds a seat in Congress. If you admit thn:t the Government should respond in damages to its employees, then it must follow. as the night the day, that the Go.-ernment must assume a further duty of taking care of the old and infirm. And it is an unfair proposition to say to all the people of America who are not connected with the pay roll of the Federal Government that if a man should be aged while he is holding an office, they shall be further taxed for the purpose of paying him when he gets old, paying him when he is injured, when he himself is perhaps absolutely the cause of his injury. The man is forturu:tte to be able to hold office so long. He ought to save his salary and prepare for a rainy day. You are not going to be able to get through this House a bill that will say that a Government employee must be negligent before he can recover. You try it. You will find these Members of Congress who favor this pension system and the payment as a lump sum to the employees, when they find they are going to be able to control the legislation, will never pass a bill that will put the Government on the same basis as a private corporation. You are not going to be able to get it through, because they will abolish the negligence feature entirely and pay the employee whether negligent or not.

1\Ir. DIES. Does not my friend from Mississippi [1Ur. Srsso-N] think it will be about as fair, in fact fairm·, to take up a collection by taxation among the officeholders to give a sum of money to a f..Timer or laborer who is hurt trying to pay the taxes, as it would be to take up a general collection among the taxpayers to pay an officeb..older who is hurt? .

Mr. SISSON. I think the illustration used by the gentleman from Texas [Mr. DIEs] is very apt, and I am willing to adopt it in all its breadth and thickness.

.Mr. M.Al'I.TN. Will the gentleman yield? Mr. SISSON. I will. Mr. MANN. My distinguished friend from Texas ~Ir.

DIEs] injects a very pertinent observation. He is apparently against the bill, but I believe he is a member of the committee that reported it.

Mr. DIES. I will say to my frimd from illinois that I urn. only discussing the general principle of compensation for employees and compensation for job holders.

Mr. 1\fA.NN. Trying to get a way from the abstract to the concrete, I would like to hear my distinguished friend from Texns [l\fr. Dms], who is opposed to pensioning or paying compensation in any case, give the reason why he is in favor of giving it in this case?

Mr. SISSON. I now yield to the gentleman from Georgia [Mr. HowARD].

l\1r. HOWARD. I was following with a great deal of interest your statement of what you thlnk about paying the claims against the Government. Now, the great body at the other end of this Capitol just passed a bill providing that the Government shall go into the railroad business by constructing railroads throughout Alaska. By another bill they are going to buy the telegraph and telephone lines. I am not saying whether they ought to do so or not, but do you think if a man should be driving some reindeer up in Alaska, and without being given any warning an Alaskan government railroad engine should hit his sleigh and kill him and injure his reindeer and empty out his coal--

Mr. SISSON. Empty ont his ice. [Laughter.] MT. HOWARD. Or his ice; that the Government ought not

to p·ay for that negligence of the engineer on that Government engine?

Mr. SISSON. Now, whe.n the Government of the United States goes into business, when it assumes the function of managing private business, and assumes to do the things that private corporations do, then it will follow, of course, as the night the day, that they will have to assume the burdens which the corporations assume. But that is an entirely different proposition.

Now, you take, for example, the construction of the Panama Canal. Down there, for certain amounts, the officials and officers of the Panama Canal were authorized to settle claims where employees were tfljured, and frequently the settlement was made without going into the question of negligence of the employee. If it is a great amount, if it involves the death of the party, they generally go into an examination of the negligence, of his past, and what he was doing at the time of the accident._ Up to a certain amount they have settled those claims, and Col. Goethals relieved Congress and the courts of all that burden. Now, the Government did that because when

1914.; CONGRESSIONAL. RECORD-HOUSE. 3061 it goes into busi.aess, wh-en it goes to· take up the railroad anct telegraph lines, and all this dangerous busin-ess, then it must assume the burdens that private business bears_ But the G<i>vernment now, having its officials performing nothing but the ~fficial duties devolv1ng upon them,. is in an entirely different class from those employed to manage a railway.

Mr. HOW .ARD. Suppose we take a man who is killed by a parcel-post package falling on him and fi'R<!turing his skull.. The express companies and these other co-rporations are in the same business. Do you maintain that if they could recover from an expre-ss company the value of his life they ought not to reco-ver tile value of his life from the Government?

1\Ir-. SISSON. I will say, no; if the. man himself was managing the parcel-post package which fell on his head, they ought not to pay a cent. But I stated a moment ago that when the GoYernment is going into. all lines of business, as it looks like. it will do, then it becomes a business institution, and it may not be far distant wheu they will be manufacturing all t11e wool, and all the iron and steel, and doing everything that the citizen is now doing; :md when it does. and enjoys all the profits of that business, they provide for all the people, and the Go\"ernment of the United States should respond in damages because it is in business :for the profit of the people.

Mr. DYER ir. Chairman, will the gentleman yield 't Mr. HOWARD. Right in that connection will the. gmtlema.n

yield? Mr. 1\IA.DDR...'N'. Mr. Chairmftn, will the gentleman yield to

me for a question? The CH.A.IR...\M.N. Does the gentleman yield? Mr. SISSO~. I will y1eld to the gentleman from Illinoiii

[Mr. MADDEN}. Mr.. :&IADDEN. I sup-pose the gentleman from llississipp!

recalls tlle fact that only a week or tw0 ago the House passed the Post Office appropriation bill, in whic-h was included a pro·viso fo1~ the- payment of $2,000 if any person emplo.yed in the Postal Service shoold be unfortunate enough to lose his life while serving in the line of duty, and providing for the payment of his salary at full rate for one year and at half rate for the second yea.r to any employee of the Post Office Department who was unfortunate enough to be injured so as to prevent him from being able to continue to do his duty. Does tlre gentleman remember that?

Mr. SISSON. Yes; I remember that; but because that happens to be an item in one of the bills passed by the House- it does not necessarily follow that I agree to it. It doos not follow that I agree with everything that passes this House. I would hate to assume responsibility for everything that goes through both Houses of Congress during a sessi.on. [Laughte:r.]

l\Ir. MADDEN. But the gentleman voted for that bill, did he no-t?

Mr. SISSON. Yes; I voted tor the entire bill. I do not kn&w whether there was a ron call on it or not.

Mr. BRYAN. There was a roll call on the bill. Mr. SISSON. Yes. Mr. HOWARD. Now, speaking with refe1·ence to claims, the

gentleman and I ha.ve many co-nstituents interested in southern war claims, for cotton destroyed and taken, and so :forth. Now, what in the world is the necessity for this Congress to be

• burdened with passing a bill to refer such claims to the Court of Claims wh~, after the Court of Claims has adjudicated it and has reported it to Congress, Congress refuses to put it into an appropriation bill or refuses to pass the bill when it hus been put in'l

.Mr. SISSON_ What bas that to do with this proposition? l\fr. HOWARD. I am asking you what is your opinion. JUr. SISSON. Will the gentleman ask the question? Mr~ HOW A.RD. I am asking you now whether you do not

think it a foolish procedure to attempt to collect a claim against tllis Government in that way?

Mr. SISSON. Now, in answer to the question of the gentleman from Georgia [.Mr. HowARD] as to cotton claims and anything else by virtue of which any people furnish anything to the Government, that is a different proposition from the p1·oposition of pensioning old age and gi-ving pensions or gratuities to those :people who incur damages.

Mr~ HOWARD. The gentleman will excuse me. I do not think he understands the purport of my question. I asked if he did not tbink it was a foolish procedure that all of this red tape had to be gone through with before one of llis constituents or my constituents could get justice at the hands of Congressin the first place referring a bill to the Court of Claims and then--

Mr. SISSON. I do not think it is foolish, because I do not wisb to pass judgment upon Members of Congress in the Sen.ute and in the House, past and present, and say that they are !o.ol-

' . .

ish. That woui.d be equivalent to saying that the majority of the Members. of the Senate and the majority of the :Members of the House are fools, and I do not think thnt that is so at all. I do not think it is foolish in any sense of the word. I only say that Congress in its wisdom saw fit to take up each of these items one at a time.

Mr. DYER. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield'? Mr. SISSON. I will yield to the gentleman from 1\Dssouri. Mr. DYER. I understand the gentleman is opposed to this

bill? JUr. SISSON. I am opposed to the principle involved in this

bill. I want to be frank with the gentleman and with the House. As long as we are paying claims of this class to other people, as long as others all'e being paid, I am not singling out this particular claim or opposing it. I am not o-pposing that. I am simply opposed to the general proposition to which this legislation is gradually leading, and it will certainly follow that when you pension all of these propie-and I use the word "pensio-n" to cover the gratuities that you pay-when you pass a general law it will foUow that the taxpayers, who are paying the salaries of the Members o-f Congress and the employees of the Government :u·e going to demand that they be treated like all other citizens are- treated:. They are not going to permit you to select out the o-ffice--holding class--Government officials, civilservice employees-and pension them when they are injured in tbe performanee of their duty, while at the same time the private citizen is not pensioned when he is injured. That is what I am afraid of with respect to this legislation.

Mr. DYER. Does the gentleman hold' that an employee who is· injured in the- Government service through the negligence o:f! another perso-n should not in any case receive compensation for his injury?

l\Ir~ SISSON. As a general p:t:oposition, yes. There may be exceptional cases. That is the reason. why I assllllle that Congress has not been foolish in the pasL That is the reason why r assume that the RepubliC31l majorities have no.t been fo.olish in_ the past. That is the reascm why I assume that the Democratic maj_orities have not been foolish in the past. becaUBe there may be certain isolated cases where the employees of the Government are so much under the direction of their superioll' officer, dealing with some dangerous appliances or dealing with some machine that is dangerous in such a way that the employees have no right to control it, and by virtue of the curelessness of their superior officer are injm:ed, the Government ought to pay the damages. But it ought to be an exceptional case and not the general ruie.

l\Ir. DYER. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman allow me to put a specific case to him?

Mr. SISSON. Yes. Mr. DYER. .A case where an employee o-f the post office, in

passing through a train shed, gets a sack of mail thrown on him through the carelessness of another employee who is throwing a sack :from the car to the track. and it falls on him, and he suffers. injuries to the extent that he is absolutely, f<H' a number of years, totally incapacitated and paralyzed~ Would not that be a case where Congress would be justified in authorizing the payment of damages for the inju..ries received~

lllr. SISSON. If I were on the committee, that wo.uld de-pend entirely upon tlle conduct and the care exercised by the man injured If he were injured without any negligence on his pa.rt--

.Mr. DYER. .A.bsolutely--1\Ir. SISSON. If be were- injUl'ed witho-ut any negligence on

his part, I would be in favor o-f making that an exceptional case. Mr. DYER. There is a case just like that pending in the

Committee on Claims. Mr. SISSON. It is such cases as that whlch Congress in its

wisdom has seen fit in the past to make payment for. I presume that claims ha'te been paid that ought not to be paid, but the gentleman knows that many cases in court are lost that ought to be ~ined and that many cases are gained that ought to be lost.

Mr. LOBECK. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield right there?

The CRA.IRMAN. Does the gentleman yield? Mr. SISSON. Yes; I yield to the gentleman. Mr. LQBECK. The gentleman from Mississippi has made a

study of the civil service. I wish to state a case on which I ' would like to get the gentleman's opinion. I went up to one of the departments, because my attention was called to nn old man, and I found out from the chief that out of 223 employees, 72 men were over 72 years of age. They cost the Government from $85~()00 to $90,00() a year in salaries. when 30 or 35 young men or women who would cost from $30,000 to $35,000 could db the work. How would you handle th.ose old men?

. '


Mr. SISSO~. That is one of the evils of the civil service. That is one of the things that comes with the civil-service system; and if there is not some change, if there is not some law passed which will gradually eliminate those who reach certain ages, .so that they may know the time is coming when their connection with the Government is going to c~ase, so that they may begin to do like people do in private life, begin to economize and save something for old age, and observe the old Bible admonition and go to the ant for wisdom, then you must of necessity do something with the old employees in the civil service or else the Government service is going to suffer. I shall not call the name of the department, but--

1\fr. LOBECK. The Government is going to suffer. 1\fr. SISSON. The Government is going to suffer by the

ineiliciency of the service. The head of one of the departments called my attention to the fact that there were numbers of people in his department who could not get up to their offices if it were not for the elevators, and after they get there they are totally incapacitated for doing anything. Yet on account of their age, on account of their length of Eervice, they are drawing high snlaries f-rom the Government. Now, the civil service has been in operation just about long enough for the number of employees that live beyond the average length of life to be perhaps almost at the maximum. I do not know whether the number has reached that point or not, but it will be reached, and the time will come, which can be determined from the mortuary statistics, when the maximum number of old people will be in the service. Those who are too old to render any service are the ones who are an overhead charge, and it is perhaps more expensive to keep them there than it would be to retire them in some way. But I, as a citizen of this Republic, am unwilling to say to the man who bas lived under the roof of a Government building, who has without any thought on his part except the performance of routine duties which the graduate of an ordinary high school could perform-! am unwilling to say to him, "You may Jive as you please, you may squander your means, and when you get old I will take care of you, but the man living on the farm, the man working in the factory, the man working for wages everywhere else, the man who has to manage his own affairs must carve out his own small destiny in his own small way," as the majority of the people do. I am unwilling that those men should be taxed to pay the expenses of an old-age civil-service pension; and the old men and women in private life must either become a charge upon the Government in some poorhouse or some asylum or some one must care for him, or he must exercise economy and business judgment and save something to live on in a rainy day. I am unwilling to have that stamp of royalty placed upon a man who happens to hold a place in the civil service, and to say that the balance of the people of the United States owe him a livelihood for all time to come. [Applause.]

I am unwilling to admit that the holding of a Government position gives him the right, after serving a certain number of years, to call upon the taxpayers to contribute to him for the balance of his days to take care of him, when the man in private life must so manage his own affairs that he can take care of himself in old age. Therefore, if you shall ever have a civilservice pension list, the voters and taxpayers of the country will never permit you to single out this class and give. them the royal privilege of riding upon the backs of labor, not only while they are rendering Government service, but after they have ceased to render service to continue to remain upon the backs of the toilers of America. When you pension the civil-service employee, you must in justice pension the man who pays the taxes when be becomes unfortunate.

Mr. LOBECK. The gentleman waxes very eloquent, but we have a condition confronting us.

Mr. SISSON. The only question is whether it is true or false. Have I reached a true or false conclusion? Will the gentleman from Nebraska say here on this floor that he wants to single out and put in an excepted class the favored few who hold office, or that he wants to put them in a position where they can live all of their days as they please, and the people of his district be called upon-the old, the helpless, and the blind, in private life-to continue to contribute out of their earnings to take care of some employee of the Government who was not able to save or would not save a part of his salary?

Mr. DYER. How does the gentleman--Mr. SISSON. One moment. I will ask the gentleman from

Nebraska if he is willing to do that? Mr. LOBECK. I am interested in good service. Mr. SISSON. I ask you a direct question. You say I grew

eloquent. Now, I deny the mild impeachment, unless eloquence is the truth. If the gentleman means by eloquence that I have

,

told the truth about it, then there is no difference between him and me on the subject. .

.1\fr. LOBECK. The gentleman is always eloquent. 1\Ir. SISSON. Then I am always truthful. Mr. LOBECK. Well, I believe so; but we have a condition

that exists, and there ought to be a remedy provided for it. You have invited these men to take a civil-service examination and enter the service under certain conditions of employment.

Mr. SISSON. I never extended any invitation. 1\fr. LOBECK. The Government did. . 1\fr. SISSON. The invitations have always come to me. I

will tell you what I can do. I can go back to my district, and I could go back to my State, and, I believe, I could fill every office in the Federal Government, and I would never have to extend an invitation.

1\fr. LOBEOK. There are Democrats in my district who are complaining to-day about the civil service, which was instituted by a Democratic administration-

Mr. SISSON. They are complaining about it, and I believe they have a right to complain. There was a proposition which was contained in a nonpartisan bill supported on both sides of this Chamber, which I believe was reported upon the legislative bill, or one of the appropriation bills here, which made provision that after a civil-service employee had served for five years then he should be required to make a certain degree, and then, after serving five years more, he should be required to make another degree, of proficiency before he could be reported for the next higher service. In that way you would weed out the inefficient. This bill should have become the law. In that way you would retain in the Government service those men who are capable of earning their salaries, and then you would have constantly before the Government employee the idea that he might have to go back into private life.

Take the young man in college, when he gets back into private life he becomes economical. Do you want to take a way all the lessons taught by the ancient philosophers to their children, and to the children in medieval times-say to the children in modern times that we renounce these truths and the lessons of economy taught in the sacred writ; we have done away with the philosophy of the great philosophers of the past, who have taught the doctrine of frugality so as to live within your means and be able to pay your debts and support your family?

The great trouble in America to-day is that we are living vastly beyond our .JDeans. We have arrived at the most expensive age in the history of the world. w·e who are not able to live luxuriously are desirous of imitating others who live luxuriously. The Government employees are buying automobiles and pledging their salary in order to have the privilege of joy riding. 'rhe Government employees live like all other people-beyond their means. There is but one way by which you can exist in this cruel world. When God made the world, as He did, He made mouths that grow hungry, backs that grow cold, and He laid upon every man the injunction that by the sweat of his face shall he earn his daily bread. You here want to reverse that injunction and say to the Government employee, " If you go on the pay roll, we are not going to require the burdens of you that are required of citizenship; we are going to relieve you from being frugal; we are going to put you in a favored class, where the cold of winters will not freeze you, where leaky roofs wm not cause you sleepless nights, where penury and want will never stare you in the face as long as the Treasury of the United States can wring from the peoJ?le who pay the taxes enough to pay you a vension; we are going to provide for you the life of the butterfly that floats arounu during the summer when he ought to be laying something up, sipping flowers that grow in the gardens and fields of the world, and when he gets old and winter comes we are going to say you can keep on your good way; we will bring to you the flowers. You can have your life of luxury, because you are in the favored class, holding office under the Federal Government." I am not willing to reverse all the philosophy of the past. If any man has studied the history of philosophy, you will find that has been true. Are you going now to say that you are going to reverse all this?

Gentlemen, you may take your course, but I am going to take the advice of Holy Writ and ask Government employees to follow the example of the ant and lay by something in the summer so that when the winter comes they may have something to care for them. [Applause.]

Mr. LOBEOK. Will the gentleman yield? Mr. SISSON. Yes. Mr. LOBECK. The gentleman wiH lead the procession, will

he not? l\Ir. SISSON. I will. I have endeavored in my way to do that,

and you will pardon the personal allusion. .When I was a young

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE .. 3063

man, 18 years of age, I had been taught in an old-school Presbyterian family to imitate the ants. From the time I was 18 years old not one dollar was contributed to my support to this good hour, because the Civil War came on and what we had was destroyed. My father served f<mr years in the Confederate Army. He never during his entire existence made any complaint to his boys about the Federal Government or about the victory won. [Applause.] On the other hand, losing all that he had, he devoted four years of his life to what he in his heart knew to be right, and went back as a young man and a year or two after the war married my mother, and they together established a little home. I was bom 21 miles from a railroad, in a double log house, one room of which is now in existence.

I was taught that lesson by father. That was the lesson I learned then, and by virtue of a kind Providence I have been able, by what little success I have had, to put myself in a reasonable condition and where I hope my family will never suffer from want. [Applause.]

I do not know what would have happened if I had been born in luxury, and so I say to e-v~ry boy in America that you are blessed and not cursed when you are born in poverty. The most fortunate boy, if he has h<mest parents, is the boy born in poverty, because he has every incentive to energy and enterprise, and the great industries of this co1mtry-the min~s. the railroads, and the factories-are all calling for men. There iB not a good man whose services are valuable that is out of a job to-day. [App1:'lUSe.]

You find men doing mere manual labor that are out of a job, bnt the man who is capable of managing affairs in this country can always find a glorious opportunity. The boy that deserves more credit for success than any other is the boy born in luxury, with a silver spoon in his mouth, who has no opportunity to learn the lessons of economy and industry, who, despite all that, succeeds. He must have a great deal of initiative in him in order that he may succeed. But the boy born in poveTty, having had to work for his success, is made strong by the exercise of his individuality; and that is wnat has made the Americans the strong people of the world, because they came into the forests and built th.e homes and the United States. It made us strong. In order that you may have strong emp1oyees in the Government seni.ce you must keep that lesson before them. Let them understand tnat the rules that apply to men in private life will be applied to them, and when you do have a m€rit system irrespective of party connections and let them understand that the man that can do the most work and do it the best is the man that is going to be promoted and get the best salary, then you have a good system.

The be.st civil-service pension bill that can be passed is to have the civil-service law administered on the merit system and not on account of politics. That is what will make the Government employees tmderstand, as m.en in private life do, that they are going to be rewarded for services rendered. That is what we need. There is too much sickly sentimentality about these Government job13. They talk about it as if a man was making a sacrifice when he accepts a Government job. Ask these people in the galleries; ask the people who are writing you letters whether they are undesirable places. Why is it they all want them? They are glad to get into the Government service. I have now more applications than I could possibly fill, even if you were to throw down the civil-service doors. Men like these jobs that pay a hundred or a hundred and fifty or two hundred dollars a month. Yet you find men on this floor who, because some civil-service employee may write back to the district, are willing to exempt them from all the inclemencies of the weather of life and put them in a hothouse, to be cared for for all time to come.

Gentlemen, I have talked three or four times as long as I had intended to, but gentlemen having asked questions brought this matter up, and I have trespassed longer than I intended.

Mr. STAFFORD. Mr. Chairman, the principle involved in this bill is one that should receive the attention of every member of this committee. The only objection that can be raised to it is that it represents a practice of singling ou~ certain claims and submitting them to the House for consideration and not according this as a right to the general public when similarly situated. I was quite interested in the position taken by the gentleman from Texas [Mr. DIEs], who stated he favored this bill but was opposed to the general principle. I believe it should be the policy of the House to try to enact legislation co\ering all these different classes of cases and save the resp.eetive committees the burden of passing upon their respective merits. Because I believe ·that should be the practice I offered in the Post Office Committee and on the floor of the House when the Post Office appropriation bill was under consideration a measure that extended relief to all of the postal employees of

.- - _ ~- -

th-e country. The intention was to bring in the laborers, to bring in the menial employees who were not provided for in the amendment that was adopted by the House. I was quit~ surprised that gentlemen on the other side of the aisle did not accept my amendment. If they had, they would have been relieved of considering this kind of legislation. ·

This bill provides for an appropriation of $1,500 to be paid to the family of a menial employee of the Government. 'l'he provisi{)n that was adopted in the Post Office supply bill singled out those employees that had powerful organizations back of them, leaving out of consideration entirely the poor postal ezp.ployees, the laborers and mechanics, who are not organized, who have no representatives in the corridors looking after their interests to see that they would not be overlooked. The committee in its judgment saw fit to only single out railway mail clerks and letter carriers and :rural letter carriers and one or two other grades of the Postal Service, and left out of consideration the laborers who are obliged to do the heavy work, the carrying of weighty mail sacks, men who are engaged in a hazardous employment, and also the mechanics who are o\erseeing machinery that might subject them to injury. These were all left out.

But there were other objections I then raised to the consideration of that bill at that time, because we were seeking to pay $2,000 not to dependent relatives, but $2,000 to sons and daughters of full age, who would probably not be dependent. and~ not, in my opinion, entitled to the gratuity of the Government. In this particular · instance we provide for an appropriation of $1,500 to the heirs of this deceased labot·er. From the report it shows that the heirs are minor children, the oldest being at present 16 years of age.

The committee has departed from a policy that has been pursued for years and years in voting one year's salary, and has voted h-ere a lump-sum appropriation of $1,500. That brings up the large subject as to what should be the duty of the GoveTnment toward injured employees. I -can not subscribe to the principl-es enunciated by the gentleman from Mississippi [Mr. SissoN] in saying that Government employees are not entitled to the same consideration for compensation in case of injury as are those engaged in private employment. I think th.at when a Government employee is engaged in any line of work he should receive the same consideration as though he was employed in p1ivate employment. The gentleman from Mississippi says that they are the agents of the Go-vernment. Following out his argument to a logical extreme, you would have these agents of the Government working for nothing, working purely for the honor and glory, as some of the agents of the Government in this Chamber may do. But when you come to the question of workmen's compensation the principle that is being so generally extended in all the States to all the employees in private employment should be extended to Government employees. These State acts do not distinguish in case ot death as. to the character of the employment, but provide payment to the surviving dependent relatives-always dependent relatives-an amount generally based upon the salary which the dec.eased employee was receiving at the time o! his death.

Mr. FOWLER. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield? The CHAIRMAN. Does the gentleman from Wisconsin yield

to the gentleman !rom illinois? Mr. STAFFORD. In just a moment. Generally it is a

greater amount than $1,500. I know of no instance where so low an amount is paid to dependent immediate relatives as $1,500. Generally the minimum is $2,000, and sometimes $3,000 and more. I now yield to the gentleman.

Mr. FOWLER. The gentleman !rom Wisconsin indicates that he would place the Government employee on the same plane with the man employed in private business. Does he favor a general law to that effect?

Mr. STAFFORD. I most certainly favor a general law giving to every Government employee who is injured through accidental injury and not through any fault of his own--

Mr. BARTLETT. While engaged in the service? Mr. STAFFORD. While engaged in the service-a claipl,

along the lines recommended in the Post Office appropriation bill, to compensation for salary for a year at full pay, and during the second year, if he is still injured, at half pay; and if, perchance, during that time, or even at the time of his injury, he loses his life, to reward his dependent relatives-his immediate dependent relatives-by a stated amount along the lines of these workmen's compensation acts.

Mr. FOWLER. Then you do not favor it as a lump sum, but you favor it as based upon the salary of the employee?

Mr. STAFFORD. If the gentleman has studied these workmen-compensation acts which are in force in my State, and in the State of Michigan, and in the State of New York, and other

3064 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-_ HOUSE. FEBRUARY 6,

progressive States-! do not know whether the progressive State of Illinois has adopted a workmen's compensation act or not--

1\Ir. FOWLER. It has. 1\Ir. STAFFORD. Then the gentleman knows the amount

paid as a gratuity or as an insurance to the deceased's dependent reJatiyes is a fixed amount. So in my State $2,000, $3,000, and in some instances as high as $4,00Q-

l\£r. FOWLER. I understood tlle gentleman that he favored paying a salary for one year for the injury and half salary for tlle next year?

Mr. STAFJ<-.ORD. To the injured employee if he is disabled from employment for that time.

Mr. FOWLER. 'Vhy not pay the employee the full amount of his injury?

1\lr. STAFFORD. Do you mean to ·giye him the right to go into a court of law?

Mr. FOWLER. I am not saying that exactly. I am not fixing the way to get it. If you are going to recompense the injured employee, why not give him full compensation for the injury which he has sustained?

l\lr. STAFFORD. I think we are not very far apart. I belie>e very strongly that the National Government should be responsible for the same risks of employment as that of a private concern, and that there should be some board created that would determine what the value of that injury would be. Take it in the case of a postal employee, for example; if he should be so injured that he would be deprived of earning a livelihood the rest of his duys, he should be compensated for the injury along the lines of thes:e private workmen's compensation acts. I think the principle involved in those acts is a humanitarian one. It follows the modern idea that the employment should bear the risk of the burdens of all accidental injuries and should be charged with the liability resulting from that employment.

Mr. FOWLER. One question further now. The gentleman is a lawyer of considerable experience, I understand. He is in favor of extending to tile public employee the advantages of recovery for an injury, and I would like to ask him if he would extend also the rules of assumed risk and the rules of injury by a fellow servant?

Mr. STAFFORD. In reply to my friend from illinois, I wish to say to him that the modern principle expressed in workmen's compensation nets disposes of those two principles of assumed risk or of risk arising from the fellow-servant doctrine. The modern idea, which I ha.cl just stated before . the last question was propounded, is that the employment takes the burden. and all the attendant liabilities of that employment, and it should be charged with it. Just because the Govemment undertakes some private work, or even if it does not engage in a private line of work if the employee while engaged in his calling in his special line of duty is injured the Government should be responsible; and because of the fact that the old viewpoint was that the Government could not be sued, it was never intended that the Government should escape the full responsibility that the obligation of employment naturally assumed. So I should wipe a way, as all these workmen-compensation acts wipe away, the doctrine of assumed liability and the fellow-servant doctrine.

1\fr. FOWLER. Now, then, would you apply the rule of contributory negligence?

Mr. STAFFORD. Of course that brings up a wide subject, and I do not care about going into it at this time. It is a. question as to whether a person who is directly responsible for his own injury should be compensated either when employeu in private employment or by the Government. 0~ course n? s.t~te compensation act, so far as I am aware, recogmzes any liability on the part of the employer for an injury that is wholly the result of the person's own willful negligence. Now, many of the compensation acts do recognize the doctrine of partial contributory negligence, and it is referred to the compensation boards to determine what is the contributing cause and to what extent was the employee's negligence responsible for the injury.

:Mr. TALCOTT of New York. I fuink in some of the more recent laws there is a provision that it shall not be effective when it is intentional or due to intoxication.

Mr. STAFFOTID. And that brings up the subject of direct negligence.

1\lr. BARTLETT. I understand that the theory is carried in the different compensation acts as to the proportion of the damages.

1\Ir. S'l'AFFORD. It shall not be a bar to recovery unless the injury is due to his own deliberate act.

1\fr. BARTLETT. It directs what the damages shall be, but not the right to recover.

Mr. TALCOTT of New York. In these compensation laws the amount is fixed in the law.

Mr. STAFFORD. Take Wisconsin, which has the most advanced law· on the statute books. During the last session of the legislature it was amended so as to include cases of contributory negligence. The amount to be paid is determinate, but no person receives any compensation where the accident or the injury is the direct and exclusive result of his own negligence and where he is entirely at fault.

Mr. FOWLER Have you a provision in the Wisconsin law to that effect?

Mr. STAFFORD. Yes; we have, as I recall it. Mr. FOWLER. If a general law should be passed, a com

pensation act for Federal employees, would the gentleman favor such a provision in that law?

1\Ir. STAFFORD. I think no mistake would be made by the National Government if we were to folJow the Wisconsin compensation law and adopt it and extend it to all Government employees. I think that law is one that has been very well considered by students of this question and has been successful, so far as it has been put into operation.

Mr. FOWLER. Did the gentleman from Wisconsin help to thrash out that law?

Mr. STAFFORD. I have never ser>ed in the Wi!::consin Legislature, but I ha Ye given considerable attention to this question, and when I was out of Congress during the last term I not only studied that law, but I also studied the laws of other States on the subject; and when I was engaged in framing the bill that I have offered in the committee and to the House I followed somewhat the lines of that law. Of course I knew that if I should submit as an amendment to the Post Office appropriation bill a general law involving all grades of employment it would probably not be nccepted.

Mr. DO NOV AN. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman allow me an interruption there?

1\lr. STAFFORD. In just a moment. Then I shall be gla.d to yield to the gentleman. I knew that a provision extending the application of the law to every character of service would not be considered on the appropriation bill. Now I will yield to the gentleman.

1\Ir. DONOV A...~. Does the gentleman think he is doing his dt}ty under his oath by delaying an appropriation that has already been delayed nearly three years--an appropriation in _ the interest of poor children without a father and mother, whose father died with the lockjaw and the mother fell in the street? Is that statesmanship, sir, that you shall thus talk against time? If you had found a human being lying injured on the street, would you wait to discuss the question before you went for a doctor?

:Mr. STAFFORD. l\1r. Chairman, I decline to yield further. Tile CHAIRMAN. The gentleman declines to yield. l\Ir. DONOVAN. I do not think that is humane, but the gen

tleman must talk. 1\Ir. STAFFORD. 1\lr. Chairman, we are all accustomed to the

eccentric conduct of the gentleman from Connecticut. He assumes the rOle of public censor, and of course he. is qualifieo. to assume that role. I rose here to discuss the bill, and I do not need nuy suggestions from so short-serving a Member as the gentleman.

This bill represents a policy which I think should be restricted. I am entirely within my rights when I state my opinion.

.Mr. TALCOTT of New York. That is right. 1\Ir. STAFFORD. We should pass some general Jaw, so that

every employee would be entitled to this compensation without taking up the time of Congress with special bills, and I think I am doing a worthy service, notwithstanding the captious remarks of the ubiquitous gentleman from Connecticut. I contend that we would do much better if we were to pass some general law, so that all persons would ha>e the right to come into a private court, and not to compel minor children to go to Representatives in Congress and ask that they intercede, ask that they take up the time of the commUtee, to take up the time of the House, and take up the time of another body in passing upon their claims. It should be a right extended to all and known to all. I think the Committee on Claims could not have their time better employed than by bringing in a general bill that would extend compensation to all these cases. I recognize that it is beyond the jnrisdiction of the Committee on Claims--

1\Ir. POU. 1\Ir. Chairman, I wanted to say that to the gentleman. · 1\Ir. STAFFORD. Yet we should have something done that would take away these private cases from the attention of Congress. If these minor children are entitled to compensation, then all the minor children of persons similarly situated who have given up their lives should be compensated.

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3065 Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield? The CHAIRMAN. Does the gentleman yield? Mr. STAFFORD. I shall be glad to yield to my friend from

North Carolina. 1\fr. POU. Mr. Chairman, I -;vill say to my friend that nobody

realizes more forcibly than do the members of the Committee on Claims the truth of all that the gentleman has said. But to quote some language used by a distinguished Chief of this Nation some years ago, "It is a condition that confronts" the Committee on Claims and "not a theory."

1\Ir. GARDNER rose. Mr. McCOY. 1\fr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield to me? Mr. STAFFORD. Now, 1\fr. Chairman, I yield to my friend

from New Jersey [1\fr. McCoY]. 1\Ir. :l\fcCOY. Mr. Chairman, I want to say that there are

now in the hands of the Judiciary Committee six 'bills, I think, having for their purpose the granting of compensation to all injured employees of the Government. They are referred to a subcommittee, and I hope shortly the subcommittee will report them to the full committee, and I hope shortly that the committee will report them to the House favorably.

Mr. STAFFORD. Do they cover all Government employees or only certain branches of the service?

1\Ir. McCOY. They are general bills, covering all the civil emt;loyees of the Government.

Mr. STAFFORD. Is this legislation along the line of State compensation acts? Will the gentleman inform us?

Mr. 1\fcCOY. I will say that in certain respects it is, and in certain respects it is not. One bill is drawn on the basis of the so-called Brantley bill, referring to employees on interstate railroads. Another bill was drawn by the Commission for Industrial Legislation. The Bureau of Labor Stn.tistics in the Department of Labor has prepared a bill somewhat similar to the one I last mentioned, but differing in some respects; but they are both very comprehensive bills.

l\fr. DONOVAN. Mr. Chairman, I rise to a point of order. The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman will state it. 1\lr. DONOVAN . . The matter that is being debated here does

not seem to affect or be concerned with the question whether this ·appropriation should be $1,500 or less. The gentleman is giving a history of legislation on certain matters pending before a certain committee. It has nothing at all to do with the appropriation proposed here, whether it should be a certain amount or not. '

The CHAffil\IAN. The Chair thinks the point of order is well taken.

l\fr. STAFFORD. 1\Ir. Chairman, the question is what the policy of Congress should be, whether we should pay a certain amount, whether it should be $5,000 or $1,500. The gentleman from New Jersey [Mr. McCoY] was just enlightening the committee as to the policy of bil1s of a genernl charader, soon to be considered. I think we all ought to be thankful to the gentleman from N·ew Jersey for his statement that the Committee on the Judiciary is preparing legislation that will ayoid taking the time of Congress in considering these private bills. I am in favor of general legislation and not special legislation. I rose to point out that the time of Congress should not be taken up in the consideration and passage of these private bills, but that it should be saved that trouble by having some general law passed. .

I yield to the gentleman from Massachusetts [1\Ir. GARDNER].

1\Ir. GARDNER. 1\Ir. Chairman, I ask unanimous consent to extend my remarks in the RECORD in reference to certain details of the immigration bill.

The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman from Massachusetts [Mr. GARDNER] asks unanimous consent to extend his remarks in the RECORD in reference to the i:J;nmigration bill. Is there objection?

There was no objection. 1\fr. POU. 1\Ir. Chairman, I should like very much to get a

Tote. 1\.Ir. GREEN of Iowa. I should like not to exceed five minutes,

and possibly not more than three. 1\Ir. POU. I ask unanimous consent that at the close of the

remarks of the gentleman from Iowa all debate on this bill be considered closed.

The CHAIRl\IAN. The chairman of the Committee on Claims asks unanimous consent that all debate on this bill be closed at the end of five minutes, that time to be occupied by the gentleman from Iowa [1\Ir. GREEN]. Is there objection?

1\Ir. MANN. I object. 1\Ir. DONOVAN. Mr. Chairman, I make the point of no

quorum present. This is a ridiculous way of doing business.

LI--194

1\Ir. MANN. This part of it right now is the most ridiculous part.

Mr. DONOVAN. Mr. Chairman, I withdraw the point of no quorum.

1\fr. GREEN of Iowa. Mr. Chairman, I regret that the distinguished gentleman from Mississippi [Mr. SissoN] is not present at this time. I listened with great pleasure and interest to his eloquent remarks, but it seemed to me they had little. applica· tion to the bill which is under consideration.

To my mind it is a most monstrous doctrine that the Government of the United States should not be responsible for wrongs done by its agents in the course of their employment. The gentleman from Mississippi [Mr. SissoN] said he was opposed to this bill because the Government simply acted through agents, for whom the people were not responsible. On the contrary, the people are, or ought to be, responsible for the acts of their agents. The heads of departments ought to be responsible for the acts of their underemployees. The people ought to be responsible for the acts of those at the head of the Government, who are conducting its affairs, and they ought to respond in the same manner as a private institution should. In fact, I would go further than simply to make the Government responsible where its employees are injured. I would go as far as the most humanitarian in this humanitarian age. The modern doctrine is not so cruel and so harsh as it was in the times when it was thought necessary to protect the employer from damages claimed by his employees by doctrines of assumed risk and contributory negligence .. I would make the Government responsible in the same manner as the private individual. Bills have been introduced, and I hope they will shortly come before this House for consideration, taking up this most important subject. There is, as I think, a crying need that we should adopt some sort of uniform legislation in relation to these matters. The Committee on Claims is not so organized that it can properly consider these matters . . I served upon that committee for some time, and I know the difficulties under which it labors. It brings in here bills which are often subjected to criticism. Sometimes the criticism may be well directed, and yet the committee has done the best it could with the feeble means that are given to it for consideration of the matters before it. ·The results are not always equal, not always fair, and sometimes possibly not just, because they do not give to the aggrieved person the amount he ought to receive. This shows most emphatically that we need and ought to take up a bill for the compensation of all Government employees who are injured. And I would go even further than that. I believe that if the Government in the course of its operations causes injury and damage to any P.erson, that person ought to have the right to establish his claim against the Gov. ernment for the injury. If the Government causes injury or damage to some one who is not in its employment, that person ought to have some different means of obtaining redress than the means which are now afforded. These bills which are now before the House only provide for relief to Government employees. I expect to go further and to introduce a bill which will give relief to others who are injured by the Government. [Applause.]

1\Ir. POU. 1\Ir. Chairman, I ask for a vote on the bill. The CHAIR:&IA.N. The Clerk will report the committee

amendment. Mr. MANN. 1\Ir. Chairman, I suggest that the bill be read for

amendment under the five-minute rule. That is the ordinary procedure when general debate is :finished-to read the bill for amendment.

l\fr. POU. I ask that the Clerk read the bill, as suggested by the gentleman from Illinois.

The bill was read, as follows : Be it enacted, etc., That the Secretary of the Treasury be, and he

hereby is, authorized and directed to pay, out of any money in the Treasury not otherwise appropriated, to the heirs of the late Samuel H. Donaldson, who died from injuries received in tbe performance of his duties under the appraiser ot merchandise at the port of New York, the sum of $5,000.

With the following committee amendment: Line 8, strike out "$5,000" and insert In lieu thereof "$1,500." The amendment was agreed to. Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, I move that the bill be laid aside

to be reported to the House with a favorable recommendation. The motion was agreed to.

C. M. HAMMOND.

The Clerk rend the title of the bill (H. R. 10345) for the relief of C. M. Hammond.

1\Ir. POU. 1\Ir. Chairman, I will state in just a word the purpose of this bill, so that the committee may understand it. I apprehend that there can be no opposition to the bill. This

3066 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE .. FEBRUARY 6~.

man, 0. M. Hammond, sent $150 worth of internal~revenue stumps thi.·ough the mail--

Mr. MANN. }lr. Chairman, a parliamentary inquiry. Is general debate now in order? Has the bill been reported?

The CHAIRMAN. The bill has not been reported. Mr. McCOY. Mr. Chairman, a parliamentary inquiry. Do I

understand that general debate is in order in this kind of a proceeding?

The CHAIRMAN. Certainly it is in order, after the bill has b.ecn reported.

~.Ir. 1'\fcCOY. Then, I should like to go on record as having been in order when I was talking about the compensation bill. When I was engaged in a colloquy with the gentleman from Wisconsin [Ur. STAFFORD] about the bill pending in the Judicinry Committee on the matter of compensation, the Chair ruled that we were both out of order because we were not talking to the particular bill which was being considered. I may want to talk on compensation.

1\fr. BARTLETT. I beg to call the attention of the Chair and of the gentleman from New Jersey to the fact that we are not in Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union but we are in Committee of the Whole House for the considera~ tion of. IU;"ivnte bil_ls, and it is only on public bills, when the llouse IS m Comm1ttee of the Whole House on the state of the Union, that general debate on any subject is io. order as I understand it. So the Chair was absolutely right. '

Mr. McCOY. That is the point I want to have cleared up. The CHAIRMAN. The understanding of the Chair is that we

are in Committee of the Whole House on the Private Qalendar, and that when a Mmpber is recognized he is entitled to an hour but he must discuss the question before the House· and if th~ point of order is raised that be is not discussing th~ bill before tile House, the Chair must hold that he is out of order.

Mr. STAFFORD. The point is that if a Member is discussing the general subject of the bill he is in order.

Mr. MANN. Certaiuly he is in order. 1\lr. BARTLETT. ·r did not make that point. Mr. STAFFORD. We were discussing the general subject

then under consideration before the committee. The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will report the bill. The Clerk read as follows : Be it enacted, etc., That the sum of $150 be, and th~ same hereby is

npproprlated, out of any money in the United States Treasury not other~ wise appropriated, and the Secretary of the Treasury is hereby directed to pay to C. M. Hammond, of New York City, N. Y ..• a deputy collector of internal re~enue, in compensation for money paid by him into t;be Treasury of the United States for cigar stamps supposed to have been lost in the United States mails, but thereafter found and delivered to tba collector of Internal revenue at Albany, N. Y.

Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, there ought not to be any controversy, it seems to me, over this bill. The stamps appear to have been temporarily lost in the mail, but were afterwards found at a hotel. The Government has got the stamps back and this gentleman is charged with the value thereof, $150.

Mr. 1\f.ANN. Mr. Chairman. I certalnly have no disposition to make any criticism of the Committee on Claims or its reports, because I know the arduous work that that committee performs. May I ask the gentleman whether this bill was referred to the Treasury Department for any opinion in reference to · i' ~ and if so why the opinion was not put in the report?

l'lfr. POU. The letter of the Treasury Department came in on the date o:f February 2, after the report was printed. I have the letter in. my hand and will show it to the gentleman, if he wishes.

l\Ir. 1\fANN. Is it the policy of the Committee on Claims when they refer a bill to the Treasury Departmen.; for report to report the bill before they get the information?

Mr. POU. That is not the policy of the committee; it hap-pened in this one case.

1\Ir. BARTON. May I ask the gentleman a question? Mr. POU. Certainly. Mr. BARTON. Does the letter confirm the statement set out

here in the report? · Mr. POU. Absolutely. I will read it to the gentleman, if

he wishes. Ur. BARTON. No; I only -;van ted the gentleman's state-

ment. The Clerk read the bill for amendment. . Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, I ?JOve that the bill be laid aside,

to be reported to the House With a favorable recommendation. The motion was agree<l to.

Dll. L. W. CULDllEA.TH.

The next business on the Private Calendar was the bill :<H. R. 10763) for the relief of Dr. L. W. Culbreath.

The Clerk read the bill as follows : Be it -enacted, efJc., That the Secretary of the Treasury be, and .be is

llereby, authorized and directed to pay to Dr, L •. W. Crilbreatb, out of

any money in the Treasury not otherwise appropriated the sum of $1,000, as reward for his services in capturin~t.one Frank Hart alias W. B. Conrad, who robbed a mail car on train NO. 104, Illinois Central

·Railroad, at Memphis, Tenn., Ju."le 21, 1911.

1\fr. POU. Mr. Chairman, just a word of explanation about this bill. Tbis man Hart was an old offender. Gentlemen who have taken. the pains to r.ead the report, I think, will find the facts s~ffi~Iently stated. The United States attorney drew a bill or Indictment that contained four counts. Two were drawn under section 193 of the Criminal Code of the United States an.d tile third and fourth counts were under section 107. Now: thi.s man was allowed by the United States attorney to plead guilty to the first two counts in the indictment, and counts 3 and 4 were nol-prossed. Dr. Culbr th, who captured this old offender, would have received a reward without any action on the part of the Congress if Hart had been convicted under counts 3 and 4. It appears beyond all doubt-and the Post Office Department so states in a letter-that this offender was guilty under the counts under which Culbreath would hava received the reward. It is said that this man was an old offender, and it was suggested tb.at beeause Dr. Culbreath hap~ pened to catch him burglarizing a store it was perhaps his desire to cut Dr. Culbreath out of the reward. We believe, from every standpoint. tpat Dr. Culbreath should have $1,000.

Mr. MA.l"\TN. Mr. Chairman, as faT a -; I can ascertain from the report, the claimant in this case was not seeking the criminal for any offense that had been committed against the Government. The man was captured by a posse while burglarizing a store. The doctor was not hunting this m2.n for any cri.l:ce that he had committed against the United States, n.s far as tile report sho~s. Raving captured the man who was burglarizing the store, .1n order to protect the local citizens, it is discovered that the person captured has committed an ot:ense against the Uni~ed State~ laws. I do not see where the claimant has anY' eqmtable clrum against the Government. He might have had the legal claim against the Government, but it turns out that he has no legal claim because of a technicality. I will ask the gentleman from Tennessee, who introduced the bill, where a man makes a claim against the Government that is a teclmical claim, why the Government should not avail itself of a technical defense? ·

:Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. Mr. Chairman, the fact about it is this: After Hart had been taken by this posse the Federal authorities recognized him as an old offender and sought to obtain his person by arrangement with the State authorities. Ot course, the act that he was committing at 3tanton wa~ an offense against the State law, but the Federal authorities made an arrangement with the State authorities that the Federal Goverument should take charge of him instead of Jeaviug him in the State courts to be tried.

Mr. MANN. I understand, but the doct or would not ha•e received the $1,000 if the State had prosecuted the man. Now, if he had been malting a search for this offender, if he had been making etTorts to capture him, then when he was captureu and the Government did not prosecute on some count which would give the allowance, I think he would have a strong equitable claim. But it was a mere incident, so far as this claimant was concerned, that this offender happened to be an offender against the United States Government, because all the doctor was seeking to do was to protect the local authorities and the local citizens. He was not hunting this man because he had committed an offense.

Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. It is true, Dr. Culbreath is not engaged as a detective. He is a physician.

Mr. MANN. I am not speaking of detectives particularly. Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. It is true, perhaps, lle was not

out at that time hunting for this man. His professiou is that of a physician. ·

Mr. MANN. It is not likely that he Imew who the man was. Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. I think he knew of the robbery,

of the mail car, because that had excited a good deal of atten-tion.

1\fr. 1\IANN. Very likely. Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. I do not know that he thou2'ht

of this man at the time as being the man who committed the mail robbery. I have no information on that subject, but I do not think, if the gentleman from illinois will permit me, that under this reward provision of the law it was the intention that a man in order to obtain the reward should be engaged in the business of runr..ing down the criminal.

Mr. MANN. Not at all, but the intention was when the Government offered the reward that the man who should obtain the reward would give to the Government in some way some valuable information. This. man gave no information; he found a man burglarizing the store and seized him for that offense ..

1914. CONGRESSIONAL ~ECORD-HOUSE. 3067 The Government authorities, learning the name of the man, identified him as a criminal under the Government statutes and

. asked for his possession. Now, the doctor did not aid in any way toward that.

Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. The gentleman means in giving information as to the character of the man?

Mr. MANN. Yes. Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. No; so far as the report is

concerned, he did not. Still I think, if the gentleman is urging that as au objection, he is rather technical about it.

Mr. 1\IANN. I say that if a man under the law is technically entitled to a reward, he is entitled to it, but he is not technically entitled to it under the law. I do not see where he has any equitable claim for it. If he had rendered any service to the Government, the Government would pay him, but he has rendered no service to the Government.

1\Ir. GARRETT of Tennessee. Oh, he caught the criminal. 1\Ir. MANN. But he did not render any service to the Gov

ernment. He ~eized a man whom he found burglarizing a store, and the Government comes in and claims the man.

Mr. KIRKPATRICK. 1\fr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield?

Mr. MANN. Certainly. 1\Ir. KIRKP A 'IRICK. Had there been any reward offered at

any time by any authorities for the apprehension of this man? 1\lr. GARRETT of Tennessee. The statute · itself provides a

standing reward, as I understand it. 1\fr. KIRKPATRICK. But there had been no special offer? 1\lr. GARRETT of Tennessee. Oh, I suppose there was an

advertisement under the general law. They are often issued, and I suppose they were in this case. The general law provides for the reward.

Mr. STAFFORD. Not the law, but the general order of the department.

1\Ir. KIRKPATRICK. That is the point. 1\lr. GARRETT of Tennessee. Perhaps that is more accurate. Mr. STAFFORD. The order of the department is to pay

$:,ooo for the arrest and conviction of any person charged with robbing the United States mail. It is merely an order on the part of the department.

1\fr. POU. It is to encourage the apprehension of men who \iolate the law. Dr. Culbreath captured the man and the man was guilty. The department says he was. I differ with the gentleman from Illinois [Mr. MANN]. I do not see any reason \Yhy the Government should take ad\antage of a technicality and refuse to pay.

1\Ir. MANN. The only reason is that the claimant himself is taking advantage of a technicality to ask the money.

1\Ir. POU. Oh, I beg the gentleman's pardon. Dr. Culbreath saw a light in a store. If it had been some other man he might have gone by and not risked his life, but Dr. Culbreath went in there at the risk of his life, or at the risk of injury to limb or body. He captured this man and run him in, and it turned out that the man was an old offender that the United States Government was looking for.

1\:!r. 1\f.A.NN. But he did not do that becailse of the reward offered or because he knew any reward was offered. He did not know that, and he did not know that the man had anything to do with the offense for which he was finally prosecuted by the Government.

Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, I respectfully submit to my distinguished friend that that position ought not to be considered. The question is whether or not when he saw a man violating the law he went and caught him, and whether or not this is the man the Government was hunting for; and if we do not pay this reward there will be no incentive for other men to go out and take their lives in their hands to capture offenders.

1\Ir. MANN. I take it that is the position of the Committee on Claims. I would like to know why the Government of the United States shonld pay a Jeward of $1,000 because some citizen sees a light in a store and goes in and seizes a man burglarizing a store, a crime with which we have nothing to do; but that is the argument of the gentleman from North Carolina.

1\fr. POU. Oh, I beg the gentleman's pardon, but that is not my argument.

1\Ir. 1\fA.i~N. I wlll not undertake to say what the gentleman's argument is, but that is the way I take it.

Mr. POU. Perhaps I may be so yery obtuse that I do not make myself plain.

Mr. MANN. Oh, I never knew the gentleman to be guilty of that.

Mr. POU. But it does seem to me that this is the situation: Here is a reward offered for the capture of a certain man who is guilty of a certain offense. That reward does not apply to officers alone; it applies to anybody and everybody. A. man is

found robbing a store. Dr. Culbreath nabs him, and when he gets him in the United States court it is found that he is an old offender, and probably because the man was angered with Dr. Culbreath he said: "I will not submit to the offense which will entitle Dr. Culbreath to this reward, but I will submit to another offense and deprive him of the reward."

Mr. :.MA.NN. I think part of the gentleman's remarks are entirely gratuitous, when he says that the district attorney did wrong on a certain portion of the indictment, because, perhaps, he did not like Dr. Culbreath.

Mr. POU. Oh, I beg the gentleman's pardon. I did not say that about the district attorney. I said that this old offender probably said that, or had it in mind. The Post Office Department says that he is an old offender, and that they have been hunting him for a long time, and that he was probably guilty of other offenses. I was referring to Hart. I said nothing about the district attorney.

Mr. MANN. I do not see how the offender could determine what counts in the indictment he would be sentenced for.

Mr. POU. I think the gentleman, with his large practice in the courts, can very easily understand the position of a district attoruey, with hundreds of cases pressing him. When a man says he is willing to submit, and the district attorney knows he can inflict adequate punishment upon him if he does submit to a particular count, the district attorney is justified in adopting that course.

Mr. 1\IA.NN. I think it is rather far-fetched to say that the offender determines on what count he will be prosecuted and would plead guilty to certain counts in order to keep Dr. Culbreath from getting a reward, which probably he did not know anything about.

Mr. POU. The offender always selects the counts on which he offers to plead guilty.

Mr. MANN. Yes; but he does not determine whether he will be prosecuted on the other cCiunts.

Mr. POU. Of course that is true. 1\fr. GARRETT of Tennessee. Strange as it may seem, I

really think there is some truth in the suggestion that this man did plead guilty on these counts, and that there was an agreement that that would be accepted, this man agreeing to plead guilty in order to prevent Dr. Culbreath from getting this reward. But the district attorney wafi not a party to that purpose, of course.

I know the district attorney well, and have known him ever since I knew anybody.

Mr. MA.NN. The district attorney was a party to what took place.

Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. I do not think the district attorney thought about the reward at that time. The fact is there are letters from the district atton;tey in the department, and I have been over those papers. This man could have been easily convicted under these other counts, but for some reasonand I do not know just why-he was permitted to plead guilty upon these two counts, and his plea of guilty was accepted, and it disposed of the case. He got, I think, the same sentence that he would ha\e received if he had pleaded guilty to or been convicted under the other cotmts. I do not think there was any difference in the amount of the time of his sentence. It was one of those long indictments, with four counts, and they disposed of the case. The proof was there, the evidence was an in, and they simply disposed of the case in that sort of a way. The fact is, here was a good citizen who exercised the authority that a good citizen ought to exercise, and captured this man. Under the law, if the robber had been convicted upon certain counts, Dr. Culbreath would have been entitled to receive this reward as a matter of right. The robber could have been, by the admission of everybody, convicted on those counts. He was not, but he pleaded guilty upon other counts. The plea of guilty was accepted, and he was given the sentence. I do not see why Dr. Culbreath is not entitled to this.

Mr. MANN. Well, I am not going to discuss the matter and detain the committee, but the fact is that Dr. Culbreath did not do anything which equitably entitled him to the reward.

Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. I will say this to the gentleman, it is possibly due to my oversight that I did not inquire of Dr. Culbreath, although I have talked over this matter with him, as to whether he knew, at the time that this reward was outstanding, or whether he had any suspicions when he saw the light in that little store at Stanton, that this was the man who committed the mail-car robbery or not. I have not asked him about it. ·

Mr. MANN. Hence I am right in assuming that Dr. Culbreath did not.

1\Ir. GARRETT of Tennessee. The report does not show anything of that sort.


Mr. McKELLAR. Will the gentleman yield? Mr. MANN. Certainly. 1\fr. McKELLAR. Suppose he had no knowledge of it, that

it was purely an accident, and he had gone in and captured him just as the facts show he was captured, and he had been convicted on the third and fourth counts; that would clearly under the law entitle him to the reward?

1\Ir. MANN. Technically he would have received the money and technically be would have earned it.

Mr. McKELLAR. Is not this reward due to him? Mr. MANN. The question is, although he is not technically

entitled to it, you propose to remove the technicality and give it to him. He might have earned it technically, without any equities on his part at all. He might have earned it legally, but here is a case where he has not earned it legally, so far as I can see, and has no equity to it.

Mr. McKELLAR. Does not the gentleman think a man who is passing a store that is being robbed, and goes in and captures the robber, is equitably entitled to the reward that is offered by the Government for that robber? It seems to me he is.

Mr. M~"N. A man who passes a store where somebody is committing a breach of peace or violating the law and endeavors to stop it, having no reference whatever to the reward or the crime for which the reward is offered, is not legally entitled to the reward, and he has no equity.

Mr. POU. Nothing except to take the chance of getting killed. Mr. MANN. That had nothing to do with this case. It bas

not the slightest thing to do with it. l\Ir. GARRETT of Tennessee. Does the gentleman think in

order to be equitably entitled to it he should have been out hunting for the robber?

l\Ir. MA11."N. I think in order to be equitably entitled to it be must have done something for the purpose of getting hold of this man and getting information by which it could be secured.

Mr. GARRE'l"'T of Tennessee. But be got hold of the man. Mr. MANN. But for another purpose entirely. 1\Ir. GA TillETT of Tennessee. 1\Ir. Chairman, I ask unani

mous cou::..cnt that the report of the committee may be inserted in the RECORD.

The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman from Tennessee asks unanimous consent that the report of the committee on this case may be inserted in the REt:ORD. Is there objection?

.l\lr. MANN. May we not have it read?

. Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. Do you object to its being inserted without being read?

Mr. MANN. I will object unles~ it is read. I think it ought to be read for information. ·

Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. Mr. Chairman, then I ask unanimous consent that the report be read.

The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman from Tennessee [Mr. GARRET-T] asks unanimous consent that the report of the committee be read. Is there objection?

There was no objection. The Clerk read as follows: The Committee on Claims, to whom wa.s referred the bill (H. R.

107G3) for the relief of Dr. L. W. Culbreath, having considered the same, report thereon with a recommendation that it do pass.

The facts in this case are as follows : Order No. 3171 of the Post Office Department, under date of June 2 1010, provides that-

" On and after July 1, 1910 unless otherwise ordered, the Post Office Department will pay the following rewards, provided Congress shall make the neces~arY appropriation or authorize the payment of such rewards:

" First. One thousand dollars for the arrest and conviction of any person in the United States court on the chat·ge of robbing the mails while being conveyed in any mail car attached to a railway tot·ain, and in violation of the provisions set forth in section 197, Penal Code, act of March 4, 1909, which reads as follows:

''' ·whoever shall assault any person having lawful charge, control, or custody of any mail matter, with intent to rob, steal, or purloin such mail matter or any part thereof, .shall, for a first offense, be imprisoned not more than 10 years; and if in etiecting or attempting to effect such robbery he shall wound the person having custody of the muil, or put his life in jeopardy by the use of a dangerous weapon, or for a subsequent otiense, shall be imprisoned 25 years.' "

On .Tune 21, lUll, a mail car on train No. 104, Illinois Central Railroad, was robbed at Memphis, '.renn., by one Frank Hart, alias w·. B. Conrad, and an unidentified accomplice. Registered mail valued at $217 was taken, and the postal clerks in charge of said car were assaulted

ith dang-erous weapons. On July 5, 1011, Franlr Hart was captured by a posse, in char_ge of

Dr. L. W. Culbreath, while burglarizing a store at Stanton, Tenn. Thereafter IIurt was indicted under a bill drawn under section 193, Criminal Code of tbe United States, chargin" Hart with entering a mall cur by violence, and with the willful and malicious as ·ault upon and interference with postal clerks in discharge of their duties therein, there being two counls under this section. Counts 3 and 4 were drawn in a bill under section 197 of the code, and charged an assault with intent to rob the postal clerks and with robbing them. At the trial, by a~rel:'ment of the United States attorney, Hart was allowed to plead guilty to the first two counts of the indictment, while counts 3 and 4 were nol-prossed. It clearly appears that Hart could have been convicted thereon if the United States attorney had pressed for conviction. Therefore, under order No. 3171, the Post Office Department of the

Government offers a reward of 1,000 for the arrest· and conviction of a person charged with a certain offense. Dr. L. W. Culbreath arrests such a person and turns him over to the United Rtates Dntborities. The person is guilty of tbe offense charged; be could have been convicted; and it seems to the committee that morally the Government ought to pay this reward.

Letter from the Postmaster General, as appended hereto, is made a part of this report :

PosT OE'FICE DEPAnTME:-<T, OFFICE OF THE POSTMASTER GENERAL,

Washingtor•, D. 0., December 2~, 1!118. Hon. Eowo. W. Pou,

House of Representatives. SIR: I beg to acknowledge receipt of your communication dated De

cember 17, 1913, transmitting a copy of a bill for the relief of D1·. L. W. Culbreath (H. R. 10763 ), directing the payment of $1,000 "as reward for his services in capturing one Frank Hart, alias W. B. Conrad, who robbed a mail car on train No. 104, Dlinois Central Railroad, at Mempllis, Tenn., June 21, 1911." and requesting an expression of opinion relative to the merits of the claim.

The records of this department show that the above-mentioned mail car was robbed on June 21, 1911, at MPmphis, TP.un., by Fr:ml• Hart. alias W. B. Conrad, and an unidentified accomplice, and that registered mail valued at $217 wa.s obtained through this depredation after the postal clerks were assaulted and their lives placed in jeopardy by the use of dangerous weapons. The offenders escaped, and Franlt Bart was suosequently app-rehended by a. posse of which Dr. Culbreath was in charge, while burglarizing a store at Stanton, Tenn., July 5, 1911. .The posse in question were returning after a search for another crimmal, when tteir attention was attracted by a flush of light in the buildlng in which Hart was then operatin~.

The connection of Hart with the robbe-ry of the mail car was later established by po t-office inspectors, and he was indicted for the offense on four counts, the first two of which were drawn under section 193 of the Criminal Code of the United States, charging Hart with entering a mail car by violence and the willful and malicious assault upon and interference with postal clerks in the discharge of their duties therein ; and counts 3 and 4 of which, drawn under section 197 of the code, charged an assault with the intent to J'Ob the postal clerks and with the robbing of them.

At the trial, by agreement with the United States attorney in charge of the prosecution, Hart was allowed to plead guilty to the first two counts of the indictment, whHe counts 3 and 4 were nol-pro sed.

All the papNs were referred to the Assistant Attorney General for the Post Office Department for advice whether under the circumstances a reward could be legally paid in this case, nnd that officer advised that in view of the fact that Hart was convicted only on the counts drawn under section 193 of the code, a reward for which is not provided by the terms of order No. 3171, dated June 2, 1910, a copy of which is inclosed, no reward is legally payable or claimable under this offer, and advised, further, that paragraph 12 of said offer in fact expressly precludes consideration of such claims, the paragraph reading as follows :

"Twelfth. Unless the offense charged in the indictment under which an offender bas been convicted is enumerated in this offer of reward, a claim will not be entertained by the department."

The service rendered by Dt•. Culbreath W{'re such as would ordinarily entitle him to reward had Hart been convicted under section 197 of the code .

Respectfully, A. S. BURLESON, Postmaster General.

The CHAIRl\IAN. The Clerk will read the bill for amendment.

The bill was read in full. Mr. POU. 1\Ir. Chairman, I move that the bill be laid aside

with a favorable recommendation. The CHAIRMA.l.~. The gentleman from North Carolina moves

that the bill be laid aside with a fa1orable recommendation. The motion was agreed to.

MESSAGE FROM THE SENATE.

The committee informally rose; and Mr. ANsBERRY having taken the chair as Speaker pro tempore, a message from the Senate, by 1\Ir. Tulley, one of its clerks, announced that the Senate had passed without amendment the following resolution:

House concurrent resolution 31. Resoired by the House of RepresentaUties (the Senate oonc-twrinu>r.

That the State of Florida be, and is hereby, granted the prtvilege or placing in Statuary Hall of the Capitol the statue of John Gorrie, now deceased, who was a citi.zen of Florida, · illustrious for distinguished civic services.

The message also announced that the Senate had agreed to the reports of the committees of conference on the disagreeing votes of the two Houses on the amendments of the House to bills of the following titles :

S. 832. An act granting pensions and increase of pensions to certain soldiers and sailors of the Civil War and certain widows and dependent relatives of such soldiers and sailors;

S. 833. An act granting pensions and increase of pensions to certain soldiers and sailors of the Civil War and certain widows and dependent relativ~s of such soldiers and sailors; and

S. 834. An act granting pensions and increase of pensions to certain soldiers and sailors of the Civil War and certain widows and dependent relati1es of such soldiers and sailors.

T. S. WILLIAMS.

The committee resumed its session. The next business on the Private Calendar was the bill (H. R.

1055) for the relief of T. S. Williams. The bill was read, as follows: Be it enacted, etc., That $1,000, or so much thereof as may be found

due the claimant, be, and tbe same is hereby, authorized to be appropriated, out of any money in the Treasury of the United States not

1914 .. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE, 3069 otherwise appropriated, for the relief of T. S. Williams on aec:ount of services rendered as mail carrier to Williamsburg, Idaho, from January 1, 1901, to June 30, 1902, and the Secretary of the Treasury is hereby authorized and directed to pay over whatever amount that may be due T. S. Williams us stated by the Postmaster General.

.Also the following committee amendment was read : Str·ike out all of said bill after the enacting clause and substitute in

lien thereof the following : "That the Secretary of the Treasury be, and he is hereby, authorized

nnd directed to pay, out of any money in the Treasury not otherwise appropriated, to T. S. Williams the sum of $315.55, in full compensation for payments made by the said T. S. Williams to secure the service of a mail carrier from August 6, 1900, to June 30, 1902, at Williamsburg, Idaho."

1\fr. YOUNG of North Dakota. .Mr. Chairman, this is a very plain case. The facts are set forth in the committee report and show that the claimant is justly entitled to the amount recommended. I move that the committee amendment be agreed to.

Mr. MANN. Mr. Chairman, it looks to me as though it was a \ery plain case, although I do not look at it from the same standpoint as does my distinguished friend from North Dakota.

.As he has not explained the bill, it may · l:e proper to tell the House what it is. The Gov-ernment authorized the establishment of a post office at Williamsburg, Idaho, off the railroad. Under the law the Post Office Department, before a star route was established, authorized the postmaster at Williamsburg to employ a carrier to carry the mail between th-e railroad and Williamsburg at a rate of pay not to exceed, I think, threequarters of the postmaster's salary. Is that correct?

1\Ir. FRENCH. Two-thirds. Mr. MANN. Two-thirds of the postmaster·s salary . .And that

authority wns given to the postmaster by the Post Office Department. The bill as introduced provided for the payment o:f $1,000. During the time for which the claim was brought the postmaster received a total salary of $70.75. There was a little less than two years' time, and under the law the Post Office Department had authorized the postmaster to employ a carrier at a rate of pay not to exceed two-thirds of this $70.75. That was the law. The postmaster was informed of the law. The post office, I presume, had been established for the local convenience of the postmaster. He had been placed in charge. There was no mail there to speak of. The total salary of the postmaster for a year and 10 months or so was $70.75. That was 60 per cent of the receipts of the office, I take it. In addition he could pay two-thirds of that to the carrier. He employed a carrier, and at one time the carrier made a claim to the Post Office Department. The Post Office Department was prepared to pay the claim on the basis of twothirds of this salary, $70.75, or such portion of it as was covered by the time involved in the claim. The Post Office Department did not pay the carrier, because it did not know where to find him.

Now the postmaster comes 1n and says that he paid $600 durIng the period of time, which is stated to b-e 1 year, 9 months and 24 days, for a carrier, although the law did not authoriz~ him to, and although the Post Office Department did not authorize him to, and although he had been specifically told that he could employ a carrier on the basis of two-thirds of his own salary.

I presume that the claimant, 1\Ir. Williams, is now an old gentleman. I do not know, but I assume that he is wen along in years, because his memory is evidently very inaccurate. He says in various places that he paid $600 a year to this carrier, and he says in various other places that he paid the carrier at the rate of $25 a month. Certainly any man who is not well along in years can tell that $25 a month would not amount ta $600 in short of two years, and there is no pretense that the serv-ice performed covered more than a year and 10 months, or thereabouts. The recollection of a man whose memory is so inaccurate as to mistake $300 for $600 would not, to my Ill.ttld, be a sufficient basis for action here.

Why should we go now and pay this claim that has never been earned? The carrier himself was entitled to receive, and is entitled to receive, two-thirds of $70.75 if he can be found. Or if the postmaster paid that sum, I am quite willing to subrogate him into the rank of the carrier. But when a man employed by the Government is distinctly told, under orders by the department, that he can incur a liability only to a certain extent, and then for his own convenience and for his own benefit he increases that liability in the neighborhood of ten times that, and waits for years to present his claim to the Government, I can see no reason why the Go\ernment should pay the money.

Mr. Chairman, I reserv-e the balance of my time. 1\:fr. FRENCH. 1\Ir. Chairman, the bill as introduced provides

not that l\fr. Williams shall be compensated in the amount of $1,000. as hns been suggested, but in the amount of "a thousand dollars or so much thereof as may be found due the claimant,"

I introduced the bill before I was aware of the exact amount of his claim. The facts of the case are--

Mr. M.ANN. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield? Mr. FRENCH. Yes. Mr. MANN. Is the gentleman willing to leave the bill as it

stands without the amendment, and say it shall be "$1,000 or so much thereof as may be found due to the claimant"?

Mr. FRENCH. I think on the basis of what the Committee on Claims has determined is due, or upon what any jury that would consider the facts in the case might determine was due, I would be very willing to leave the language in the law as it was in my original draft of the bill.

Mr. MANN. Is the gentleman willing to leave in the originnl provision, which authorizes the payment of what may be found due the claimant, instead of a provision directing the Secretary of the Treasury to pay a fixed nmount?

1\!r. FBE.JCH. I will reach t.hat point in a few minutes and explain the difficulties that surround this case.

Mr. Chairman, the post office at Williamsburg, Idaho, was established, as has been stated, off the railroad. There was a small community there, with just one store. 1\Ir. Williams, having the most available and convenient place for the post office, was appointed postmaster. He was authorized by the department to employ a carrier for the period that has been mentioned by the gentleman who has just spoken-nearly two years. There is a conflict between the statements of the department and of· Mr. Williams upon the authorization that was given to Mr. Williams. The department insists that it authorized .M:r. Williams to employ a carrier at not to exceed two-thirds of the salary of the postmaster. Mr. Williams insists that he wns authorized to employ a carrier without any limitation.

Mr. MILLER. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield? The CHA.IR.MAl~. Does the g-entleman yield? Mr. FRENCH. Certainly. 1\Ir. 1\:ULLER. I think that is very essential in this case.

Is there any letter addressed to Mr. Williams or anything of that kind in the record?

Mr. FRENCH. No; there is no letter of that kind. Mr. M.A.l.~. There are three letters there, but nane on that

point. Mr. FRENCH. Yes; they are not on that point. 1\Ir. Williams

sets forth that he wns authorized. to employ the carrier. I think probably that Mr. Williams was mistaken, but he was acting upon what he believed was the authority conferred upon him by the department. He employed a man by the name of Lee Carter to carry the mail, at $25 a month, for nearly two years. The department called for bids on the route more than once, and the bids that came in were in the amount of $450 and $400 for carrying the mails three times a week. In other words, to the man who was willing to carry the mail 18 miles from Wayan to Williamsburg, counting the distance there and back, there would be paid less than $2 per trip. I submit that the bid was a very reasonable bid. T;be department rejected the bids over and ov-er, and finally, whether the carrier who submitted the final bid of $174 a year was assisted by the community or whether he was able to carry freight and express and passengers and in that way make up the lass that he would sustain by taking the contract at $174 per year, which is a little over a dollar per trip, the department awarded the contract for $1.74 per year for carrying the mails.

Mr. Williams, acting upon what he supposed was gooc. authority, paid out $25 a month for the period of nearly two years, or nearly $600-probably $550. I think that probably that v-ery amount could very well be paid to him under all the facts as set forth; but the committee took a di1'1'erent view. The committee said that the department awarded the contract for carrying the mall upon the basis of $174 a year. The committee said, "We can not see that we ought to go beyond that. \Ve will go that far, however, and figure the amount due 1\Ir. Williams upon the basis of the amount that was recited in the first contract for the carrying of the mail, which was $174 per annum, and, in other words, pay Mr. Williams $315.55."

I submit, gentlemen, that that is a debt that we ought to pay 1\lr. Williams, and that amount is little more than half of that which 1\Ir. Williams himself was required to pay for the handling of the service of this post office.

Mr. SHERWOOD. Has Mr. Williams already paid that? Mr. FRENCH. Mr. Williams has paid it. It has been sug

gested that the department was ready to pay Lee Carter, the carrier, two-thirds of the salary of the postmaster. The department never clid pay Lee Carter. After the time within which he should have been paid had lapsed, the department was authorized by an act of Congress to pay him, but it has never been able to locate Lee Carter. He was compensated by :Mr. Williams, and therefore ha,s no claim agf.!.inst the Post Office Depart·

3070 CONGI{ESSION AL. RECORD-HOUSE .. FEBRUARY 6,

ment or the Government. Mr. Williams, acting upon the authority that he thought he had, incurred this responsibility. We are now merely proposing to pay him a little more than half what he paid out, and that upon the basis of the very firs t contract tha t was let for the carrying of the mail to the Williamsburg post office. I think upon that statement of facts the House ought to pass this bill.

1\-Ir. SISSON. When was this service rendered? Mr. FH.ENCH. From August 6, 1900, to June 30, 1902. I

presented a bill in previous Congresses--Mr. SISSON. That was 11 years ago. Mr. FRENCH. Yes. I presented a bill on that subject to

the Congress before, but this is ' the first time it has been reported from the committee.

Mr. SISSON. How many times has it been before a committee of this House?

.Mr. FRENCH. ~ do not know. · I probably should have presented it in every Congress since it was called to my attention. 1\fr. Williams tried to recover from the department. There is a good deal of correspondence between him and the department. Finally he became convinced that he could not recover even the amount that was due Lee Carter. The department advised me that without any authority of Congress they were willing to pay the amount that was due Lee Carter if he could be found, but we could not locate him, and after spending a good deal of time in trying to locate him, and Mr. Williams not being able to do so, it finally seemed advisable to ask Congress to compensate Mr. Williams in this way.

Mr. SISSON. Can the gentleman tell how many people got mail at this post office?

Mr. FRENCH. I do not know. The receipts of the office haYe already been stated.

Mr. SISSON. They would indicate that the office was established for the convenience of Mr. Williams, the merchant there, rather than for the convenience of others.

Mr. FRENCH. Not at all. Mr. SISSON. Why should Williams have paid out of his own

pocket $25 a month to the carrier? Mr. FRENCH. Because he had no doubt that the Govern

ment would compensate him and supposed he was authorized to employ the carrier, and that he was employing him at a very reasonable compensation, less than $2 per trip, and he expected the contract to lle awarded at any time. The very fact that the Government did receive bids of between $400 and $450 a year for the carrying of the mail, but rejected them, suggests that Mr. Williams was well within prudence in paying $300 a year, if it had not been for the policy of the department to pay no more than two-thirds of the compensation of the postmaster.

Mr. STAFFORD. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield? Mr. FRENCH. I shall be glad to yield. Mr. STAFFORD. As I understood your reply to the gentle

man from Mississippi [Mr. SissoN], you stated that the department was willing to pay Mr. Carter, the mail messenger, if he could have been found? ·

Mr. FRENCH. Yes. Mr. STAFFORD. What did Mr. Carter have coming to him

from the Government if Mr. Williams had already paid him the $25 a month?

Mr. FRENCH. He had absolutely nothing, because Mr. Williams had paid him not only the amount that the Government was willing to pay, upon the basis of two-thirds of the salary of the postmaster, but had paid him several times that amount; or, in other words, upon the basis of $25 a month.

Mr. STAFFORD. If Mr. Carter had been paid as an employee of the postmaster, what cla im had Mr. Carter against the National Government?

Mr. FRENCH. Only that be was the one to whom the Government could technically pay the money.

Mr. STAFFORD. Pay how much? Mr. FRENCH. The amount of two-thirds of the postmas

ter's salary. Mr. STAFFORD. He bad already received it from the post

master, and much more. So, how did Mr. Carter have a claim against the Post Office Department?

Mr. FRENCH. It bad not cost the Government anything. The Government hnd not paid two-thirds of the salary of the postmaster, either to Carter or to Willians, fbr this service.

Mr. STAFFORD. But I understand that if Mr. Carter could be found now, he could put in a claim for two-thirds of the postmaster's salary.

Mr. FRENCH. He could put in a claim, but, · of course, the money appropriated for that purpose has lapsed, and it would require an act of Congress to authorize the department to pay even that amount to Carter.

Mr. STAFFORD. That is all Mr. Carter would have a claim against the Government ·for, merely two-thirds of the salary of the postmaster?

l\Ir. FRENCH. His legal claim would be represented by twothirds of the salary of the postmaster.

Mr. MONDELL. Does the gentleman know how much two· thirds of the salary of the postmaster at that time would be?

l\fr. FRIDNCH. Approximately. Mr. MANN. The salary of the postmaster was $70.75. Mr. STAFFORD. It was $64.04 for the period for which he

was carrying the mail. .Mr. FRENCH. The compensation of the postmaster was

$64.04. Mr. STAFFORD. Upon that basis the amount that would be

due to Mr. Carter would be two-thirds of that. Mr. FRENCH. Yes. .Mr. MANN. The compensation of the postmaster was $70.75 .

The gentleman is reading from the wrong place. Mr. FRENCH. Yes; that is right, $70.75. Mr. STAFFORD. I will direct the gentleman's attention to

the fact that the report of Dr. C. P. Granfield, Acting Postmaster General, shows that for the period during which service was performed by Lee Carter, from January · 1, 1901, to June 30, 1902, the salary of the postmaster was $64.0-!. That is stated on page 2 of the report.

Mr. MANN. The gentleman skips a line in reading. Mr. STAFFORD. I read the other line. I did not skip any

thing. Mr. MANN. The compensation of the postmaster for the

entire period from August 6, 1900, to June 30, 1902, was $70.75, and for the period during which service was performed by Lee Carter, from January 1, 1900, to June 30, 1902, was $60.04, but the postmaster performed service for the entire period.

Mr. STAFFORD. Lee Carter performed service for a part of the time.

Mr. MANN. The postmaster performed service for the entire time.

Mr. FRENCH. Yes. Mr. SISSON. Will the gentleman yield? Mr. FRENCH. With pleasure. Mr. SISSON. Why did not the carrier collect whatever was

due him from the Government? Mr. FRENCH. He supposed his dealings were with the

postmaster and he was fully satisfied; he was fully compensated. Mr. SISSON. Why did not the postmaster, every quarter, put

in his claim for whatever amount he had paid to Carter? Mr. FRENCH. If he had done that, he would have dis

covered the Inistake he was laboring under, . but he was expecting that the contract would be awarded at any time and the settlement would be made by the Government with him.

Mr. SISSON. It seems to me that if a person wants to establish a mail route and the Government declined to tJlke the star route or the rural carrier, if the merchant continues to pay the salary to the carrier and then the Government pays him, that would be a bad precedent.

Mr. FRENCH. Oh, no; under the statement the gentleman makes it ought to be done at the merchant's risk.

Mr. GISSON. Is it not true that he wanted it for his own benefit, and that he should as~ume all the risk?

Mr. FRENCH. No; he was laboring under what he thought be had authority to do, in doing what he did.

Mr. SISSON. If that was true, why did not be collect what was coming from the Government each quarter?

Mr. FRENCH. He ought to have done so. Mr. SISSON. It seems he had judgment enough to attend

to the post office. He evidently knew the postmaster's duties and what it would necessitate to keep the accounts of the amount. of postage which he canceled, and so forth. Knowing that, and the fact that he was paying $25 a month out of his own pocket, he ought not to have continued all that time with· out an investigation.

Mr. FRENCH. I think he ought to have made an investigation; but the very fact that he did not, but continued to pay the earlier, shows conclusively that he did not know the facts and was laboring under an erroneous notion.

Mr. SISSON. Does it not show that he had to have the serv· ice in the business, and he continued and took the chance of paying the carrier himself? Is not that the conclusion?

Mr. FRENCH. Not at all. The fact is the department ought to have awarded the contract a year or a year and a half before it did. If it had awarded the contract on the basis of a reasonable wage to be paid to the carrier, this would not have been necessary. Williams was not expecting that this matter would run month after month for nearly two years, but that the con·

1914 .. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3071' tract would be awarded after the first bids had gone in, .and Mr. FREL~CH. I think there were two. then after the second bids bad gone in; and the fact that the Air. STAFFORD. Because the carrier employed by the post-bids went in on the basis of $400 or $450 a year shows that the master was engaged in this serrice nearly two years. postmaster was paying a reasonable compensation. !tir. FRENCH. Yes.

1\Ir. LAFFERTY. Will the g~tleman yield? Mr. STAFFORD. There seems to have been laches some-Mr. FRENCH. Yes. where in not awarding this contract before the date · it was 1\Ir. LAFFERTY. Has the oost office there been abandoned awarded to a regular carrier.

since Carter quit carrying the inn.n:r Mr. FRENCH. Mr. Williams in his affidavit says that during 1\Ir. FRENCH. I suppose it is there now. I have had no that period there were two bids proposed. At one time be

occasion to inquire into it. states that the lowest bid was in the amount of $400 and the Mr. LAFFERTY. The contract was afterwards let for the other $450. The bids that were offered were in the amounts of

carrying of the mail? $400 and $450, and I submit that that amount is reasonable ..1\Ir. FRENCH. Yes; on the basis of $174 per annum. compensation for making a trip three days a week a distance ot Mr. LAFFERTY. How long did that continue, if you know? 18 miles. 1\Ir. FRENCH. Their contracts are usually -awarded for a Mr. STAFFORD. 1\Ir. Chairman, can the gentleman inform

period of four years, and I assume that that was the case here. the committee whether after the department received those bids The committee cut down the bill and said, "We will not com- there was any consideration given by the department to the pensate Mr. Williams for all he has paid out, but we are willing abolishment of this small office that only brought in a return to compensate him for the amount for which the contract was sufficient to pay the postmaster his meager salary, for the salawarded." .ary of $70 during this period would be taken entirely by the

Mr. LAFFERTY. The gentleman has no knowledge that it _postmaster, -and nothing would !l'emain for the Go""rernment for has. discontinued the Williams post office? its part of the service?

1\Ir. FRENCH. No; and if it was, that would not modify the Mr. FRENCH. Mr. Chairman, I would not suppose the Gov-facts in this case. The services were performed and paid for ernment would think of discontinuing the office. The fact of at the time. the business is there are thousands and thousands of offices

1\Ir. LAFFERTY. Is it not true that the department never scattered throughout the country that do not pay as much comestablishes a post office for the convenience of a merchant, but pensation to the postmasters as has been suggested was paid to that it is confined to patrons and their convenience throughout the postmaster in that office. the route? Mr. STAFFORD. I would not want to take the gentleman's

1\Ir. FRENCH. Oh, I do not assume that anyone took seri- statement that there were thousands and thousands of post ously the remark that it was for the accommodation of Mr. Wil- o:ffi.ees that pay less than $70 for a. two-year period. I think Iiams for a minute. there are rare cases, but not thousands and thousands. ·

1\Ir. COX. Will the gentleman yield? Mr. FRENCH. It may not be that there are as many as I Mr. FRENCH. Yes. think, but I think the gentleman will find that in all the western Mr. COX. I think I read the gentleman's bill and the report country the history of the small post office and the history of

of the committee on it. If I .remember correctly, the Assistant the development of that country is that post offices are mainPostmaster General, Dr. Grandfield, said that the amount which tained as means of building up the country, of drawing people could be allowed under conditions such as this claimant is seek- to those settlements, and that it is necessary in innumerable ing to recover for now would be a sum equal to two-thirds of instances, and I think thousands and thousands-unless the the salary of the postmaster. gentleman pin it down to this particular moment-of fonrth-

Mr. FRENCH. Yes; under the law. class post offices have been conducted for as long a period of Mr. COX. How would that compare with the amount that is time a~ I suggest here without any greater compensation than

allowed in this bill? was paid to the postmaster at Williamsburg. 1\Ir. FRENCH. Oh, that would only be two-thirds of $70.75, .Mr. STAFFORD. T.hat was the condition, I may say to the

or something like $47. gentleman, -prior to the establishment of the rural-carrier serv-:Mr. COX. If I understood the gentleman's case when I read ice, but upon the establishment of the rural-carrier service, up

the bill and report, under the law, as it existed at that time to date, some thirty or forty thousand fourth-class post offices and as it exists to-day, the only amount which the postmaster have been discontinued. I recognize that in the western connwould have been justified in paying the ca.rrier would have been try, where rural-carrier service iS not feasible and where the two-thirds of the postmaster's salary. people must be served by the star-route service, the star-route

Mr. FRENCH. That is all he was authorized under the law carri-ers perform a service similar to the rural carrier, and these and the department to pay~ The postmaster evidently misun- post offices are matters of convenience and necessity, and to that derstood the authorization, because the departm-ent insists that country the remarks of the gentleman are pertinent. the authorization was the usual one and is the authorization Mr. FRENCH. And the people there are very glad to ab.an-gi"ren to other postmasters. don the smaller post offices for the rural routes, and are pray-

Mr. COX. That was the law at that tim'e? ing for the time when they ma.y h.ave the whole western country 1\Ir. FRENCH. Yes. co:::mected np by rural routes the same as in the more thickly, Mr. COX. And is th~ law to-day. populated counties of probably the gentleman's State. U.r~ FRENCH. Yes. Mr. STAFFORD. The gentleman brings up a live subject, 1\Ir. MILLER. Will the gentleman yield? and I do not wish to go at length into that phase of it; but I Mr. FRENCH. Certainly. would like to· have the gentleman's opinion why, though the Mr . .1\fiLLER. Does the gentleman think a. party could have star-route service is of the same character as the rural-route

been secured to carry that mail for two-thirds of the post- service, the people in th-e western country favor the .rural service master's salary? over the star route?

1Ur. FRENCH. Not at aU, as I have repeatedly stated; as Mr. FRENCH. Just a· word on that point, although it is not the bids went in they were $400 01: $450. pertinent to this bill. The star-route carrier usually follows

Mr. MILLER. Where a postmaster is authorized to contract the same route in returning that be takes in going from the for carrying the mail, was there any possible way by which be office. A rural-route carrier has his route laid out with respect could know what his annual salary would be? to settlement. The star-route carrier has his route laid out

Mr. FRENCH. None at all. He would have to figure on the with respect to the contract price or the nearest distance be-small basis of a few days' service. tween offices to be served, and upon that basis be serves not the

Mr. MANN. He knew how many letters he wr.ote in his busi- greatest number but those merely along the road. nes~, if he knew anything. I reserve the balance of my time.

1\Ir. STAFFORD. .Mr. Chairman, can the gentleman inform Mr. MANN. Mr. Chairman, just a word more. I stated a the committee when bids for the star-route service were first while ago that the postmaster in these fourth-class post offices ad\ertised for? gets 60 per cent of the receipts of his office, but my recollection

M.r. FRENCH. I - believe the department does not indicate now 'is that he gets the entire a.mo11.Dt up to ~50 a year, so that the date. There is no stated time of the department when the ber~ we are presented with a _proposition where a man wants a route was advertised or the bids called for. -post office mainly for his own convenience, where he gets all o~

Mr. STAFFORD. The gentleman has stated several times the money that is received, is authorized. to pay two-thirds more that the department made several efforts to have this contract in order to have the mail brought to his office, where before ·awarded: to some ca:rrier, but because of the pri.ce they refused. he had to go after it b.i.Irulelf, t1nd then, in addition, wants the r am curious to .ascertain how many and bow frequently after . Government to pay him a eonsid-erable -sum over what is au:the establishment of the office such efforts were made. thorized by law. I am not entirely unfamiliar with claims in

•

3072 CONGRESS! ON AL RECORD-HOUSE. FEBRUARY 6,

reference to matters somewhat similar to this. If this bill only were to be passed and there were no other claims like it, I would not waste the time of the House to call attention to it, but there are thousands of claims now or would be thousands of claims of similar cases where post offices have been established in a. new neighborhood for the convenience of the people there, including the man who kept the store and who is made the postmaster, where they have been told the terms· ~pon which the office could be established, so that they have known that they would have to pay for the bringing of the ·mail to and from the railroad, in the main, out of their own ·pocket. That seems like a very unfair thing on the part of the Government on the one side. I presented in the House the other day a proposition to permit a. slight increase in accordance with promise.s which have been made by the Post Office Department to clerks in charge of substations in cities, which the House very generously voted down through the assistance of gentlemen coming from districts where they have fourth-class post offices, and we were told in the House why these substations are established, that they bring business to the drug stores where they have the substations. I have known cases where a man received $50 a year from the Government to maintain a substation, and where he paid out more than $500 a year for extra clerk hire in order to do the business of the Government. Undoubtedly if it had not brought him business, he would not do that. I do not think it is just, but it is certainly more just to increase that man's salary where the department has promised to increase it when his business increased than it is to pay a claim like this where the office was established, notwithstanding the facetious view of that matter by my distinguished friend from Idaho [Mr. FRENCH], for the convenience and profit of the storekeeper who took the office.

A man who establishes a post office at his store brings the people from the surrounding country to his store, where before they drove a little farther ·to a store at the railroad. He has the office there, it is true, for their convenience; also for his convenience and for his profit. When the Government pays him what it has agreed to pay it treats him far better than the clerk in charge of a substation in the city, because in no case in recent years has the Government paid the clerk what it has agreed to pay as the business increased.

I yield 10 minutes to the gentleman from \Vyoming [Mr. MONDELL].

[l\fr. MONDELL addressed the. committee. See Appendix.]

Mr. FRENCH. Mr. Chairman, just another word. I realize the force of the parallel case that the gentleman from Wyoming has drawn-the case of the widow who paid the carrier for this service. On the other hand, the other illustration that the gentleman used, where a sum of money aggregating some $1,400 was raised by the community, has no significance in connection with this case, but is parallel with very many cases throughout the West.

In my State post offices are established, and before the department will recognize as reasonable a bid that may be offered, possibly many months pass by and numerous bids are called for. I myself have been one of the patrons of a small country post office to take my turn in carrying the mail from the nearest post office supplying this branch office.

Mr. MONDELL. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield? Ur. FRENCH. Certainly. Mr. 1\IONDELL. What real difference is there between con

!;ribution~ by all of the patrons of an office toward carrying the mail and a contribution made by the postmaster himself, who may be a. very considerable beneficiary in the establishment and maintenance of the office if he be a storekeeper?

1\fr. FRENCH. I would think that the difference would be very plain. All the members of this community, for instance, in which I lived, although exceedingly anxious to receive regular carrier service and to have the bids awarded at the earliest possible time, were quite willing to donate their time and their horses and bear the expenses necessary in the carrying of the mail. But, on the other hand, there is a great deal of difference between the ser-vice that was performed by the members of that community, who were patrons of the office and were contributing to the fund that went to a definite carrier, as is sometimes done, and the contributing of that much money by one man to secure his time and horses and to defray the expense of carrying the mail to the post office. In the other instance the entire expense has fallen upon the shoulders of one man, who, under misapprehension of what the law was, employed a carrier at far less than the amount that the two bids indicated was a reasonable amount that should have been paid to the carrier.

.Mr. MONDELL. Will the gentleman yield for one other question?

Mr. FRENCH. Yes. Mr. MONDELL. If this bill passes, does it or does it not

afford an excuse for every postmaster at an office hereafter to be established for saying that he or she did not understand these instructions, did not understand what they meant, and then proceeding to hire a carrier and then coming here with a claim? · ·

Mr. FRENCH. Not at all. Mr . .MONDELL. Why not? Mr. FRENCH. On the contrary, it ought to make it plain

to the department that it should furnish very specific instructions to the postmaster. You can not get a copy of the order or the authorization that was made to this postmaster. They can not prove iliat they dJd not give him the authorization that he claims. They say merely they assume that they did not. He says they did. They deny it. ·

Mr. MONDELL. I am in sympathy with the gentleman's claim, but I think we ought to understand what this is. It is not an isolated case. There are many other cases 1ike it. There is a blank that the department sends out with that joker on it about "two-thirds of the salary of the postmaster.'' Generally postmasters pay no attention to it, because it is so insignificant that it is Lot worth paying attention to, and they make such provision as they can. There is a printed drcular sent out, and I have half a dozen of these cases whe_c I have asked the postmaster to furnish me with the instructions received, and wherever I have been able to get them at all they have proven to be that same printed circular.

Mr. FRENCH. Very likely so; and, as I said a while ago, I assumed that it was this printed circular that was sent to this man.

M:r. l\101\"'DELL. And that printed circular authorizes the postmaster to pay two-thirds of his salary, and no more.

1\fr. LA FOLLE'lvrE. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield?

Mr. FRENCH. Certainly. 1\fr. L.~ FOLLETTE. I. simply wanted to ask by what com

putation a postmaster could arrive at any basis for making an offer to the carrier under those circumstances?

1\fr. MONDELL. All that he can say is, · " I am canceling about a dozen, or 2 dozen, or 3 dozen, or half a dozen letters a day now, and I expect to cancel more or less hereafter." He can not say absolutely. Of course that is impossible.

Mr. LA FOLLETTE. The ·Government puts out a statement, then, that is absolutely impossible to carry out on the face of it, because there is no salary fixed.

Mr. MONDELL. The gentleman will understand this, that no one has fought more earnestly for a good rural service than I have' since I have been here, and no one bas said more than I have against what I consider to be the parsimonious action of the department in these cases. But this fact must not be lost sight of: The Government is not getting anything out of this service. The postmaster gets all that there is in it, so far as the mail that originates at the office is concerned; and then the postmaster pays two-thirds of the salary to the carrier, and as soon as you can show any considerable amount of business in the office they establish one of these rural lines, once a week, twice a week, or three times a week, or daily, increasing as the business increases.

If there is any fault in this matter, the fault is ours. It is in the law. It is not a regulation of the department. It is a law, and the Post Office Department simply issues a circular stating the law and informing the postmaster that that is what he has authority to do. Sometimes the postmasters misunderstand it: at least they say they do, and I think that in some cases they do. But if we pay one case of this kind we ought to pay them all, in my opinion. So far as I am concerned, I shall be delighted to have some cases paid that I know of that are very meritorious. Possibly we should change the law.

Mr. FRENCH. Of course, the gentleman is aware, however, of the fact that the very maintenance of such communities as have such small offices as do not pay even the running expenses of the office-the very maintenance of such· offices as that is what enables the business in the larger cities along postal lines to be such that the revenues there can· largely exceed even the cost of maintaining the offices, such as those in New York and Chicago and Philadelphia.

1\fr. 1\IONDELL. I think I have stated words to that effect on this floor xp.ore f1:equent1y perhaps than any man except the gentleman from Idaho, because I have reiterated that a great m;1:ny times. But I do not want to say anything against the gentleman's bill as a specific proposition. ' ,

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3073 Mr. FRENCH. I appreciate the gentleman's support. I ap-

preciate that. [Laughter.] . Mr. MANN. Does the gentleman from Idaho want more sup-

port like that? [Laughter.] , Mr. 1\IONDELL. I want to make this suggestion-and the

gentleman forces me to it-that it seems extraordinary that a man who has sagacity enough to run a country grocery store could not learn within two years that he was doing something that the Jaw did not authorize him to do. It is extraordinary to me that at some time within these two years he did not appeal somewhere to learn where be was going to get hi:.: money back.

Mr. FRENCH. He believed in the Government. Mr. MONDELL. He bad u vast-amount of confidence-rather

more confidence than judgment, I should say. 1\.lr. FRENCH. Then, gentlemen, I shall be glad to have

the support of those who favor the bill for the reasons for which I favor it and the support of those who fa>or it for the reasons advanced by the gentleman from Wyoming.

1\Ir. 1\IAI\TN. Let the bill be read for amendment. The Clerk read as follows : Be it enacted, etc., That $1,000, or so much thereof as may be found

due the claimant, be, and the same is hereby, authorized to be appropriated, out of any money in the Treasury of the United States not otherwise appropriated, for the relief of 1'. S. Williams on account of services rendered as mail carrier to Williamsburg, IGaho, from January l, 1 DOl, to June 30, 1902, and the Secretary of the Treasury is hereby nuthorized and directed to pay over whatever amount that may be due T. S. Williams as stated by the Postmaster General.

With the following committee amendment: Strike out all after the enacting clause and insert the following: " That the Secretary of the Treasury be, and be is hereby, authorized

nnd directed to pay, out of any money in the Treasury not otberw1se appropriated, to T. S. Williams the sum of $315.55, in full compensation for payments made by the said '1'. S. Williams to secure the service of a mail carrier from August 6, 1900, to June 30, 1902, at Williamsburg, Idaho."

Mr. MAl~N. 1\Ir. Chairman, as far as I am concerned, I am quite willing to vote for the original bill introduced by the gentleman from Idaho, which proposes to pay this man the amount found due him by the Postmaster General. Just why the committee puts in an amendment directing that he shall be paid a specific amount I do not know, and I shall ask for a division on the amendment, hoping that it may be defeated and the original bill passed.

The CHAIRMAN. The question is on the committee amendment. ~he question being taken, on a division (demanded by Mr.

MANN) there were--ayes 25, noes 6. Accordingly the amendment was agreed to. Mr. YOUNG of North Dakota. Mr. Chairman, I move that

the bill be laid aside to be reported to the House with a favorable recommendation.

The motion was agreed to. COL. ALFRED C. SHARPE.

Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, I call up next No. 30 on the Private Calendar, the bill (H. R. 10232) for the relief of Col. Alfred C. Sharpe.

The biH was read, as follows : Be it enacted, etc., That the Secretary of the Treasury be, and be is

hereby, authorized and directed to pay, out of any money in the Treasury not otherwise appropriated, to Col. Alfred C. Sharpe, United States Army, the sum of $44, the same being for horse hired by bim for use while on duty with the Organized Militia of Ohio.

Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, this bill is more for the purpose of clearing this Army o_ffi<'er's record than for the payment of this money. The gentleman from New York [Mr. MoTT] bas charge of the bill, but in his absence I will make a brief explanation in Jieu of the one which he was expected to make.

I ba ve been informed that Col. Sharpe lias an unblemished record. As the matter now stands, this one unadjusted account stands against that record. He was directed to hire a horse, and be cUd hire a horse and paid $44 out of his own pocket. After being directed by -his superior officer to do this, the department refused to allow his account for the $44, and the matter stands in that way.

1\Ir. WILLIS. 1\fr. Chairman, I ask to insert in the RECORD a Jetter froi:n the Assistant Secretary of War to the gentleman from New· York [Mr. MoTT] on this subject.

The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman from Ohio asks unanimous consent to insert in the RECORD the letter to which he refers. Is there objection?

There was no objection. The letter is as follows :

WAR DEPARTMENT, Washington, Janttat·y s, 1911J.

Hon. LUTHErt W. MOTT, House of Rept·esentatives. Sm: I have the honor to acknowledge receipt of your Jetter of the

19th instant inclosing copy of H. R. 10232, providing for the payment

of $44 to Col. Alfred C. Sharpe, United States Army, to cover the hire of horse used by that officer while on duty as inspector-instructor with the Organized Militia of Ohio.

It appears from the records of the War Department that, in comQiiance with CoJ. Sharpe's request, the $44 involved was paid by the Quartermaster's Department for the hire of a horse for two months at the rate of $22 per month. ·

On April 10 the request of Col. Sharpe for an extension of two months to the privilege of hiring a horse, eff-ective about April 15, was approved; but on April 26, 1912, this authority was canceled by telegraph, due to the fact that, in the meantime, the quartermaster's first monthly account for $22 had been suspended by the Auditor for the War Department as not a proper charge against the United States, that official holding that Col. Sharpe's duty was not such as to require him to be mounted, and even bad this been the case, be should have provided his own mount.

On June 11, 1912, Col. Sharpe, who bad refunded to the quartermaster at Columbus Barracks, Ohio, $44, pending final advices fl'Om 'l'he Adjutant General's Office, requested information as to whether this expense should be bome by him or by the Government. In reply he was informed that, in view of the suspension by the Auditor for the War Department, no action could be taken to authorize the hire of the horse which had been used by him us indicated above.

A.s it appears from the preceding that the department erred in the first instance when it approved Col. Sharpe's original request for the hire of a horse at the rate of $22 per month, and that this officer, acting under such approval, actually expended the amount involved in connection with the performance of a duty assigned him by the department, favorable consideration of H. R. 10232 is recommended.

Very respectfully, HENRY BnECKDmiDGE,

Assistant Secretary of War. The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will report the bill for amend

ment. The Clerk read the bill. Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, I move that the bill be laid aside,

to be reported to the House with a favorable recommendation. The motion was agreed to.

ORDER OF BUSINESS. Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, I move that the committee do now

rise, and report to the House bills from the Private Calendar Nos. 13, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, and 30, with the recommendation that. they do pass.

l\Ir. l\HLLEJR. 1\fr. Chairman, may I not in all earnestness suggest to the gentleman from North Carolina that be withhold that motion for a few moments? I know the gentleman does not intend that all of to-day, which has been set ap:ut for .the consideration of private bills, be occupied exclusi-vely by his committee.

Mr. POU. I am perfectly willing to withhold the motion. 1\fr. SLAYDEN. Mr. Chairman, I believe the regular order

under the rule will be now to call the Private Calendar on other claim bills, from the War Claims Committee, for example.

Mr. ~!ANN. Oh, no. War claims bills are not in order to-day at all.

1\fr. SLAYDEN. l\Ir. Chairman, I was under the impression that this day was given up to the consideration of bills of this nature from the two Claims Committees.

1\fr. MANN. On th~ next day when claims are considered at all, war-claim bills will have the preference; so the gentleman's bill, being at the top of the Jist, will be considered.

Mr. SLAYDEN. :t is such a meritorious bill that I expect even my distinguished friend from Illinois will speak in fa-vor of it.

Mr. MAI\TN. I should not be surprised. I might take an hour on it.

1\Ir. POU. 1\fr. Chairman, at the request of the gentleman from Minnesota [Mr. MILLER] I withhold my motion.

Mr. l\!Al'i"N. No. 9 on the Private Calendar is the next bil~. EDWARD B. KELLEY.

The Clerk read the bill (H. R. 6939) to reimburse Edward B. Kelley for moneys expended while superintendent of the Ro~ebud Indian Agency in South Dakota, as follows:

lJe it enacted, etc., That there is hereby appropriate<], out of (' ly moneys in the Treasury not otherwise appropriated, the sum of $1,281,'~0 to reimburse Edward B. Kelley, formerly superintendent of the Ros1 oud Indian Agency in South Dakota, for moneys expended for costs and expenses in a suit bl'ought against him by one H. A. Bloom, involvina the property of an Indian, a member of the Pine Ridge Sioux Tribe, and for the payment of a judgment entered against blm in said suit: Pro'l.•ided, '.rhat before any part of the amount herein appropriated is paid to the said Elward B. Kelley there shall be filed a duly attested certifi· cate of the clet·k of the 12ourt in which we judgment was entered showing that said judgment bas been fully paid and satisfied: An£l provided turthet·, That the said Edward B. Kelley shall file a receipt In full of all claims or de.tlln.nds against the United States or any Indian by reasou of the moneys expended in connection with the suit herein referred to.

With the following committee amendment: In line 4, page l:, strike out "$1,281.20" and insert in lieu thereof

"$1,381.20."

Mr. .MILLER. Mr. Chairman, I move the adoption of the committee amendment.

3074 CONGRESSION .AL RECORD-HOUSE. FEBRUABY 6,

Mr. COX. Mr. Chairman; I want some explanation of this bill.

Mr. MILLER. I shall be very plea.sed to make an explanation. It seems that on the Rosebud Indian Reservation in South Dakota a pair of horses belonging to an Indian woman were stolen. The Indian agent who had charge of the reservation occupied by the tribe of which thi.s woman was a member was very acti-ve in the performance of his duty to regain possession of the horses and prosecute the thieves. He was successful in both respect.s. Two men were apprehended-a man named Del\Iarsche and a man named Monteau. Both were prosecuted in the Federal court. One was acquitted and the other found guilty and sentenced to the State penitentiary, where he now is. The horses were recovered and given into the possession of the Indian woman. Thereafter, to the surprise of nearly everyone. a man named Bloom, who resided in that part of the State, appeared and claimed that the horses did not belong to the Indian woman, but belonged to him. He brought suit against the Indian agent and against the Indian woman as defendants, and, a.s an instance of the remarkable uncertainty of jury trials, he actually recovered a verdict in that particular county. The committee will understand that the suit was tried in one of the circuit courts of ~e State of South Dakota.

When this man Bloom first began the suit a report was made by the Indian agent to the Indian Office. Authority was given by the Indian Office to the district attorney for the Federal Government in the State of South Dakota to defend the action, which he did. Receiving ample authority from the Attorney General, he conducted the defense of the case and subprenaed witnesses. Many of them had to be experts, because the question of the particular brand on the horses was involved. While a man is serving time now for stealing the horses from the Indian woman to whom they undoubtedly belonged, yet unfor- . tunately, as a matter of fact, this man Bloom did recover a judgment, and the amount mentioned in this bill is the amount of the judgment against the Indian agent and the amount of the expenses which the United States district attorney incurred in defending the suit.

Mr. COX. Do I understand the gentleman to say that this man was actually directed by the Indian Department here to go in and defend the suit?

Mr. MILLER. He was; and, although he did so strictly in the performance of a public duty, he has not been reimbursed.

Mr. COX. Why has be not been reimbursed by the Commissioner of Indian Affairs here in Washington?

Mr. MILLER. The report throws some light on that, or, it it does not, the letter of the Commissioner of Indian Affairs at that time does. It appears that after they had gone into this the Commissioner of Indian Affairs found that he had no funds out of which to pay these expenses. The first letter, dated 1910, says, at the close, that when the funds are available appropriation will be made to pay the sum ; but they have no funds.

The bill was read for amendment. The Clerk read the following amendment: Line 4, strike out the figures "$1,281.20" and insert the figures

.. $1,381.20."

The amendment was agreed to. Mr. MILLER. Mr. Chairman, I move that the bill as amended

be laid aside, to be reported to the House with a favorable recommendation.

The motion was agreed to. J. A. MATHENY.

The next business on the Private Calendar was the bill (H. R. 2733) authorizing J. A. Matheny, of Colony, Wyo., to make homestead entry.

The Clerk read the bill, as follows : Whereas J. A. Matheny, of Colony, Wyo., did in March, 1911, purchase

from one Ralph Miller for a valuable consideration the lands hereinafter described ; and

Whereas the said J. A. Matheny has made the said tract his home and placed valuable improvements thereon; and

Whereas the said J. A. Matheny is likely to lose the said tract including the money he paid therefor and the improvements made thereon by reason of the cancellation of the entry of Floyd Compton, from whom the said Ralph Miller purchased the tract: Therefore Be it ctuzctea, etc., That J. A. Matheny. of Colony, Wyo., be, and be

is hereby, authorized to make homestead entry embracing the south half of the southwest quarter, the n01·theast quarter of the southwest quarter, and the southeast quarter of the northwest quarter of section 20, township 56 north, ran~e 61 west of the sixth principal meridian in Wyoming. and to secure title to the same upon satisfactory proof of compliance with the provisions of the homestead laws.

l\Ir. POU. Mr. Chairman, there is no general debate, and I ask that the amendments be now put.

The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will report the amendments.

The Clerk read as follows: In line 4, page 2, llfter the word "Wyoming," insert the words

"after Floyd Compton's entry therefor shall have been canceled." Strike out the preamble.

The amendments were agreed to. Mr. MO~TDELL. Mr. Chairmn.n, I mo-re that the bill as

amended be laid aside with a fa-vorable recommendation. The motion was agreed to. Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. 1\Ir. Chairman, I wish to ask

a parliamentary question. The next bill on the calendar is the bill which the gentleman from Texas [l\Ir. SLAYDEN] desired to call up a few moments ago.

Mr. MANN. That is not in order to-day. Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. That is a question I wanted

to ask. It does not have preference, but whether or not under the rule it '\YOuld come up is a question. I am inclined to think it would. It would not have any preference o\er other claims but in its regular order on the calendar I think it would come up:

Mr. MANN. I have no objection to a ruling of that sort. I am willing that these bills should be absolutely squelched. You may get two or three up to-day, but you will not get any more up this session. Certainly not, if you get a ruling that such bills are in order to-day.

Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. Mr. Chairman, I will not ask for a ruling, as the gentleman from Texas has left the Hall evidently satisfied with the matter as it is. '

HUGH P. STRONG.

The next business on the Private Calendar was the bill (H. R. 1262) for the relief of Hugh P. Strong.

The Clerk read the bill, as follows : Be it enacted, etc., That Hugh P. Strong, of Superior Wis. be and

he hereby is, given the right within two years after the passage of this act to select, make entry, and file upon any 160 acres of Government land, subject to homestead entry; that upon proof of said Hugh P. Strong having established his residence upon said new entry patent for the same shall be issued to him in accordance with the 'general homestead laws, but without the necessity of maintaining residence and cultivation on the same for five years, or filing proof of the same as required by the said laws, for the reason that said Hugh P. Strong duly made homestead entry No. 2096, upon which patent was issued by the United States Government to said Hugh P. Strong on Januarl 19 1898, but which patent was canceled by the Supreme Court o the State of Afinnesota on December 11, 1903, and later by the Supreme Court of the United States on October 29, 1906.

With the following amendment recommended by the com- . mittee: Strike out all after the enacting clause and insert:

That Hugh P. Strong, of Superior, Wis., be, and he hereby is, g.iven the right. within two years after the passage of this act, to select, make entry, and file upon any 160 acres of public land subject to homestead entry; and upon payment of any fees , commissions, or purchase money due in connection therewith, and after publication and posting of notice of his said SP.lection or entry for 30 days, under direction of the register of the land district wherein the lands are situated, and in the absence of valid protest or objection, shall be entitled to receive a pat.ent therefor under the general homestead laws without the necessity of establishing, maintaining, or proving residence nnd cultivation upon the same, for the reason that said Hugh P. Strong duly made homestead entry No. 2096 upon which patent was issued by the United States to said Hugh P. Strong on January 19, 1898, but which patent was canceled by virtue of the decision of the Supreme Court of the United States October 29, 1906.

Mr. LENROOT. 1\Ir. Chairman, I would be glad to explain the bill, although the facts are sufficiently plain in the report. I ask unanimous consent to dispense with the second reading of the bill and that the amendment be considered.

The CHAlR.MAN. The gentleman asks unanimous consent to dispense with the second reading of the bill and consider the amendment. Is there objection?

There was no objection. The committee amendment was considered and agreed to. Mr. LEINROOT. Mr. Chairman, I move that the bill be laid

aside to be reported to the House with a fa-vorable recommendation.

The motion wa.s agreed to. Mr. POU. Mr. Chairman, I move that the committee do now

rise and report the respectiv:e bills that have been under consideration to the Honse, with the recommendation that the amendments be agreed to and that the bills do pass.

The motion was agreed to. Accordingly the committee rose; and the Speaker haT"ing re

sumed the chair, Mr. ADAIR, Chairman of the Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union, reported that that committee had had under consideration sundry bills on the Private Calendar, and had directed him to report the same back, some with amendment and some without amendment, with the recommendation that the amendments be agreed to and that the bills do pass.

BILLS PASSED.

The following bills on the Private Calendar, reported from the Committee of the Whole House with amendment, were sev-

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3075 erally conside1·ed the amendments agreed to, the bills as amended ordered 'to be engrossed and read a third time, were read the third time, and passed.

H. R. 9848. A bill for the relief of the New England Steam-ship Co. .

H. R. 3468. A bill for the relief of the heirs of the late Samuel H. Donaldson.

H. R. 1055. A bill for the relief of T. S. Williams. H. R. 6039. A bill to reimburse Edward B. Kelley for moneys

expended while superintendent of the Rosebud Indian Agency, in South Dakota.

H. R. 2733. A !.>ill authorizing J. A. Matheny, of Colony, Wyo., to make homestead entry.

H. R.1262. A bill for the relief of Hugh P. Strong. The following bills on the Private Calendar, reported from the

Committee of the Whole House without amendment, were severally considered, ordered to be engrossed and read a third time, were read the third time, and passed.

H. R. 10345. A bill for the relief of C. .M. Hammond. H. n. 107G3. A bill for the relief of Dr. L. W. Culbreath. H. R. 10232. .A bill for the relief of Col. Alfred· C. Sharpe.

DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA DAY.

:Mr. JOHNSON of Kentucky. :Mr. Speaker, the late Representative BREMNER who died yesterday, and who is to be buried on Monday next, was a member of the Committee on the District of Columbia. Under the rules of the House, Monday next, February 9, 1914, is District day. As many members of the committee desire to attend his funeral I ask unanimous consent that the business in order on Monday next be transferred from Monday until Thursday, February 12, 1914.

The SPEAKER. Is there objection? 1\Ir. 1\I.Al-.TN. .Mr. Speaker, of course no one will object to that

request, but may I get from the gentlemen on that side what is likely to be done in the House to-morrow and on Monday. When we passed the rule providing for the debate on the good roads bill, the expectation was that the Indian appropriation bill, which is on the calendar, would be called up after we got through with claims to-day. I understand that proposition is otl'. I do not know whether they are ready to go ahead on Monday.

Mr. UNDERWOOD. I think they will be. I regret we will not be able to take up the Indian appropriation bill to-morrow, but I think there is some business on the Speaker's table that will take an hour or two, which we may be able to dispose of by unanimous consent.

Mr. l\fANN. Then why not to-night agree that after the business on the Speaker's t..'lble is disposed of to-morrow we shall proceed with general del.>ate on the good roads bill, instead of having a session for general debate to-morrow night?

Mr. SHACKLEFORD. There is no objection to that on my part. That would be agreeable to me.

1\Ir. UNDERWOOD. Mr. Speaker, I would much prefer to push an appropriation bill at this time.

Mr. MANN. Yes; if one were ready we all would. .Mr. UNDERWOOD. As we have not one in hand, then I will

submit a unanimous request to that effect. The SPEAKER. The Chair will first put the request of the

gentleman from Kentucky, that the business in order Monday next b~ transferred to Thursday next. Is there objection?

There was no objection, and it was so ordered. Mr. UNDERWOOD. Mr. Speaker, I ask unanimous consent

that after the disposition of business on the Speaker's table to-morrow, the order making the good-roads bill in order for to-night and to-morrow, may continue during the day.

The SPEAKER. The gentleman from Alabama asks unanimous consent that after the business on the Speaker's table is disposed of to-morrow, the general debate on the good-roads bill shaH be then in order. Is there objection?

There was no objection.

SPEAKER PRO TEMPORE FOR EVENING SESSION.

The Chair appointed l\1r. RAINEY to preside as Speaker pro tempore at the evening session.

RECESS.

Mr. UNDERWOOD. Mr. Speaker, under the order heretofore made, I ask unanimous consent that the House now stand in recess until 8 o'clock p. m.

The SPEAKER. Is there objection? There was no objection; accordingly (at 5 o'clock and 26

minutes p. m.) the House stood in recess until 8 o'clock p. m.

EVENING SESSION. The recess having expired, the House (at 8 o'clock p. m.) was

called to order by the Speaker pro tempore [Mr. RAINEY]. RURAL POST ROADS.

Mr. SHACKLEFORD. Mr. Speaker, I move that the House resolve itself into the Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union for the consideration of the bill (H. R. 11686) to provide that the United States shall, in certain cases, aid the States and the civil subdivisions thereof in the construction and maintenance of rural post roads.

The motion was agreed to. · Accordingly the Rouse resolved itself into the Committee of

the Whole House on the state of the Union for the consideration of the bill H. R. 11686, with 1\fr. RUBEY in the chair.

l\fr. SHACKLEFORD. 1\fr. Chairman, in as much as I wish to make a request as to controlling debate, I move that the committee do now rise.

The motion was agreed to. Accordingly the committee rose; and the Speaker pro tempore

having resumed the chair, Mr. RUBEY, Chairman of the Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union, reported that the House had had under consideration the bill H. R. 11686, and had come to no resolution thereon. .

Mr. SHACKLEFORD. Mr. Speaker, I want to ask unammous consent that general debate upon this subject be controlled half on this side by myself and half on the other side by the gentleman from Iowa [Mr. PROUTY]. Th~ SPEAKER pro tempore. The gentleman from Missouri

[Mr. SHACKLJJ;FORD] asks unanimous consent that the time allotted for debate on this bill under the rule shall be controlled half by the gentleman from Missouri [Mr. SHACKLEFORD] and half by the gentleman from Iowa [l\Ir. PROUTY]. Is there obj_ction?

There was no objection. Mr. SHACKLEI!""'ORD. Mr. Speaker, I move that the House

resolve itself into the Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union for the further consideration of the bill H. R. 11686.

The motion was agreed to. Accordingly the House resolved itself into the Committee of

the Whole House on the state of the Union for the further consideration of the bill H. R. 11686, the rural post roads bill, with Mr. RUBEY in the ·chair.

The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will report the bill. The Clerk read the title, as follows: A bill (H. R. 11686) to provide that the United States shaH, ~n cer

tain cases. aid the States and the civil subdivisions thereof m the cons'truction and maintenance of rural post roads.

1\fr. SHACKLEFORD. 1\fr. Chairman, I ask unanimous. consent that the first reading of the bill be dispensed with.

The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman from Missouri [1\lr. SHACKLEFORD] asks unanimous consent that the first rending of the bill be dispensed with. Is there objection?

There was no objecti?n.

[l\fr. SHACKLEFORD addressed the committee. See Appendix.]

1\fr. SHACKLEFORD. I will yield 10 minutes to the gentleman from M~chigan [Mr . . WooDRUFF].

l\fr. WOODRUFF. Mr. Chairman, during the past 20 years the subject of transportation has become almost paramount to all others in the minds of the real students of econOJ:!1iCs of the Nation and the world. Indeed, this subject has been one that has commanded the attention of the best minds of all uges.

Even our barbarian forefathers recognized the import..'lnce of easy routes of transportation and travel. This is evidenced by the fact that to-day can be seen in many of our early settled States trails used centuries ago by the various Indian tril.>es of the country. These trails can readily be fo1lowed for miles through valleys and over mountains. In the softer ground they have been worn down until they resemble narrow ditches, while in many places, on solid rock, the countless thousands of moccasined feet that passed over them in centuries gone by have worn a trail that time will never efface.

The Indian had his regular routes of travel just as surely as do the people of to-day. If he wished to go to the hunting grounds to provide food for the tribe or the family, if he wished to visit some friendly neighboring tribe, or if be wished to engage in war with some other nation 100 or 1,000 miles away, there was his intelligently selected, well-beaten path or road over which he could travel with little inconvenience to himselt or his party.

(

3076 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE-: FEBRUARY 6,

This was not only true of the North American Indian, but true of an other uncivilized tribes as well. With the dawn of ciY"ilization and improvement in the methods of transportation, it became apparent that for easieT communication, socially and commercially, something more was necessary than a mete path through the wilderness. And this marked the beginning of the actual building of roads. .

History tells us that the Romans were the first to really appreciate the importance of building good roads. They were the first to enter largely upon this work. As fast as cities or nations were conquered roads were laid out and built to connect the same with Rome and with each other, until when she was at the height of her power every city in the Empire was connected by a great network of permanent stone roads. They began building roads on a large scale 400 years before Christ, and for GOO years were kno~-n as a nation of superb road builders. Their greatest road, the Appian Way, 1!:>0 Italian miles Jong, was begun in the year 312 B. C., and was for 800 years in perfect condition. Portions of it remain and are easily traced to this day.

The first process in the forming of these roads wns to lay out the course they were to take, which was invariably carried in as straight a line as the nature of t}le country would permit. The soil was then excavated to procure a solid foundation, and when the- nature of the earth was such as to preclude this the conditions were remedied by the driving of piles. The sides of the roadway were then flanked by two strong walls, which served as a support to the road. The excavated space was filled up with various layers of stone cemented together. On top of this a layer of cement was placed, and in this soft substance large fiat stones closely united were laid. When tlie cement had hardened they had a road which, for all purposes, was as good as one carved out of solid rock.

Upon conquering England they found it impracticable in many instances to construct roads of stone and used the next best available material, which pro\ed t() be gra\el. Instead of placing a bed of this material 8 or 12 inches thick upon their roadway, as is done to-day, they built it to a height of 3 feet o:: more, and even now, after more than 15 centuries, these roads can be easily traced throughout all England.

"Necessity is the mother of invention," and the thing that prompted the Romans to build these great permanent highways throughout all their domain was military necessity. They found it necessary to moYe their armies readily and rapidly, and in order to accomplish this with expedition, and to meet their needs in the centuries to come, they built not a temporary roadway, but one that would last ior ages. It had not entered their minds that there would eyer be any other method of transportation than that then in use, and consequently they builded in such a way as would give them easy means of transporting their armies, munitions of war, and provisions as rapidly as could be done with the means at hand.

This was the necessity that first prompted Napoleon to enter into the building of the great system of highways that France has to-day. It was as necessary for him to move his armies quickly as it was for the Romans, and he early recognized this necessity and established everywhere throughout the French Empire a like network of permanent roads.

Since the year 1900 the people of the entire United States have entered into a movement for the establishment throughout the countl·y of good roads. Since this date the more wealthy States of the Union have made great strides in the improvement of their rural highways. The movement in the poor and more sparsely settled communities has not up to this time gained any material headway. The farmers until recently have been more or less satisfied to continue year after year, in good weather and bad, the transportation of their produce over roads that were sometimes good, often indifferent, and usually bad. But of late, as a result of the study of conditions in other more fortunate localities, through the interchange of ideas at the grange meetings, and so forth, the farmer has come to realize that when he is compelled to draw a ton or a half torr of produce to the market at a load where he might as well draw two or three tons, he is thereby increasing his cost of production to the amount it costs him to make these extra trips to market and thereby lessening his power to compete with his more fortunate brethren.

The question of transportation has been an important one since the dawn of civilization, and the evolution in the method and means of transportation has been wonderful, indeed. Until the end of time, in all probability, there will be but three means of transportation, namely, railroads, waterways, and roadways. These methods are dep_endent one upon the other. The railroad can not live without the road vehicle and the great ships that

traverse the seas and waterways could not continue to exist profitably without railroads and road vehicles. Neither one of the three could perform its full function in the development of our Nation if it were not for each of the others. Each has an important and independent work to perform in intrastate, interstate, and foreign commerce. Two of the great systems of transportation-the railroads and water-craft lines-have been developed by private capital and are operated for private gain. The third-transportation by road vehicle over public highways-is in the hands of the people, and the common use is accorded to all free of charge. Those of us who have failed to give the question of transportation and its ·consequential tax upon the people some degree of thought do not or can not realize how great the burden is that is now carried by the people from this source. The amount of money it costs to transport the necessaries of life and the other articles of commerce oyer the public roads, the railroads, and over the waterways is a direct tax upon the producing and the consuming public.

\Ve complain of the ever-increasing expenditure of the public funds, realizing that every dollar so expended is a direct tax upon the consuming public. These are expenditures that are tangible-that can be seen.

The principal sources from which the Government deriyes its funds are the tariff and the internal revenue. '.rhe tariff tax for the past year under the Payne-Aldrich tariff bill was $3.65 per capita, and the internal-reyenue tax was $3.72 per capita, making a total of $7.37 per capita. The transportation tax o! the railroads for the past year has been $33.24 per capita, the water-transportation tax has been${) per cnpitn., and the '\"YagontransportaUon tax for the past year has been $17.39 per capita. making a total transportation tax per capita of $55.63. It is estimated by the Bureau of Roads of the Department of Agriculture that the cost per ton-mile for hauling produce to market is nt the l)1"esent time 23 cents. It is estimated that under p~sent conditions it co ts the farmers of this country $1.600.000,000 per annum to haul their produce to maTket. In countries blessed with a system of improved highways the cost of transportation per ton-mile over the wagon roads is from 9 to 12 cents. When tlle rural roads of this country shall have been improved to as great an extent as haYe those in France, for instance, the cost of wagon transportation in this country will haye been reduced approximately 50 per cent from what it is to-day. The producing and consuming public will be relieY"ed of this great burden to the extent of approximately $8.50 per capita per annum, a direct sanng to the farmers and consumers of the Nation of. $800,000,000 per year.

On December 12, 1913, I introduced a bill in this House for the establishment of a bureau of postal highways and the extension of Federal aid in the construction and maintenance of good roads in the several States and Territories and the civiJ subdiYisions thereof. I had given the subject of Federal aid much study and thought and incarporated my ideas in this biB. I believed and I believe now that the Bureau of Roads in the Department of Agriculture should be transferred bodily to the Post Office Department. It seems to me and it seemed to other members of the committee that should the Post Office Department be given control of this particular department of the Government the work of the department itself could be rendered much more efficient and economical.

I provided that a director of the bureau of postal highways should be appointed by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate; that he should receive a salary of $7,500 per annum; and that he should be a practical engineer of road construction. I provided also that the director of the bureau of postal highways could appoint assistants in the various States and Territories not to exceed 50 in number; that the as.:;istants shoulu be appointed only after competitive examination; and that said inspectors should be removed only for cause. My idea was to take this department of the Government out of the great political spoils system that has made a mockery of our public departments. I believe that when intelligent men have shown their ability in competitive examinations, and when they have put in years at a given work, they must of necessity become much more efficient at that particular line of work than men could possibly be if newly appointed by every incoming administration. I placed the salary these men should receive at $150 per mvnth, having in mind that at certain times of the year the work of inspection, which work was theirs, would be very materially lessened, enabling the director of the bureau to discontinue their services te:nporarily, and thus effect a saving in the maintenance of the department.

I do not believe it is good policy to turn the Federal moneys over to the several States or civil subdivisions for any purpose whatever unless the Government retains to itself the power to see and to know that this money is being expended as it directs.

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3077 The c1 uti es of the inspectors or assistants to the director were

to consist of the inspection of roads after they -had been completed, and I believe that had my bill become a law in its entirety, 50 men would hnve been competent to have handled this work with reasonable expeclition.

I have always believed that any local community knows the needs of that particular community oetter by far than could any State official or any Federal official. I believe that the }Jeople themselyes in any community should be allowed to say which roads shall be improved and how such roads shall be improve<l. I have made it possible in my bill for any commtmity anywhere in the several States to so improve their roads as to meet the necessities of that particular community, and I have provided that the people living in a township in any county of any State could improve the roads of that particular township with the materials they haye at hand and receive the Federal reward without waiting for the say so of any particular county official or State official. I have investigated and attempted to learn the manner of construction and the materials used in the several States throughout this Nation, and in drafting my hill I have separated the different kinds of roads into individual classifications. I attempted to specif-y how these roads should be built, taking advantage of the experiments carried on throughout the country, with a view of making each particular kind of road as good as could reasonably be expected wit h the materials used. I provided a certain definite reward for each mile of road so constructed, running from $200 per mile for a properly built sand-clay road to $400 per mile for a properly constructed gravel road, $600 per mile for a combination of crushed stone and blast-furnace slag or gr:rrel, and $ 00 per mile for macadam or other material of equal durability. This was for a 9-foot roadway or track. For each additional foot of width up to and including 16 feet, I had prolided for an additional reward of 10 per cent of the original reward. These rewards, however, were to be paid only when the road was completed and built according to specificntions. In addition to the reward for construction, I had provided the same rewards for maintenance that the committee bill now before this House provides.

It seems to be that if the Government is going to extend aid to the several States in the building and maintenance of roads, it should extend that aid equally. It should decide upon an equitable and definite amount that should be extended for aid in the construction of certain kinds of roads, and extend to the people in every commllllity this definite sum. For instance, if $25,000,000 is appropriated this year and it is found that this sum is onJy sufficient to provide for maintenance, and $40,000,000 or $50,000,000 be appropriated next year and the additional $15,000,000 or $25,000,000 be extended as aid in the construction of roads, it seems to me as though an injustice were being worked upon the communities which build their 1·oads the coming year.

You will readily see that under the provisions of my bill any community would know, before beginning the construction of a mile of road, just the amount it would receive from the Government toward the construction of the same, and this reward would be equal in amount to that extended for a like type of road in e~ery other community, regardless of the year in which it was built.

In initiating legislation along this or other lines, it seems to me, Mr. Chairman, that we should make our start in a way that would insure equal treatment to all, but under the provisions of the bill now before the House equal treatment will depend absolutely upon the amount appropriated by Congress

· in the years to come. Should the appropriation exceed the $25,000,000 carried in this bill, the communities building roads next year or the years following will receive a larger reward than those building this year. Should the appropriations be less, then the communities building this year will receive more benefit than those which build in the future. I would like to see a system inaugurated by this Government that when worked out to its completion will have paid toward the construction of roads in Bay, Iosco, Crawford, or Ogemaw Counties the same amount per mile for like construction as will have been received by Midland, Mecosta, Isabella, or Clare.

It is fair also, and it should ha ~e been provided in this bill, as it was in mine, that any community which had been progressive enough in the past to build sand, clay, gravel, or macadam roads and properly maintain them should receive the same reward per mile from the Government as those that are to be built in the future. If it is fair to extend aid to a township or a county for ron.ds to be built in the years to come, it is fair also to extend aid in a like amount to those that have constructed and maintained them in the past. It has not been the thought of the committee that the impro~ement of the rural roads would benefit the farmer alone, but that these benefits

would extend to every class of our people indiscriminately, resulting in a very material reduction .in the transportation tax that every individual must pay in one way or another. Now, if this is so, and I think every man within the hearing of my voice will agree that it is, will not the roads that have been built prior to this time enter as largely pro rata in the solYing of this great economic problem as those that are to be built in the future? If my deductions are right, is it not fair, Mr. Chairman, not only to the communities that have already built their roads, but to every other as well, that rewards should be extended to all alike, regardless as to the particular time the roads are constructed?

Under the proyisions of my bill it would haYe been possible, at an expense to the Government of $1,000,000,000, to improve e~ery road in this country. This seems like a large sum to be expended in any one way, but when we stop to realize that the railroads ·in the past have receiYed land grants from the Government exceeding in value this immense sum, and that the appropriations for rivers and harbors, including the Panama Canal, already exceeds this sum by more than $100,000.000; that the railroads are being operated as private institutions for private gain, and that while the improvement of rivers and harbors is without question of some general benefit to the people at large, yet the greatest benefit derived therefrom is to the great transportation corporations of the country and the world, and that if $1,000,000,000 is expended in the improvement of the roads of this country it is of direct benefit to all the people, you will readily appreciate how reasonable it was to ask that this sum be expended in the way I have outlined.

I do not believe that this Government should enter into the work of constructing roads. I believe that should be left to the States and the civil subdivisions. I do not believe it is necessary or the proper thing to construct transcontinental bouleyards.

For months past an organization known as the National Highways Association has been at great expen-se to circularize Congress almost weekly with their propaganda for the building of . these great national highways. They include beautifully colored maps, with the roadways laid out touching no more than 15 per cent of the counties in each State. They estimate that more than $25,000,000,000 will be spent in the next 25 years on the more than 2,000,000 miles of highways in this country. Their purpose, apparently, is to see to it that any moneys expended for this purpose shall be expended mainly in the interests of the leisure, pleasure-seeking class of the Nation. They argue that the roads should be built partly at the expense of the Government, and that they should take the form of great concrete or macadam boulevards extending across States and across the continent in every direction.

It occurs to me that their interest is mainly in roads that will enable automobile owners to drive from State to State rather than in the -roads that will enable the farmer to market his produce at a saving to himself and to the consumer. They have circulated pamphlets in which are shown maps of Michigan and Massachusetts. The former bears the title, "Roads beginning nowhere, ending nowhere"; the latter, "Roads beginning somewhere, ending somewhere." They have evidently gotten possession of a map issued at some time in the past by the State highway department of 1\fichjgan, showing thereon the roads that had at that time received the State reward. In no instance do I find on this map where the roads constructed under the State reward system have been extended from the county seat to the county lines, with the exception of one road in Wayne County.

I would like to call the attention of the gentlemen responsible for the circulation of this map to the fact that in my county, the county of Bay, there are at this time five distinct macadam roads leading from Bay City, the county seat, straight through to the county lines. I would call attention to the fact that Saginaw County, on the south, has connected up its macadan1 roads with both the Bay County macadam roads extending to that county, making thereby two macadam connecting links between the county seats of the two counties. Wayne County, in addition to the one road extending to the county lines, as shown upon the map circulated by this organization, has eight lines of road extending to their county lines connecting up with every county touching Wayne County. This condition holds good in many of the counties throughout the State.

The map the National Highways Association bas sent broadcast throughout the land shows only such roads in Michigan as have received the State reward. It is a fact, I believe, that at this time in Michigan there are several times as many miles of macadam and gravel roads actually constructed as hnve received this reward, inasmuch as the appropriations in the State have not been sufficient in the past to reward all these different com-

'3078 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. FEBRUARY G,

. mnnities as fast as the roads were built. And, too, many of the roads were constructed prior to the time the reward was gi•en, and have not been able to qualify for this reward, as the roads were not constructed according to the specifications which have since been furnished by the State department of highways. These roads are rapidly being brought up to the required standaru, and as .fast as the appropriations will allow the reward is being extended.

It is the intention of the State highway department of Michigan to encourage the building of roads in the several counties so as to connect up the improved roads in the manner described between Bay and Saginaw Counties.

When the roads system of Michigan, as now proposed by Lhe higlnvay depnrtment of the State, shall haxe been completed, we will have a perfect network of good roads extending into eyery part of every county in the State, enabling the farmers in one county to market their crops as readily and economically as those in any other.

There has been much talk of insidious lobbying at the National Capitol in the past year, and certainly with justification. But I believe the form of literature sent out by the National Highways .Association should be condemned as the worst form of lobbying. For instance, in a circular received recently, they state:

We want mn.-ket roads. We want roads from farm to railroad. How are we to get them. We all wanted branch railroads first. Did we get them? No; we got the trunk lines first, and rightly. It will be the same with roads. If the farmer waits for the reversal of this law, he will "die in the mud." • • • They are now laboring lmder that infernally confusing, false, and misleading epithet, "Federal aid:' Responsjblc for delay in congr·essional action. Responsible for the continuation of the activities of those more interested in their individual ndvancemc·nt than In the attainment of good roads. Responsible for the differences of opinion on the part of the body politic as to the wise plan to advocate. It sounds well. It can be made to mean anything which suits the selfish desire-s of the user. Indefinite, alluring, unceJ·tain, vicious; lt does not spell good roads. If the people of the United States have saddled upon them "Federal nid "-whatever It is made to me.an-they will later awaken to thP. fatal error and their ignorance ;n permitting such extravagance, incompetence, and graft as the result thereof. .And "by the eternal " we will provide so-called statesmen responsible therefor "with a long and much·needed vacation ."

This is the type of argument this organization has sent to every Member of this House. Believing, evidently, that their ar.guments for a system of national automobile boulevards not being sufficiently compelling, and that this House would have sufficient intelligence to undertake to pro·\ide roads that will really enable the farmer and every farmer to market his crops -at a reasonable cost, they have resorted to the use of threats. They say, "We want market roads," "We want roads from farm to railroad" and in the same breath ask that this Government enter jointly into the expenditure of $25,000,000,000 for th;} purpose of building great concrete highways that will enable less than 1 per cent of the farmers of this country to utilize the same.

The system that I stand for is one which will enable every farmer in this country to share alike in whatever benefit is to be extended by this Government.

I extend a most cordial invitation to this organization to come into my district and state their case to my constituents. If they can convince the farmers in .Arenac County that a c9ncrete road running through Mecosta County is going to enable them to market their crops more readily or more economically, they will do something I believe can not be done. I would ask tllese gentlemen how the improvement of a road in .Arenac County will enable the farmers of Osceola County to more readily senll their children to school or to church or to allow the farmer of Osceola County to drive to town with his produce during the times when the roads are wet? . Under the present condition of our roads it is practically impossible for a. farmer to market his crops at such times, and any person will realize, if he will stop to think, that this is the time of all times when a farmer should l>e enabled to do this, inasmuch as the condition of the ground is such that he is not able to get into his fields to do the work that he can do at a time when the roads are good.

There were many conflicting opinions in the committee as to just what form the committee bill should take. Knowing that if any legislation whatever was to be enacted along these lines at this session of Congress it was necessary to come before this House with a solid front, the committee has attempted, in a spirit of compromise, to draw a. bill that has, in a. small measure at 1east, pleased all the members thereof. Under the committee bill as reported to the House it is possible for the States to receive aid in two different ways. The governor of each State will decide for the State under which section-3 or 4-it shall receive aid.

Section 3 provides that the Government and the State shall jointly enter into the construction of roads, and that these roads shall be maintained at the expense of the Federal Government and the State, which means that trunk lines will be built t~rough

the more populous sections of the State, and the more sparsely settled communities will be left to construct their roads entirely at their own expense.

Section 4 incorporates the fundamentals of my bill. It specifies that aid in maintenance and construction shall be extended generally to all the roads throughout the State. Each mile of ordinary dirt road properly graded, crowned, and drained will receh·e under this bill the sum of $15 annually for maintenance; each mile of gravel road properly graded, crowned, and drained will receive each year $30 for maintenance; each mile of macadam or other material of like cost will receive ''GO "pee year for maintenance, provided the appropriation is great enough to enable the State to distribute this money in these amounts. If there is not enough money grnnted each State to extend the reward for maintenance in the amounts I have specified, it shall be divided pro rata., and there will ·be no aid extended in the <'Onstruction of roads in that State. At the last meeting of the committee I submitted a resolution increasIng the appropriation from $25,000,000 to $40,000,000, believing that we should start with at least this amount. l\ly resolution was overwhelmingly voted down.

'l'o my mind, sectioii 3 of the bill submitted by the committee can not but work to the advantage of some communities at the disadYantage of many others, and I look to see all the States, with possibly a few exceptions, accept Federal aid under the provisions of section 4. I shall support the committee bill, Mr. Chairman, inasmuch as if this is not done by the membership of this House no legislation up.on this subject will be passed at this time.

I do not anticipate that $25,000,000 will be the extent of the appropriation in the years to come. I look to see this increased from year to year, as the people and the Members of Congress are brought to a realization of the immense economic ad•antages to be deriYed from the improvement of our rural highways. And that within the next 20 or 30 years our roads will be brought to a state of perfection that will enable the farmers to market their crops at a saving to themselves and the consuming public of more than $500,000,000 annually. [Applause.]

I will append herewith the following table: Maximum amount of Federal aid to each State tmder provisions oJ

H. R. 11686.

State. Percent of total popula-

tion.

Percent of total

Amount. star and rural

routes.

Amount. Total.

Alabama .... _ ... _ •. _.. . . . 2. 34 $292,500 2. 29 S286, 250 $578, 750 Arizona. ................... 22 27,500 . 22 27,500 55,000 Arkansas. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1. 72 215, 000 1. 39 173, 750 3 , 750 California................ 2. 60 352,000 1.13 178,750 503,750 Colorado .... _.............. . 87 108, 750 . 74 92,500 201,250 Connecticut ........ _..... 1. 22 152, 500 . 53 66, 250 21 , 750 Delaware ... __ ... _._..... . 22 27,500 . 21 26, 250 53, 750 Florida... ................. . 82 102,500 .<>5 81,250 183,750 Georgia.... ............... 2.85 356,250 3.32 415,000 771,250 Idaho.................... .36 4.5,000 .53 66,250 112,500 Illinois.... ................ 6.17 771 ,250 5.84 730,000 1501250 Indiana .... _ ... _......... 2. 95 3GS, 750 5. 18 647,500 1:016:250

~~as::::::::::::::::::: ~:g ~·~ ~:~ ~~:~ ~~:~8 Kentucky ....... _........ 2. 51 313: 750 2. 16 270, 000 583, 750 Louisiana......... . . . . . . . . 1. 81 226, 250 . 61 76, 250 302, 500 Ma.i.nc ....... _ ...... _..... . 81 101, 250 1.10 137,500 238,750 Maryland ................. 1.42 177, 500 .91 113,750 291,250 Massachusetts .. ... _ .... _. 3. 68 460,000 . 63 78, 750 53 , 750

· .Michigan ......... _...... . 3. OS 385, 000 4. 31 53 , 750 923, 750 Minnesota.. .............. 2. 27 283, 750 3. 70 462,500 74ti, 250

~n~o~~r~.i::::::::::::::: ~:~ ~~·~ !:~~ ~~:m 1,6r:~~ · Mont:m~.·-···~··-······· .41 51;250 .62 77,500 12,750 Nebraska. ............... 1. 30 162,500 2. 75 343,750 506,250 Nevada. .................. .09 11, 250 .25 31,250 42,500 New Hampshire......... .47 5 ,750 .53 66 250 125,000 Now Jersey.. ............. 2. 77 346,250 . 62 77; 500 423, 750 New Mexico. ............ .36 4.5,000 .44 55,000 100,000 NewYork ............... 9.97 1,246,250 4.00 500,00J 1,746,250 North Carolina ..... _..... 2. 41 301, 250 2. 87 358, 750 600,000 North Dakota ... __ ... _... . 63 78, 750 1. 63 203, 750 282, 500 Ohio........................ 5.22 652,500 5.14 642,500 1,295, 000 Oklahoma ............. _.. 1. 81 I 226,250 2. 77 34n, 250 572,500 Oregon ............ _...... . 74 92, 500 . 96 120,000 212, 500 Pennsylvania ........ _._. 8. 39 1, 048,750 4. 60 575, 000 1, 623, 750 Rhode Island............ . 5!) 73,750 . 08 10,000 83,750 South Carolina ... _....... 1. 66

1

207, 500 1. 66 :<07, 500 415,000 South Dakota............ . 64 80,000 1. 75 218,750 298, 750 Tennessee ....... _. _...... 2.. 39 29 , 750 3. 26 407, 500 706, 250 Texas .. _. _ .....•.. __ ..... 4. 26 532, 500 4. 75 L93, 750 1, 126, 250 Utah..... ................ . 41 51,250 . 30 37,500 , 750

~fr~~~~:~ ~~:~:::::::::: 2:~~ ~:~gg ~d~ 3~:m k~· ~g Washington .... __ .... _... 1. 25 156, 250 . 85 100, 250 262; 500 W~tVi~ginia ............ 1.34 167,500 1.13 141,250 308,750 Wtsconsm................ 2. 55 318,750 3. 47 433, 750 752, 500 Wyoming ......... _...... . 16 20,000 . 36 45, 000 65, 000

TotaL ... _ .. __ . __ .. -~-00-. 2-4-l-1-2-, 5-3-0,-000-·l--99-.-4-9 ·l-12-, -436-,-2-50-~-2-4,-96-7-, -500-

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3079 Mr. Sp€aker, in connection with my speech on H. R. 11686

I wish to extend my remarks by inserting a copy of my bill, which is as follows : A bill (B. R. 10404) for the establishment of a bureau of postal high

ways unCI the ext~nsion of Federal aid in the construction and maintenance of good roads in the several States and Territories and the civil subdivisions thereof. Be it enacted, etc., That th~re sh:lil be established in the Post Office

Department a bureau to be known as the bureau of postal highways. SEc. 2. That it shall be the object and purposi! of said bureau to co

operate with the various States and Terdtories of the United States and the civil subdivisions thereof in the construction, improvement, and maintenance of permanent public roads now being utilized, or which may in the future be utilized, by the United States Government as rural

m~ici'.r f.0~h~~a~:id bureau shall be under the direction of a director of the bureau of postal highways, who shall be appointed by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate, and who shall recoive a salary of $7,500 per annum: Pro'l:idcd. hotcever, That said director shall be a practical engineer of road construction.

SEc. 4. That said director of the bureau of postal highways is hereby empowered to appoint assistants in the Tarious States and Terrtories, who sllall be lmown as inspectors of postal highways : Provided, howC'I:er, That there shall not be appointed more than 50 said inspectors of post:li highways: Provided fut·ther, That said inspectors of postal highways shall only be appointed after competitive examination, at which be or they shnll have passed with higher percentages than other competing applicants, and said inspector·s of postal highways so appointed shall only be removed for cause: Provided ftu-ther, That the salary of such inspectors shall not exceed 150 per month.

SEC. 5. That the duties of the inspectors of postal highways shall be to inspect the roads which may be constructed under the provisions or this act; that the said inspectors of postal blghways shall report to tbe said director of the bureau of postal highways their findings m each .mile of road so inspected and their recommendation as to the class to which the said mile of road may properly belong, as specified hereinafter in this act.

SEc. G. That the said inspectors of post:li hlgbw:tys shall inspect under the direction of the director of the bureau of post:li highways such roads as shall have been completed prior to the date that this act shall have become a law, and report his findinga on each mile of road so. inspected and his recommendation as to the class to which the sa.ld mile of road may properly belong as specified hereinafter in this net.

SEC. 7. That the Office of Public Roads of the Department of Agriculture is hereby transferred to the Bureau of l'ostal Roads of the Post Office Department, together with all records and files, machrner:v, property, and equipment now used in connection with sa.ld Office of Public Roads.

SEc. 8. (a) That the term "civil subdivision" as used iu this act, is defined to be any territorial division of a State vested with corporate or quasi..corporate powers and possessed o:f some powers of local selfgovernment.

(b) That the term ·• road district," as used in this act, is defined to be any civil subdivision of any State or of :my P.art of 'any such civil subdivision, or any two or more contiguous civil subdivisions or contiguous parts thereof, wherein a fund is provided either by taxation. the issuance of bonds, by popular sul>scrlption, o.r otherwise, to be used exclusively for the building and improving of the public highways thereof and in which propet· officials shall have been duly selected to receive and expend such fund, and who shall be responsible to the public by the giving of bond, or otherwise, for the proper expenditure of such fond and of any reward payable to said distnct under the provisions of thls act.

(c) That the term ' 'rural post road" as used in this act is defined to be any public highway outside of all incorporated cities and vlllages over which the United States regularly transports rural mail, whether by rural free delivery or star route: Provided, hotvcvet·, That such terms shall in no instance be construed to include any private or toll road. .

SEc. n. That the public roads of the several States and Territories and the civil subdivisions thereof are, for the purposes of this act, di-• vided into the following classes:

Class A. Every mile of rural post road outside of incorporated cities and villages, upon which no incltne is steepeT than is reasonably necessary, with ample side ditches, and which is lrept well crowned graded. and compacted by dragging, or otheT adequate means, so that' it shall have a smooth surface and be passable for vehicles at all times.

<_;la~s B. Every mile of we~-graded. road, outside of incorporated cities ana VIllages, upon which no mcline IS steeper than is reasonably necessary, the width of which shall not be less than 20 feet between and exclusive of side ditches, and which sh:lil be properly dra.fned and have a wagon way or travel track properly crowned not less than 9 feet wide and made of a mixture of sand and clay 8 inches deep the consistency of which shall be specified by the director of the bureau of post:li highways.

Class C. Every mile of well-graded road, outside of incorporated cities and villages. upon which no incline is steepeT than is reasonably necessary, the width of which shall not be less than 20 feet between and exclusive of side ditches, and which shall be properly drained and have a ~agon way. or travel tr~ck properly crowned not less than 9 feet Wide, and whiCh shall consist of not less than 8 inches of compacted gravel or not less than 12 inches of compacted burnt shale which must be applied in not less than two layers, each layer to be rolled separately.

Class D. Every mile of well-graded road, outside of incorporated cities and villages, on which no incline is steeper than is reasonably necessary, the width of which shall not be less than 20 feet between and exclusive of side ditches, and which shall be properly drained and have a ~agon way _or travel track, properly crowned, not less than n feet Wide, made m two courses, the bottom course --to be crushed stone, slag, or other material which may be approved by the director of the bureau of postal highways, an(! which shall not be less than 4 inches thick after thorough rolling, and a top course consisting of a layer of gravel or blast furnace slag which shall be not less than 3 inches thick after being thoroughly rolled.

. ~lass E. ~very mile of. well-g~·aded road, outside of incorporated Cities and Vtllages, on which no mcline is steeper than is reasonably necessary, the width of which shall not be less than 20 feet between and exclusive of side ditches, and which shall be properly drained and have_ a wagon ~ay or travel track proper·Jy crowned, not less tba~ 9 feet wide, made In two courses, the bottom course to be of gravel slag, or other materials, which may be approved by the director of the ·

bureau of postal highways, and be not less than 4 inchel!l thick artet' thorough rolling. and n top course, <.onsisting of a layer ot crushed stone,. each t_o l>e properly bonded, with stone screenings or other matermls which may be approved by the director of the bureau of postal highways.

. ~lass F. Every mik> of well-graded road, outside of incorporated c1ties and villages, on which no incline is steeper than is reasonably necessary, the width or hich shall not be less than 20 feet between and exclusive of side ditches, and which sh:lil be properly drained and have a wagon way or travel track properly crowned not less than 9 feet wide of well compacted macadam not less than' 6 inches thick laid in two courses, of crushed stone, each to be properly bonded with stone screenings, asphalt, bitumen. or other cement approved by the director of tl!e bureau of postal highways.

. ~lass G. ~very mile o~ well-g~·:ul':d road, outside of incorporated Cities and nllages. on which no mcline is steeper than is reasonably necessary, the width of which shall not be less than 20 feet between and exclusive of side ditches . and which shall be properly drained and have a ~ag?n way O.i' tt·a>el track, pt·operly crowned, not less than 9 feet Wide ill the clear between l:teveled edgrs, and which shall con<>ist of properly laid concretP not less than 6 inches in depth, composed of Por!Jnnd _cement and grave~. sand. or crushed stone, with or without a pavmg-brick surface: Pr01:1ded, ho10e-,;e1·, That the cement shall be required to meet the standard tests then in force of the American Society for 'l'esting. Materials, a~ that the other in!jredicnts. manner of laying, and . the _kind of inspection employed shall be m:tdc to comply with specificutious made by or approved by the director of the bureau or post:li highways:.

Clas'3 II. Every mile of well-graded road, outside of incorporated cities and villages, on which no incline is steeper thnn is reasonal>ly neces. ary. a.ad the width of which ::-hall be not less than 20 feet between and exclusive of sJde ditches, and wb!cl! shall be properly drained and have a wagon way or travel track not less than n feet wide in the d~ar betwceu curbs, and which shall consist of a paving·brick surface lru.d on gravel, sand. broken stone, or slug: Proticled, howe1:er That the quality of brick, manuel! of la ying, and the kind of inspection' employed shall be made to comply with the specifications made by or approved by the director of the bureau of postal highways.

SEC. 10 (a). Rural post ro.ads constructed under the specifications of class B shall merit, if approved by the director of the bureau of postal high_ways, a reward from tbe United States Government of $200 for eaeb IDJ.le and pro rata for fractions theri!of, with an extra $20 per mile for each additicnal foot in width of finished surface in excess of D feet up ' t.o and including 1G feet.

(b) Rura~ P?St road<: construct~d under the specifications of class C shall ment, If apprond oy tbe duector of the bureau of pos~l hi"'hways, a 1·eward from the United States Government of $400 for c:rch mile and p~o rata fer. frac1;ions thereof. with an extra $40 per mile for each additiOnal foot m w1dth of finished surface in excess of n feet up to and including 16 teet.

(c) Rural post roads constructed under the specifications of classes D or E shalJ merit, if approved by the director of the bureau of postal highwa:rs, a reward from the Un~ted S-tates Government of $600 for ea_ch IDJ.le, and pr!-'. rata for ~racti_ons thereo!, with an extra ${)0 per llll1e for each aad1tional foot 111 w1dth of fimshed surface in excess of D feet up to and including 16 feet.

(d) Rural post roal!s <;onstructed under the specifications of classes F. G, or H shall mer1t, 1f approved by the director of the bureau of postal highways, a reward from the United States Government of $800 foy eaeh mile, and _p_ro rata for. fL·ac~ions _thereof, with an extra :;;so per !Tille f_or each additional foot ill w1dth rn excess of 9 feet up to aud mel U<ling 16 feet.

SEC. 11. That in no instance shall the Federal reward for any mile of postal-reward road exceed one-third of the total cost of construction of such road.

f 1 ...:. 12. That when any road district shall have improved any rnr:li post road and the proper official shall have made affidavit to this effect to the director of the bureau of postal highways, it shall be the duty of tlle said _ditector of the bureau of postal highways to cause such road to be mspected and to designate to which class the said road properly belongs under the provisions of this act. That when this shall have been done it shall be the further duty of the directot· of the bureau of postal highways to issue his warrant for the Federal reward to which the said road district is entitled under the provisions of this act to the offi.cial of such road dish·ict authorized to receive the same.

SEc. 13. That the dh·ector of the bureau of postal highways is hereby . empowered to demand such BJ:S~em of . inspection by township, road distnct, county, or State authorities durmg construction and repair of postal-reward roads as shall in his opinion be necess::u·y to insure proper construction and repair.

SEc. 14. That when the proper oillcial of any road district s.hall file with the director of the bureau of postal highways such proof as shall be required by said director, showing that rural post roads have been constructed prior to the date on which this act shall become a law it shall be the duty of the director of the bureau of postal highways' to cause all records of the roads and th~ roads themselves to be thoroughly inspeeted and to designate to which class the said roads mav propel'ly belong under the provisions of this act. That when this shail have been done, it shall be the further duty of the director of the bureau of postal highways to issue his warrant for the Federal reward 'to which the said road district is entitled under the provisions of this act to the official of such road district authorized to receive the same : Pt·ovided, however./ That no Federal reward shall be paid for more than 1 mile for every .tO square miles in said road district in any one year for postal-reward roads, which may be constructed under the provisions of this act or which may have been constructed prior to its enactment.

SEc. 15. That when any officiai of a road district shall make the aforesaid proof to the director of the bmeau of postal highways fat• Federal-reward roads he shall, in addition to such other information as the director shall requlre, make affidavit to the cost of building each mile of road, segregating the different items. namely: Preliminary surveys and plans, grading, surfacing, culverts, underdrains, inspection and superintendence, miscellaneous, and total per mile.

SEc. 16. That any moneys paid to any road district as Federal reward for roads constructed prior to the passage of this act shall not be used for any purpose whatsoever other than the further construction of postreward roads : Provided 1toweve1·, That the pt·ovisions of this section shall not apply to roads built by popular subscription: PmvidecZ further, That if all the Federal-reward roads in any road clistl"ict shall have been constructed prior to the time this act shall take effect, the Federal reward may be used for improving or maintaining sueh Federal-rcwat-d roads in said district.

SEC. 17. That to aid in the maintenance of such roads in the classes herein specified, the United States Government sllall pay to the proper


officers in eacb 3uch road district at the end of each fiscal year the sums hereinafter set forth: For every mile of rural post road that clearly comes under the provisions of class A, the sum of $15 ; for every mile of rural post road that clearly comes under the provisions of class B, the sum of '20 ; for every mile of rural post road that clearly comes under the provisions of class C, the sum of $25 ; for every mile of rural post road that clearly comes under the provisions of class D, the sum of $25; for every mile of rural post road that clearly comes under the provisions of class E, the sum of $40 ; for every mile of rural post road that clearly comes under the provisions of class F, the sum of $50; for every mile of rural post road that clearly comes under the provisions of classes G or H, the spm of $60 : Provided, ·however, That the several sums to be paid under the provisions of this section each fiscal year shall not exceed one-hal! the total cost of maintenance for each said mile of road for said fiscal year.

SEc. 18. That all rural-mail and star-route carriers are hereby required to Inspect all rural post roads. That they shall, at least once a month on blanks furnished by the Post Office Department, report as to the conditions of the rural post roals over which they travel in the discharge of their duties. 'Ihat they shall report to the proper road district authorities on blanks furnished by the Bureau of Postal Highways any obstruction which may be found in the road, or any condition existing which -tends to make the said road impassable or difficult to travel. and which may be remedied by the said authorities. That if within 30 days from the time said rural-mail carrier shall have reported to said proper road district authorities, said authorities have not removed said obstruction or properly repaired said road, the said ruralmail carrier shall report same to the Post Office Department and the said road district shall thereby forfeit all claims for Federal aid in maintaining said mile or miles of road in which said obstruction or impassible condition is found for the then current fiscal year: Provided, however, That if it bas not been reasonably possible to remove such obstr·uction or repair such impassable condition within the time specified heeeln the said road district may secure an extension of time ln which to do said work by application to the director of the bureau of postal highways, without incurring the penalties of this section.

SEC. 18. That the director of the bureau of postal highways shall have the power to make such additional rules as shall be necessary for the proper administration of the provisions of this act.

SEC. 20. That this net shall be in force from and after July 1, 1914.

Mr. SHACKLEFORD. I yield eight minutes to my colleague from Missouri [l\fr. RussELL]. [Applause_]

Mr. RUSSELL. :Mr. Chairman, this bill proposes to authorize the expenditure by the Government of $25,000,000 to aid in improving the post roads of the country. If it becomes a law, $1,018,750 will go to the State that I have the honor, in part, to represent.

I can not now discuss at length the merits of this important bill, nor is it necessary for me to do so. The opinion of the House is already formed, and the Representatives here, I believe, are ready to express by their \Otes their approval of its provisions.

It is no longer seriously contended that the Government bas not the power to aid in establishing or maintaining post roads, as provided and as contemplated by the Constitution. It is now, as I understand and believe, simply a question of right, necessity, and expediency.

The annual appropriations of Congress for years have been more than $1,000,000,000, and will probably be no less in this session. Of these appropriations, millions of dollars are expended in the Diplomatic and Consular Service beyond the seas; $14,000,000 are expended in maintaining and beautifying thls Capital City, with its beautiful parks and splendid roads that are enjoyed by a comparatively few of the American people; $40,000,000 are expended in improving our rivers and harbors to promote the commerce of the country, which I have no doubt is wise; over $400,000,000 are expended to sustain the military arm of the Government, to pay the expenses of wars tllat have been, and to prepare for possible future wars that we hope and believe will never come.

It is not my purpose to-day to criticize any of these liberal expenditures; they, or · the most of them, are probably reasonable and necessary iii this advanced age, with the increasing necessities incident to our modern civilization and the great growth and progress of our country. But I do desire to say, and to emphasize the statement with all the earnestness I feel, tllat there is no appropriation that will be made by this Congress, there is none that can be made, fuat will be a direct benefit to so many people as the expenditure provided for in this bill. [Applause.]

A few of the daring may glide through the hazy heights above l.n flying machines, some of the wealthy tourists runy cross the mighty deep in the great ocean-going vessels, and part of the people may traverse our continent in the modern trains on our steam railways; but all the people of this Republknearly every man, woman, and child-travel almost daily upon the public roads. They are traveled by millions of children of both rich and poor on their way to the country schools; they are traveled by the youth of our land on trips of recreation and pleasure; they are traveled by the Christian families of rural homes in going to and from church on the Sabbath day. They are tile highways upon . which the foodstuffs produced on the farms that feed the Nation must be transported to the markets.

Our city friends say that this is only a benefit to the rural communities and of no value to the inhabitants of the a-reat cities. I dislike to think that there is a single Represent~tive upon this floor so forgetful of his duty to the whole people or who is so blinded by his environments that be can not look beyond the corporate limits of the city he represents and see the .necessities of the farmers of the country, or who is not interested enough in the success of agriculture to favor the facilities that will promote that most in1portant industry.

In conclusion permit me to say that good roads puts the producer nearer to the market and nearer to the consumer and will make cheaper to him the products of the farm- without lessening the price to the farmer, and hence is a benefit to both.

No bill more important to more people can come before this House, and none should receive a more hearty support than this bill for Government aid in the construction and improving of public roads. [Applause.]

1\Ir. SHACKLEFORD. Mr. Chairman, I yield to the gentleman from Georgia [Mr. LEE].

.Mr. LEE of Georgia. Mr. Chairman, the good-roads bill under discussion at this time bears the earmarks in many respects of a bill I introduced in Congress nearly nine years ago. I do not claim any great originality in the substance of that bill, but I do congr.atulate both branches of Concrress in the important step we are about to take, for I believ:' this is one of the most important questions before the American people.

The greatest problem we have to solve is to bring the producer and consumer into the cheapest, the easiest, and quickest communication with each other. To this end billions of dollars have been expended on railroads and steamships· to this end the National Government has been liberal in its' expenditures in deepening the channels of our rivers· to this end Congress did not hesitate to spend $400,000,000 in' digging the Panama Canal. I \Otcd for this expenditure, for I realized its importance to the American shipper. I am proud to have been a Representative from the State of Georgia voting to expend this vast sum for the construction of the canat Yet onehalf of this sum expended on our country roads would have brought more comfort, happiness, and prosperity to the American people. We appropriated last year more than a billion dollars for the support of the various branches of the Government. Tbis year the appropriations will likely exceed the billion-doll:l.r mark. The Army will get one hundred. millions, the Navy will get one hundred and forty millions, the Post Office Department gets three hundred and five millions, the agricultural bill w111 carry less than twenty-six millions, a.nd we are asking for only twenty-five millions for good roads in the entire United States. Thi~ is the one item in which the farmer is dii·ectly benefited.

The total farm products of the year 1913 amounted to $9,751,119,000. The farmers added more to the aggregate wealth of the country than all other sources combined. It may be of interest to note the value of the principal farm products for the year 1913: Miscellaneous animal products ----------------------

· Buckwheat---------------------------------------Hops--------------------------------------------F1axseed-----------------------------------------Rice-----~---------------------------------------

~~~============================================= Sugar beets, sugar cane, sorghum, maple, etc _________ _ Barley _____ ---------------------------------------TobaccO--------------------------·----------------Sweet and Irish potatoes---------------------------Oats---------------------------------------------

~~~!~:_a~-~=~~~~~~~~~~~::::::::::~=============== HaY---------------------------------------------Dail·y products-----------------------------------Miscellaneous crops---------------------------------Cotton------------------------------------------Corn---------------------------------------------Animals sold and slaughtered--------·----------------

$6,894,000 10,445,000 14,675, 000 21,300,000 22.090,000 26,220,000 51,383.000 70,600,000

$05,731,000 122,481,000 270,787,000 439,506,000 578,488,000 610, 12:{, 000 707,077,000 814,202,000 956,177,000 944,675,000

1,692,002,000 2,205,799,000

TotaL ____________ -------------------------.- 9, 751, 119, 000

To illustrate the enormous relative value of one of these crops, let us take cotton. For the year 1!:>13 the value of cotton lint was $797,841,000; cotton seed, $146,834,000; total value of cotton crop, $944,675,000.

I find on investigation that the cotton crop for the past 10 years was worth $7,539,00.0,000. The total value of all the gold and silver mined in the world from 1904 to 1913 amounts to $5,433,465,492. That is, the cotton crop was worth $2,105,-534,508 more than all the gold and silver mined in the world for a period embracing the past 10 years.

I can your attention to these facts to show .the importance of but one crop grown on our farms. Every pound of this enormous tonnage must find a market o>er country roads which are during the rainy months almost impassable.

1914. CONGRJTISSIONAL. RECORP-HOUSE·. 3081 Those who have given the question of good roads the closest

study say tilat the cost of getting pr:oduction from the faru~ to the nearest railroad station is greater than the sum the railroads charge for hauling them to the places where they are consumed. I do not see how it is possible to arriYe at a definite conclusion as to this, but a pretty close estimate can be made. It depends on the nature of tile roads. Some are leYel ancl some -hilly, some hard and others soft and miry, and the size of a load that can be hauled o\er a road is regulated by the worst part of it. The farmer hauling a load to market or to his horne from town can haul only as much as his team can pull OYer the worst part of the road.

Roughly speaking, there are o\er a quarter of n million miles of railroads in the United States, equal in length to 42 lines, each 3,000 miles long, from the .Atlantic to the Pacific, and 125 Jines, 1,000 miles Ion;; each, from the Gulf or the Mexican border to the Lakes or Canadian border. If the railroad systems were run in parallel lines north and south and east and west, they would divide the country into blocks 24 miles square. Eight miles we may assume as the nearest distance the ayernge farmer would have to haul his crop.

In going to and from the nearest railroad station the axerage farmer would drive 16 miles. A good two-horse team conld pull three bales of cotton over the average country roads. 'l'he use of the team and driver would be worth $3 per day, and at that rate it would cost $1 per bale to take the crop to the nearest station, which is fully as much as it would cost to haul it n·om that station to New York, or more than it would cost to haul it from the nearest seaport to Liverpool. Of course, the farmer might occasionally take a retmn load from town, thus leaving his crop to bear a less cost for the trip. Even then the cost of getting to the nearest station would almost equal the charge for carrying his crop from one side of the oce:m to the other. If the roads were good he could haul twice as much. It this country were covered with good roads it would save to the farmer or the consumer a smn nearly if not quite equal to the freight earnings of. all the railroads in the United States.

I mention this not for the information of Members of. this House, for others are as familiar witll it as I am. I take it for granted that every l\Iember of this House is as strongly impressed with the benefit of good roads as I am. I giYe this as au estimate of the sum that goes out of the pockets of Americans-a complete waste under present conditions, that would remr..in in their pockets if this country were covered with a network of. good roads. The importance of good roads will be universally conceded.

The next question is, Who will build them? I concede that 50 per cent of t.he burden of the work should be borne by the States or th~ t~ommunities that would be benefited by it.

I think the Federal GoYernment should lend its encouragement and its aid to this work under regulations that would give 1o each State its definite share after it had complied with conditions insuring Federal aid. The work will be more scientifically, more economically, more effecti-vely: done under a system in which the Federal Government will participate than when it is done by the State, or possibly by the counties, and then we nero not try to blink out the fact that the people in some communities feel, and often with good reason, that purely local work generally means unpreparedness, while work in which the Federal Government participates is usually well done.

In nrging Federal participation in road building I am not proposing that the Government assume any new powers or duties. Before my father was born the Government was building roads. In the earlier days of the Republic road building was as unquestionably regarded a power and a duty of the Federal Government as river and harbor improvements are now. I think our best lawyers of to-day will admit that the early patriots of. our country were right in the interpretation of their duties. The records of the earlier Congresses are full of road bills. In fact. my recollection is that through the administrations of Washington, Adams, Jefferson, Madison, Monroe, and John Quincy . .Adams, and into the admiillstration of Andrew Jackson-good old Democratic days-the Governm~nt did more road building than any other work under the "general-welfare" clause of the Constitution.

While the Federal Government has assumed other powers that were not at first supposed to belong to it, this power or duty fell into disuse, and perhaps properly so under conditions ther:. existing. The Governmeut did not encourage the building of roads or assist in their building. It built them and there was no regulation goyerning the apportionment of its work. It built roads, each by special act of Congress and wherever Congress voted to build them. The r€sult was the appearance of the pork barrel. Members wonl,d no doubt swap influence, and roads 'Yere built

LI--105

"' where,·er there was a combination ~trong enough to secure them.

The circumstances to-clay are different. The bill which we offer would leave no room for a scramble. It would apportion GoYernment aid in a fixed manner with fixed conditions precedent to securing it.

I think the building of railroads had somethiq; to do with the withdrawal of the Government from road building. The railroads became the military and the post roads. But ::.ince the Government has undertaken the rural delivery of mails, it is necessary for some one to build good roads to facilitate their delivery. Rural-delivery routes are being gradually e:xte!lded, and it is not an idle dream to say that the time will come when the postman will go to every man's door. The parcel post, another great factor in our development, also tends to the interchange of commodities between country and city, and as its use becomes more preYalent it will be more and more necessary to have roads O\er which loads can be handled economically.

So good roads through the States are needed for the Government's business, and . it follows from this that the Federal GoYernment sho:Jld lend its encouragement to the work of building them. The Post Office Department undertakes to serve all the people. Where railroads extend they carry the mails, but the rural carriers go where there are no railroads. If a community away from the railroads needs a post office, one is established. The Federal Government does not tell the people of such community to build a railroad or do without mail facilities, and it shoulU not tell a section that needs ruraldeli-very route with access to the parcel post that' goes with it to build a hard road or do without the conveniences of rural delh·ery.

The people of the rural districts have exceptional claims . on the Go\ernment. I do not base this &tatement on the fact that they feed the population and lay the foundation of the prosperity of the cities, but I base it on the idea that through many decndes of legislation the Government has discriminated against the farmer. It has arranged for others to reap where he has sown. To the extent that it has sought to build up prosperity

. of a class, it has done so at the farmers' expense. For years the effort has been made to swell the profits of capital in...-ested in manufacturing, and the advocates of protection have professed a purpose of holding up the wages of labor engaged in manufacturing. But to raise this fund to enrich this class the farmer has been taxed. He has borne his share of. the burdens without a share of the profits. Gentlemen on the oth~r side of this Chamber have voted duties on agricultural products, but in few instances h.as it been possible for such duties to benefit the agriculhn·al classes who produce a surplus for export and, not being combined to fix prices, they have had to sell the bulk of their products at home ac a price below that which was paid for Jl·_ir surplus abroad.

The latest RepubJican President, and I believe the last, admitted that the taritr on agricultural products was a sham. He fa...-ored its repeal, and in doing so said it conferred no benefits on agricultural classes. Our banking laws have also discriminated against the farmer. The Government, which has neglected them, I may say oppressed them, so long is under obligation to assist in securing their welfare and happiness tile stronger because of. its long discrimination against them.

Nature works slowly, but it works to rectify wrongs, and the time has ·arrived when, out of this long oppression, has come a compensation. Life was made so hard and unremunerative on the farm that the young men as they grew up turned toward the city where work secured them something more than mere existence. For 30 years, while the cities ha-ve grown rapidly, the country has remained almost at a standstill, and it has come to pass thnt the farms of the land are scarcely able to feed the millions of city population. The value of the farm products has risen -rastly more, and we hear all ovet· the land complaints of the high cost of living. The whole country is suffering from high prices for food products, and there is but one remedyproduce more food; to do this. more producers of food are needed. Back to the farm is now the cry from the cities lliat heretofore have been drawing from the farm the most energetic yotmg men. Back to the farm! The welfare of the whole country demands it.

The farm conditions n..ust be made as agreeable ns 'possible, and the first requirement is good roads. The increase in rural population is a national need, and the Nation should help to . bring it about. The uplifters )lave been studying conditions of rural Jiie, with a view to their betterment. The Government has a commission at work along this line. Nothing will so much improve conditions on the farm as a provision that will draw the people togeth~r socially. Road building tends to remove

BD82 CONGRESS! ON AL RECOR~HOUSE. FEBRUARY ·u, I

d:he 'oppressive solitude that has so long operated to depopulate : the country and to ·substitute for it a large measm;e of the 'Pleasures of 'City life. We have a quarter of a million miles of .ll"ailToad traek, which, [said, ::if l'Uil in :parallel ·lines ·from north 1

rto south ana .from east 'to west, would block off rthe country into squares 24 miles each way, and I estimated that the average !farmer was .g miles from a railroad station. ·nut we have about ~0,000 miles of inland navigable waters which we are beginning tto realize . can be .made much more useful to ·us than an equal •extent of 1'Iillroads. 'These, .if run in parallel lines from ·north ·to south and .from east to west, would block off the country ii:nto squares 200 miles ·each way, .and the av.erage 'farmer would ilive 70 miles from them. 1Jo the tecritory they can serve these "Streams would furnish transportation for ·ouT products at onerthird the cost of transporting them by rail. The producer and ·consumer would share the savings effected by this econo-my. ;Good 1·oads would double the zone ·of country in reach of waterways, and in 'the interest of -people in country and city I ·think rthat road development .:should be considered supplementary to iWateTwa-y improvement. .

The .bill under discussion provides :tor the appropriation o'!. .t25,000,000 .for the current year fo-r cooperative wm·k between .the .Federal Government ·and the States f01· the constr.uetion of .roads. Under this bill :th-ere c.onld be no scramble for appro-

riations, for the bill apportions the fund between the States !by inflexible .mles-one-half in proportion to the mileage of rural ileltve:ry .and one-half 1In proportion io populr..tian. Each State .to avail itself of its sb:a:re must raise a like sum for the work; o<~.nd in case a Stat-e finalcy ·fa.ilB to qualify fDr Federal aid, its .!Share will be con_verted nack into the 'llreasury.

The apportionment in proportion to rural delivery Js an :a-pportionment in proportion to need both of -state .and Federal -Government for the urea involved. The apportiomnent in proportiOn to -population COl!I"esponds .closely with what the Smte contributes to ~the support of the Federal ,Government. The !Federal Government g--ets little of its J.'evenues !fro-m tax on .wealth. Certainly very little until the passage of the income·tax law. Ji deri-ves ·a large part from .a tax on <!Onsumptiont and so the contribution approXbnates much more closely -to 11 per capita .than to a wealth .basis.

I have discussed the question mainly from .a standpoint .o:f the farmer-:a class fed on p1·otestatian of love ·While rbeing taxed fto supply substantial benefits to others. :But it is .not the tfarmer alone who would ·b.e benafited. 1f the farmer can get .his crop to market at less cost than he mow -pays, the city man ;will l>e ahle to ony them for less than he now .gives .!or them. fWhat is proposed in this bill ·will bring :greater pro.sperity to . the fa:rm and ·will Teduce the high cost of lhdng in the citY. If 'the superior comforts and pleasures of rural life attract mo:ce rmen to the .farm, rproduction ·will increase and prices will -dectine and the city man's dollar will buy more than .it buys now.

I have a confident faith that ·this Congress will pass this zmeasure, of such great importance to fue welfare of the Nation ·and to the .happiness .of its rural .population. I am proud tthat I .have heen one of the pioneers ill n:r;ging this legislation. ~d when the day comes that this bill, -or one similar to it, is ,written upon our statute books I believe that the Nation ·will tthen enter upon a good-roads era ;which .can be dearly distinguished by the future historian, rand .for the ·eountless bene-fits that will ~flow from this great work the lOO,OOO,ooe peo!J.)le whom we represent ·will commend Ufl for having rserved them ·SO truly nnd so well.

·Our country is endowed with ·every ·element of true great,ness. I ·do not refer to the overwhelming power .that ·can ·crush an enemy; we have demonstrated this on many battlefields. .[t has that, but there is something better. I refer to the tfertile fields, so ready to yield the abundant harv-est ; -to too motmtain and hill, treasure -vaults of coal, iron, .silver, and ~old; to th-e streams that, rushing downw.a-rd to the plains, dnvite man to come and tharness them to .do ·his ·workt and then, in their more placid stretches, offer to bear ·for himt at llowest cost, commodities from the producer to .the consumer. Providence giTes nothing in 1inished shape. It only rcooperates 1with man in doing his work. The Federal Government, work!.ing for the general welfare, is h~ping the people ·of all sec- · tions to derh·e the greatest degree of benefit from th-e natural .11dvantages that surround them. The work ·broadens with ·the .(Vears, the work of Temoving obstacles ·to success. And I look .!forward to the coming of the d~y, whether I live to see it or not, when all vaTts of this country and all classes of this lan€1 .will enjoy the con>eniences :that are now largely con-fined to the great centers of population, und life will offer :tts pleasures rto uH who liYe beneath the ·shelter of our .national fiug. :f..ipplause.J

l\ir. SHACKLEll'ORD. Will the gentleman from Iowa · [Mr. PROUJ:~ J, , consume some of his time {

Mr. PROUTY. I yield i5 minutes to ·the gentleman from Wisconsin [Mr. BRowNE].

Mr. 1BROWNE of 'Wisconsin. 1\Ir. Chairman, -one ,of ihe most 1mpmrtant und pressing ~conomic und social questions bef-ore the people to·day is that of improving the Nation's !highways. ·Every morning an rrrmy of 43,000 rural letter carrier-s •start on their journeys, and wllen they return at nightfall they have

i:1·aversed over 1,000,000 miles of wagon ·roads. Over these roads the w11o1e food snpply of tbe Nation is hanled annually in wagons, a:nd in addition the -vast tonnage of foodstuffs that we export to foreign countries. Over ·these roads men, women. and children are obliged to travel 'in 'Rll 'kinds of wea.iher, on foot, in wagons, and on horseback, 365 days ·in the year.

Every man's house .faces on a road f.hat conn~cts with evei'Y other road and leads to every other man's house and to ~very market place throughout the lund.

The capital to-day ·invEsted in agriculture, including the personal property, amounts to the stupendous sum of $40,000t000,000. About 50,000,000 of our 92,000,000 people reside in the country ; that is, outside of cities of 2,500 inhabitants or o-ver. Yett out of the annual appropriations ma-de 'by thi-s Government, less than 10 per cent of the money goes to the country in any wa_yt and practically 90 per cent of it goes to 'the cities .

GOOD ROADS WOULD CllEAPEN TRANSPORTATION.

Now, we claim, 1\:Ir. Chairman, that good rands will lessen the eost of transportation. It costs more to haul a ton of freight or a ton of produce by -wagon in the United States than in any other country in ·the world. It has been conservatively .estimated that one-third of the ,cost of every product is the cost of transporting that product .from where it 'is !Produced to where it is consumed. If there is a .great ·needless loss in the cost of transportation, ever:y consumer .shares in that loss. The workingm:m at his b:reakfast table in the city w.ho may be the ultimate •consumer stands his share of it. The highest tux the people are paying to-day is the mud and bad road tax. [Applause.] Anything we can do to cheapen transportation is ·a benefit to ·everybody. Congress annually appropriates large sums of money to facilitate and cheapen transporta:tion. The -rivar .and harbor appropriation, the Panama Canal, the land grants to railroads ha-ve all been justified because they have tended to •cheapen transportation. We .have cheapened trans,Portation so much that to-day on the Great .Lakes, the great 1waterways of .the .country, we can carry a ton of freight from rl;500 to .2,000 miles f0r -$1.25. T.he leading railroad systems ·C.nn carry freight 150 to 200 miles for $1.25, while over the wagon ·roads w:e ·can carry a ton ~f freight ·less than 5 miles for $1.25 .

In fad, jt costs more on an average to hanl a .bushel of potatoes 'from the farm where they are ;produced to the .nea:rest market place than it does to haul them from Dublin, Ireland, :to New York City. Ii by good roads we can lessen the cost of transp<ll."tation 1>y ·wagon 50 or 75 per cent, it is going to reduce ±h.~ cost of production and uJ:timately :reduce the high cost ·of living.

.Jt has be-en said ·by a Secretary of Agriculture that it costs the farmers e-very year to move the great crops they -raise something like .J.1,600t000,000, .and that from four .to five hundlled million dollars ofilis ·amount could be 1saved 'by good u::oads. He-retofor.e 'We .have looked upon the wagon roads as something that concerns simply the :farmer, the man :who li-ves rnpon •the road, nnd we nave not considered .that it :was tlre problem of anybody else. ·we .have shouldered the responsibility of building and•keeping in repaiT 2,000,000 miles of road upon the iarmer alone, and then we criticize him :for .not mnking ·better ~oads and keeping them .in better nepair.

GOOD ROADS 'WOUL'D ..BRNlllFilr EVER'l;RODY.

The question of good roads is a problem that concerns -every'body. At one end of every road is the farmer with his cro_ps :for ..sa1et aggre:gatlng last year nearly $10,000,000,000.

A.t the other end af the Toad is the ci"'ty with its people waiting to be ·fed, with its merchants waiting for trade, and witll the railroads waiting for goods to transport. ·To who'Se advantage is it to 'have -a road for the farmer to come to town? It · is clearly to the advantage of the merchant and the city and the ·railroad more than it iB for the farmer. The farms and the ·farmer -are th.e great and abiding support of the city .

OUR ROAD SYSTEM ANTIQUATED .

We in .America inherited our system of roads from England, a system England a1>andoned centuries ago. .Macaulay in his history o.f England, in speaking about the roa~ system of England before Government aid, writes :

Tbe .highways appear to have been far worse than might have been expected from the degree of wealth and civilization which the nation bad even then attained. Every parish was bound to repair the highway which passed through it. ~hat a route COil!lecting two great towns

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3083 which have a large and thriving trade should be maintained at the .cost of the rural population scattered between them is obviously un]ust. 'l'he injustice attracted the attention of Parliament, and the act, the first of many turnpike acts, was passed. This innovation, however, excited many murmurs; a change was at length effected, but not without much difficulty for injustice and absurd taxation to which men are accustomed is often borne more willingly than the more reasonable impost which is new. •

At that time in the seventeenth century England changed her system and the Government took a hand in road building, and the magnificent system of roads in England show the wisdom of her course. It will not be contended, Mr. Chairman, but that the roads of this country are wholly inadequate. '£he question is how to build and maintain these roads so as to meet the demands and requirements of the twentieth century civilization, and whether the farmer alone shall pay for the cost of the road to town or whether he shall be aided by the city, State, and Nation.

GOVER~MENT EARLY ESTADLISllED PRECEDENT FOR FEDERAL AID.

The Government at an early day embarked in road building. Way back in 1806, under Thomas Jefferson-in fact, before that time George Washington in one of his messages to Congress advocated and recommended national roads. But in 180G Thomas Jefferson advocated national aid for roads. Afterwards, through the efforts of Henry Clay, the great Cumberland road was started, and between six and seven million dollars were appropriated by the Government for tl:is road. Then began a great era of railroad building and land grants to railroads were made and the railroads were given millions of acres of land-as much public laud, in fact, as is contained in se'\'"eral of our largest States of the Union-to aid in railroad construction. 'l'he matter of road building was practically forgotten until the present time. The only national roads the Government has built since that time have been in the Philippines, Porto Rico, and the na tiona I parks.

Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. Will the gentleman yield? Ur. BROWNE of Wisconsin. I will. Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. The gentleman does not mean

to say that the Government has built roads in the Philippine Islands?

1\fr. BROWNE of Wisconsin. I understand Congress appropriated within a session or two something like $6,000,000 for roads in the Phmppine Islands.

Mr. GARRE'l'T of Tennessee. Congress authorized the Philippine Government to m>propriate out of the Philippine revenue money for roads.

1\fr. SAUNDERS. We have built in Panama the same sort of roads.

Mr. BROWNE of Wisconsin. I supposed that it was the Government t:tiat built them in the Philippines, but we have built them in Panama and in the national parks.

Mr. LOBECK. Will the gentleman yield? 1\Ir. BROWNE of Wisconsin. Yes. Mr. LOBECK. We have built roads to the forts in the West,

and the Go•ernment had to build them as military roads. Mr. BROWNE of Wisconsin. Yes; we have built some mili

tary roads. Mr. LOBECK. A good many of them. }..fl·. BROWNE of Wisconsin. Yes; and I think those are all

precedents for the Federal Go•ernment to build roads, and the character of the few roads built by the Government demonstrates that the Government builds good roads when it undertakes it. The question of Federal aid for roads was debated in the early days of the Republic, and the question of the constitutionality was debated, and it was settled then and there that it was not only constitutional for the Government to build national roads but that it was a very wise and propet· policy to follow, .

I believe at the present time we are prepared to start in and help build the road to town. One thing that has probably attracted the attention of the Government to the necessity of aiding in the building of these roads bas been the establishment of the rural free delivery and the parcels post.

ll ORAL DELl\EI!Y .L~D PARCELS POST GREAT EENEFIT TO FARMER.

In the establishment of rural free deli•ery and parcels post this Government, in my judgment, conferred the greatest benefit it ever conferred on its rural population. The parcel post ·bas been administered so successfully during its first trial year that the size of the articles carried has increased from 12 to 50 pounds, and will undoubtedly within the next few years be again increased to meet the demands of a rural population of 50,000,000 people, and freight will eventually be carried by the Government. To do this it is going to require better roads, a better system of road building, and governmental aid.

I believe also in the extension of our rural routes so that in Ute end every man, no matter where his farm is located, if it is

located on a road, can have -his mail, and that now includes packages of 50 pounds, delivered at his front gate.

The road sentiment has grown wonderfully in the last 10 years. 'l'he National Grange, the Society of Equ.ity, and various other large agricultural societies who speak with authority for the farming population are calling loudly for State and National aid.

Forty States, most of them in the last 10 years, have established highway departments, and many of these are aiding in road building.

'rhe farmer_ argues that if the Government is spending hundreds of millions of dollars on its ri'\'"ers and harbors to facilitate transportation, why should it not expend a few millions of dollars annually on its wagon roads, o'\'"er which a hundred times as much traffic passes? I know rivers in my own State, where hundreds of thousands of dollars have been spent by the Government, o>er which there is not as much traffic passes in a year as over some of the country roads in my State in a week.

DIFFICULTIES IN DRAFTING A NATIONAL· . .UD LAW.

To draft a law which will be workable in 48 States under conditions entirely different, a law that States whose constitutions do not permit of State aid for road building can recei•e aid, is not an easy task.

The Road Committee has been aided by the work of the Special Committee on Roads of both Houses appointed in the last Congress. It has had before it at least 20 different road bills. it has listened to the discussion of men, many of them experts and all road enthusiasts, from all parts of the country, aud in presenting tllis bill it believes it has presented a bill that will be workable in all the States.

IMI'ORTANT FEATURES OF THE PROPOSED LAW.

One of the important considerations in a road bill is the distribution of money. This bill proposes to apportion the $25.-000,000 as follows: One-half on the basis of population in the proportion which the total population ot the State bears to the total population of the United States; one-half on the basis the number of miles of rural post roads in use in such State bears to the total miles of rural post roads in use in all ~ States.

This apportionment is fair both to the large State with a small population and the small State with a large population.

The United States shall pay not to exceed one-half of the cost of the construction and maintenance of any road, and the State, or subdivision thereof, shall provide one-half of the cost.

OPTION OF STATES UNDER PllOPOSED LAW.

The State bas the option of expenillng the money recci \"""ed from the National Government on a system of roads as provideu in section 3 of the bill, or section 4, or partly under both.

If it accepts the option given it under section 3 of the bill, the State through proper authority will cooperate with the Secretary of Agriculture in determining the roads to be improved and the manner of constructing and improving them, and the State shall afford such inspection and maintenance as the Secretary of Agriculture sha 11 require.

The second option is a reward plan and provides for the classification of roads A, B, and C.

Class A. is a macadam road, or its equivalent, properly constructed, graded, and so forth. As aid for this kind of a road the Government will contribute out of the State's apportionment $60 per mile.

Class B is a graYel, shell, or combination of sand and clay road, or its equivale.nt, properly graded and constructed, toward which the Government will contribute out of the State's apportionment $30 per mile.

Class C is a graded road, well drained, constructed so as to shed water, and kept crowned and compacted by dragging, toward which the Government will contribute $15 per mile.

The State or civil subdivision thereof shall expend in the construction, maintenance, or extension of any such roads an amount equal to the amount paid by the United States.

I will submit at the close of my remarks two tables showing the number of miles of rural and star routes of each State, and also the amount each State is entitled to under this apportionment in this bill and on the basis of a $25,000,000 appropriation.

WHAT Wl_SCONSIN WILL RECElVE.

The State of Wisconsin under the appropriation will receive $752,500 annually for roads.

Wisconsin last year produced $80,000,000 worth of dairy products, and thus passed the great State of New York in the value of its dairy products, leading all the States in the Union. ·we have hundreds of thousands of acres of cut-over lands in Wisconsin, an even rainfall and a heavy soil makes these lands the best lands for dairying and stock raising in the world. All we need is good roads to unlock the door to our great r-atural resources.

3084 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. ·FEBRUARY 6,

GOVE£:~1\rENT AID WILL STIMULATE ROAD BUILDING. Afaarimum amount of Federal aia to each State U·1lcler pro~;isicms of If Congress passes this bill, it is going to stimulate road H. R.11G86.

building throughout the United States. GOOD ROAOS WILL JUAKE RURAL LIFE JUORE .ATTRACTIVE.

It will check the drift of population from the farms to the cities. In the last 10 years, from 1900 to 1910, the urban population

increased 50 per cent, while the rural population increased only 11.2 per cent, and in some of the great agricwtural States the rural population decreased. This is a situation and tendency which is viewed by many with alarm, and the National Government and many States are in various ways trying to torn back the tide toward the cities with the movement .. back to the farm."

Good roads will tend to help the movement more than anything this Government can do.

Many of the good-road enthusiasts have urged the Roads Committee to report a bill appropriating a large sum of money to build a great transcontinental, ocean-to-ocean highway. Such a road would undoubtedly be enjoyed by the tourists and travelers and be of some practical benefit to those living on or tributary to it, but it would not serve 95 per cent of our population.

The committee has endeavored to frame a law which will help the farmer in moving his crops to market. and which will eventually make a system of roads. connecting all parts of our country.

I believe that a system of roads such as Government aid will insure will improve the condition of rural life and make it more attractive, and have a direct bearing upon the social. intellectual, and economic welfare of the whole people; that it will be followed by a greater activity and cooperation on the part of the rural population of this country that will mean an era of the greatest prosperity this country has ever known.

Charles Sumner, more than 50 years ago, truly said that " the two greatest forces for the advancement of civilization are the schoolmaster and good roads." Li.st, by States, slwWitag the number and aggregate length ot ru1·a1 ancJ

star routes in operation Dec. 1, 1913.

States.

Rural service. Star service.

Number Aggregate Number Aggregate ofrontes. length. ofroutes.. length.

Mila. Milu. Alabama. • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • 1, 040 24, 688 282 2, 850. 88 Arizona. • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • 14 332 84.. 2, 344. 21 Arkansas................................. 460 I0,608 598 6,684.90 Calilornia~-·····~···-················~··· 408 9,462 421 7,999.66 Colorado ....•.........•. '"................ 175 4,572 262 4,687.55 Connecticut. • . . . . . . . • . . . . . . • • . . . • . . . . • • . • 281 6, 17 4 50 263. 22 Delaware ..•. ·-··-······--··············· 107 2,531 14 69.49 District of Columbia ••••••• ·····-·····.... 8 170 ·····-· ••• •.•••..•.. Florida................................... 236 5, 588 192 I, 992. 43

i':~t:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: .... ~:~~~- ---~::~~- 1~g l,m:~

5;~:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ~:m ~f:m 1

~ 3

·~~:~ ~u;::::: :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: i:~ ~:~~ 1§ 2,m:~ Kentucky................................ 767 17,843 867 8,360.99 Louisiana................................ 200 4, 684 337 3, 043. I3 Maine .•.••. ···-········· .••.••••••• ····-· 472 10,797 290 2, 555.11 Maryland..... .............. .... ......... 436 9, 790 161 1,218.13 Massachusetts............................ 304 6, 781 140 859.25

· =~~:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: i;g~ !g;~ ~i ~:~~=~ lUssissi~pi............................... 809 19,271 28I 2, 924. 55 Missouri.................................. 2, 091 49,478 482 5,565. 73 Montana................................. 58 I, 489 241 6, 536. 25 Nebraska................................. I,06S 28,562 232 4., 758.63 Nevada.. . . . . . . . . . . . . • . • • . . . . . . . • . . . . . . . . 4 85 84. 2, 931.96 New Hampshire. • . . • • • . • • • • • • . • • . • • . • • . . • 239 5, 401 125 960. 43 NewJersey............................... 306 6,893 113 552.64 NewMexico.............................. 18 498 224 4,761.11 NewYork................................ 1, 917 44,129 5IO 3,746.72 North Carolina........................... I, 3I6 30, 216 435 4, 427. 90 North Dakota.... ........................ 570 I6,571 197 3,691.00 Ohio ___ ....... ........................... 2, 533 60, 405 171 1, 155. 35 Oklahoma................................ 1,099 29,615 32I 4,482.97 Oregon. .................................. 23S · 5,807 258 5,970.().! Pennsylvania............................. 2,213 50,971 600 4,200.57 Porto Rico....... ........................ ••• •.•••.. .•.•. ••. .• 29 517.23 Rhode Island... • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • 45 988 18 88. 55 SotlthCarolina ........................... 809 19,071 126 1,332.2! SouthDakota .....••••.•........•...••.. ~ 590 17,273 209 ~221.11 Tennessee. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . • . . . . • . • . . . . . . . . . 1, 600 37, 457 228 2, 474. 81

~!!~·-·.:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: I,~~ 4i:ii~ ~ I~~:g Vermont................................. 342 7,545 137 I,I43.34

~~~~tOii:::: :::::::::::::::::::::::::: 1'~ ~:k~ ~ g:~~:~ West Virginia~······ ··-···········--····· 382 8,5~ 487 5,074.lD

;;~~~::::::::::::: ::::::::::::::::::: 1,~ ro,~~ ~ !:~~~ TotaL.-_......................... 42,951 1,042,4771 12,257 1156,457.11

Percent Percent of total of total

State:. popula- Amonnt. stru: and. Amount. Total rural t10n. routes.

Alaba.rna.-•• - •••••••••••••• 2.34 $292,500 2.29 i286,250 1578,751) Arizona ....••••.••.•.••.. .22 ZJ,500 .22 27,500 55, COO A.rkansas ••••••••••••••••• 1. 72- 215,000 1.39 113,750 388 750 California .• ······~·-····· 2.60 352,000 1.43 17 '750 E03: 750 Colorado ••• ····-····~·-· .87 108,750 • 74 92,500 201,250 Connecticut •••••••••••••• 1.22 I52,500 .53 ~·~ 218,750 Delaware ...••.•.••.••.... .22 Z7,500 .21 53 750 Flnrida.. _ •••• ~- ••• __ •• .82 I<Yl,500 .65 81:250 l!t3:750 Georgia ....•...•••••••••• 2.85 3.56, 250 3.32 415,000 771,250 Idaho .....•.•..•••••••... • 36 45,000 .53 66250 ll2,500 lllinois ....•••..•••••••••. 6.17 771,250 5.84 'i3o;ooo 1, 501,253 Indiana •••••••••••••••••• 2.95 368,750 5.18 647,500 1,016, 250 Iowa .........•.••••.•.•.. 2.43 303,750 5.05 631,250 935,00J Kansas .•••••••••••••••••• 1.85 231,250 4.34 542,500 773,750 Kentucky •.....•••••.•.•. 2.5I 313,750 2.16 270,000 583,750 Louisiana ...••••••••••••• 1.8I 226,250 .61 76,250 302,500 Maine ••...••••• ······- •• . 81 101:,250 1.IO 137,500 238,750 Maryland .....•.•••...•.. 1.42 177,500 .9I 113,750 291,250 Massachusetts .•.• '" ...... 3.68 460,000 .63 78,750 538,750

Hf~ta:~:_::::::::::::: 3.08 385,000 4.31 538,750 923,750 2.27 283 700 3. 70 4&!,500 746,250

~:.¥.~~:: ::::::::::::: - 1.97 246:250 1.82 227,500 473,750 3.60 450,000 4.55 568,750 1,018, 75()

Montana ................. .41 51,250 .62 77,500 128,7'".,0 Nebraska ...•.••.•.••...• 1.30 162,500 2. 75 343, 75() 506.,250 Nevada .........•...... ~. .09 11 250 .25 31,250 42,500 New Hampshire .•••..••• .47 58:750 .53 66,250 I25,00() ~ewJer~y .....•.......• 2. 77 346,250 .62 77,500 423,750

.ew Mexico .•.•••••••• ~- .3"6 45,000 .44 55,000 100,000 New York ... ···-·······- ·9.97 1,246,250 4.00 wo,ooo 1, 746,250 North Carolina •.••••••••• 2.41 30I,250 2.87 358,750 660,000 North Dakota ......•...•. .63 78,750 1.63 203,750 282,500 Obio .......•..•• ~······· 5.22 652,500 5.14 642,500 1,295,000 Oklahoma ..•.•..•••....• 1.81 226,250 2. 77 346,.250 572,500

~~~Ivruiia:::::::::::: • 74 92,500 .96 120,000 212,500 8.39 I,048, 750 4.60 575,000 1,623, 750

Rhode Island ..•.....•.•. .59 73,750 .08 IO,OOO 83,750 South Carolina ....•.•..•• 1.66 207,.500 1.66 207,500 415,00() South Dakota .. __ •••••• .64 80,000 1. 75 218,750 298,750 Tennessee •••••••••••••••• 2.39 298,750 3.26 407,500 706,25() Texas .........•.••••••••. 4.26 532,500 4. 75 593,750 1,126,250 Utah. •.. •• •••n--•••••• .41 51,250 .30 37,500 88,750

~1;=~= ::: ::::::::::::: .39 48,750 .72 90,000 138, 75{) 2.26 282,500 2.n 308,750 59I,250

Washin~n. ••••••••••••• 1.25 156,250 .85 106,250 262,500 W~st V~inia .•.•• ·-····· 1.3:! I67,500 1.13 141,250 308,750 W lSCOIISID... ••••••••••••••• 2.55 318,750 3.47 433,750 752,500 Wyoming .....•.••••..••. .10 20,000 .36 45,000 65,000

TotaL.······-·~·· IOO.:U I2,530,000 99.49 12,436,250 24,967,500

Mr. SHACKLEFORD. Mr. Chairman, I yield to the gentleman from Oklahoma [Mr. DAVENPO.RT].

[1\Ir. DAVE~TPORT addtessed tile committee. See Appendix.] 1\Ir. SHACKLEFORD. Mr. Chairman, I yield now to the

gentleman from Missouri [Mr. HA~]. Mr. HA.l\ILIN. Mr. Chairman, I am in . favor of good-roads

legislation at this session of Congress, and I am therefore glad that the Rules Committee have made it possible for this bill to be taken up in the Honse t:llli3 early in the session. So anxious am I to get this bill through, so it can go early over to the Senate, that I would not take any time to discuss the bill here were it not for the fact that I am a member of the committee which bas been designated by the House to go to Michigan to investigate the great copper strike now on in that State, and it may be necessary for me to leave for that place before this bill is finished and voted upon, and I am therefore anxious to record myself now in favor of Government aid of some kind in the building of good roads.

This is not a perfect bill. I 'do not believe that one can be drawn until we have tried out the experiment; but I believe that it is the best bill available and is undoubtedly a step in the right direction. If this bill becomes a law, then after it is in operation its defects and shortcomings, if any, will be detected by actual experience, and it will then be an easy matter to amend and in that way finally work out a practically perfect measure.

This bill contains two propositions. Section 3 provides for the Government aiding the different States or subdivisions thereof in the construction and maintenance of good roads, the Federal Government to pay one-half of the cost, which money is to be available as soon as the other half is raised by the States or local communities, in such manner as that State or local community may determine. And this money is to be expended under the supervision of the State authorities and the Secretary of Agriculture. It appears to me that this is a very liberal proposition on the part of the Federal Government. If these roads are to be built by_ Government aid, it must be on the

1914., . CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE.: 3085 theory that they :are post ·roads. I mean by -that, roads over which the Government js engaged in carrying the mails. This is required so as to conform to the Constitution of the United .States. Congress has no authority to appropriate money for the building of roads except these roads are to be used .as post roads, military roads, or, pexhaps, :for the transportation of interstate traffic.

Section 4 provides for the payment of rentals by the Eederal rGo'vernment on roads already built by the States or some subdivision thereof, or for roads .hereafter to be built w.holly .at the ,expense of the State or subdivision thereof; and for the purpose of fixing the amount to be paid by the Federal Government -on any particular road the bill divides the different kinds of roads into three classes, known .as class A, class B, and class n Class .A is to be a macadam :road, and class B to be a well-built ll'Oad "with a .road track composed of shells, gravel, or a p1·oper combination of sand and clay, or other material of equal utility but less expensive than macadam, constructed in such manner that it shall have a smooth, fum su:rfnce." Class .c embraces roads built out of dirt or such material as is in t.he roadway, built in such way as to adequately drn.in, with _ample side ditches to shed the water, and to keep tile crown compact by dragging or other adequate _means, so that it can be reas.onably passable for wheeled vehicles.

For class A tbe ·Government agrees to pay 1lD nnnual rental of $60 per mile; for class. B, .$30 per mile ; and class C, $15 per mile. I am inclined to think thn. t these amounts are perha-ps not equitably rated. While I recognize .that the Go:vernment ()Ught to pay more rental on high,class roads-it for no -other reason than to encourage the building -of better Toads--yet I am inclined to think that the difference specified .in the tbill is a little too great. But I understand that ,these rates have been fixed by the committee, lik~ .nearly -every other proposition must be done in legislation, lar:gely as a compromise between con-fficting wiews. ·

.It may be well to state here in further explanation -of the bill, as I understand it, that .$25.000,000 is authorized to be appro-

. priated to carry out the pTovisions of tbis bill during the .next .fiscal year and this money is to be prorated to the different States upon the following basis. No State will receive less than $65j000. Then ane-.halt of the amount will be based on the basis that the total population rof a particUlar State bears to "the total population of all the States. The other half of tb.e allotment will be based upon the basis which the total mileage ref

. rural routes m any particular State bears ·to the total mileage of tbe rural routes in all the States of the Union. This I regard as a splendid tProvision in this ·bill, for it prevents some -f)f the larger States ·from .getting all JJf this money. In other wo1·ds, it treats all of the States faiTly.

This seems guite a large a_ppropriation for the first year and some of the opponents to this bill argue that it will not be lon_g, if this £Cherne is carried out, tmtil we will be appropriating a hundred million -dollars a year .for good roads. It appears to me that a sufficient answer to that criticism is that not one cent of this money can be ·spent unless •we have good roads to spend it on, and if the time shG11ld come -when we shall be expending a hundred million dolla:es a yeaT on good roads it is a cinch we will have the .good roads. .And if we have good roads it will increase the val11e of the farms and town -property, to say nothing of the other benefits to all the people, not only a ·hundred million dollars but billions of dollars.

We have been ·spending nrillions of dollus each year i;o build great engines of warfare with which to destroy JJur -fellow men. I would .rather-infinitely ratller-pnt the money in building good roads in our country, thereby ·conserving the aives and happiness of our boys and girls and making rural life more comfortable and pleasant.

There is another ;prGposition advocated by some. That is Ito have the Government build or aid in building what my friend Judge SHACKLEFORD designates as peacock boulevards aeross the cauntry from ocean to ocean. Now, I have no objection to these cross-country roads, and I would be glad if we .had any number of them, not only one east and west but one north and south, if we can also .ha\e these post roads. But I confess th.at these boulevards would be of but little value to the millions of farmers throughout the length and breath of this country, who would have ·to bea:r largely ·the expense of these ·boulevards and snffer most from the Jack of .good roads. I prefer, therefore, 1to ~upport a proposition that tends to build good roads, not boulevards, throughout the country, so that the 'farmers can haul their produce to town, send ,their children to school, and tnke their families ·to church <>n Sunday in some degree of comfort. Adopt the rural .fre&delivery rout-es_, as this bill does, "aDd you can £ecure a network of good roads thl'onghout every seetion of the country, provided the ;purpose of

this bill is fully carried out. There is scarcely a town of any .size in the whole country from which there does not rruliate from 4 to 10 rural routes, running out like spokes of a wheel. These ea.rliers go out on one road on an .average of about 10 miles and -come back on another.

Take a town with four routes running out. That means that they use about eight .different roads out from this town an average of 10 miles. Suppose these roads were built up to even class C, and a blind man can see at a glance tbe great benefit it would be to all the farmers living around that town, as well as the benefit to the merchants and other people living in the town. And then, again, tbe routes out of one town practically, .and frequently do, meet the routes out of another town, and if we could get all of these roads improved we would have a. complete network of good roads throughout the entire traveled section of our country; and I can conceive of nothing that would ,be of as much .material benefit to all the people.

It has been urged by some that the people of the large cities will have to pay a large per cent of this cost. That is true, but they wjll undoubtedly get a large per cent of the benefits. This system benefits the whole country .and makes it prosperous, and therefore benefits the large cities and makes them prosperous. The large cities do not make tbe country, but the country does make the large cities. The farmers produce the stuff which feeds the world, and we are confronted to-day b:Y1 a loud, persistent, and, I think, a just cry, coming up .from the consumer in the cities against the high cost of living.

This road scheme about which I have been talking will, l believe, if carried out, go a 1ong way toward solving this problem. The farmers llave prospered for the last >Several years and will, I believe, continue to prosper ; but I want t.o make this statement-while it may seem somewhat startling, nevertheless it is true--the farmers do not get for their products over .50 per cent :of what their products cost the consumer. Naturally you .ask, Who gets the other 50 per cent? I answer, it is eaten· up on express charges and commission to tbe middlemen .

Mr. Chairman, let me give yon a concrete illustration: The gentleman from Maryland [Mr. LEWis], who has given this transportation question moce study th.nn any other man in this Honse, informed me that he took the trouble to trace $5 worth of produce, .such as butter, chickens, eggs, and so .forth, from a farmer out 25 miles from this eity into Washington and into the homes of the people who consumed the same. This particular shipment for which the farmer Tec:eived $5 cost tbe people who consumed ,it here in Washington $11.20, or .more than double what ·the farmer got for it; and what is true in this particular ea-se iB true all over the co-untry. The farmers are therefore unjustly blamed for the high cost of living.

There was _great opposition to the passage of the parcel-post law. I think already that it has been proven, even in the sho.rt time it has been m operati-on, to be a splendid law. I thought so .nt the time, and was heartil~ in favor of its enactment. Now, with parcel post operating over good roads, -such as this bill pro-vides, .:forming a network throughout the country so that the rural carriers can transport large packages, much of the things the farmer raises can go by parcel post direct to the consumers 1n the cities, saving the he!).vy express charges and cutting out the commission of the middlemen, .and thereby lowering the high cost of living and at the same time ,enabling the farmer to get as good or a. better price for his produce than he does now. So from almost any standpoint it seems to me that this bill is a most excellent step in the right direction.

I referred a few ·moments ago to tbe building of battleships. It may not be uninteresting to know tbat last year the total net appropriations for all purposes of the Federal Government was $788,864.,598.73, and of this fabulous sum $335,440,612.35 went to the Army -and Navy. Practically one-half of this appropriation last year went to support the militar:r arm of this GO>ernment, :and yet we boast that we are at peace with the whole world and that we are the leading Christian Nation of the earth. If the present pr.ogram is carried out, it will be even worse this year, tor it is now :proposed to build two battleships instead -of one, and we have reached a point where we can not build battleships -for less than $.17,000,000 each.

When I first came to Congress a few years ago, we tbougbt it was terribl€' to build a battleship at a cost of $5,000,000, but now we do not think of building one which costs less than $17,000,000. And, to my mind, this program is out of harmony with the fundamental ideas of our people. Let us cut out these battleships and use this mone_y in helping to improve our country~ .and consequently the eonditi<>ns of our people.

Those of us who contemplate seriously the great moral as well as economic problems which are confronting us, realize the tremendOllS danger attending the exodus of the boys and girls from the farms to the large cities. The temptations which sur-

3086 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-· HOUSE. FEBRUARY 6,

round them in the cities are innumerable. We must realize that the real safety of our Government depends upon the moral standing of our people. No place has yet been found so good us the rural rustricts in which to develop not only the muscle but the brain and moral characters of the boys and girls. I have never ceased to be thankful that it was my good fortune to he born and reared on the farm. So, of course, any proposition intended to improve and make comfortable and attractive farm life receives my most hearty support. I hope that this bill will pass and let us try it out, and then if defects and imperfections are found in this measure we can in the future remedy them.

I feel that there can not be too much praise given to Judge SHACKLEFORD for his extraordinary industry and courage in standing by the people who live in the rural districts, and as chairman of the great Committee on Good Roads in the House he has worked out a plan which we believe is in the interest of all the people.

He has not brought in a bill, as some would have him do, to commit this Government to the proposition of ignoring the country roads and simply build across the country boulevards in order that the idle rich may joy ride in automobiles from ocean to ocean.

Let us build the country roads first und then there will be time enough to joy ride.

Mr. SHACKLEFORD. Mr. Chairman, I yield five minutes to the gentleman from Oklahoma [Mr. FEBRIS].

[Mr. FERRIS addressed the committee. See Appendix.] Mr. BARKLEY. 1\fr. Chairman, I rise for the purpose of

supporting the bill now under consideration. I support it because, first, I believe in the principle of Federal aid in the construction and maintenance of good roads throughout the country, and, second, because I pledged myself to this legislation when I was a candidate to represent the people of my district in this Congress.

One of the objections which has been raised to this bill is that it is not constitutional. That is usually the excuse offered by those who are not in sympathy with legislation for the benefit of the whole people. Unconstitutional! The Constitution of the United States was established for the benefit of the people and not to hinder them. In the preamble of that instrument the purposes for which it is ordained and established are · set forth, and one of those purposes is "to promote the general welfare." I would ask those who oppose this bill what aid could the Federal Government give in the way of an appropriation that would go further in " promoting the general welfare " than this appropriation to cooperate with the States and local communities in building and keeping up good roads? By· what other method can the people be made to feel their connection with and interest in this great Government of ours more fully than by aiding them in the building of the roads which lie in front of. their doors? I know of nothing that this Government can engage in that will bring greater benefits to all the people or more truly "promote the general welfare" than the work in which we are now engaged.

But, 1\Ir. Chairman, to those who claim that such an appropriation is in violation of the Constitution, I would direct their minds to the provisions of the Constitution itself. Section 8 of Article I provides, among other things, that Congress shall have power " to establish post offices and post roads." A post road is any road over which the mail of the United States is carried or delivered, which includes every rural free delivery route and every star route in the United States. That is all this bill proposes to do. It proposes to aid the States and local communities in building and maintaining post roads. In my own opinion Congress has the power to go even further than that and assist in the consh·uction and maintenance of roads· under the commerce clause of the Constitution, giving Congress power to regulate commerce among the States and with foreign nations. And in a bill which I have introduced for the purpose of aiding the good-roads movement I do not limit the appropriation to post roads, but make it apply to other roads as well, where they are used in transporting farm products from the farm to the market. But it is not necessary to discuss that phase of the question, as tbe bill which has been reported from the Committee on Roads and is now under consideration is limited to post roads.

This question, 1\fr. Chairman, of Federal aid in the internal improvement of our country is not a new question. Many decades ago men on the fioor of this House and in the Senate who have long since gone to their reward advocated internal improvements by the Federal Government. So earnestly and so eloquently did Henry Clay, of Kentucky, plead for Government hid in the internal improvement of this Nation more than 60

years ago that he became known as the "father o:f internal improvements." It has long been the settled policy of this Government to appropriate money for and to actually conduct improvements on all our navigable streams and in the harbors of the country for the purpose of aiding navigation, and thus aiding commerce "among the several States and with foreign nations." It has also been the settled policy of this Nation for many years to appropriate money out of the Public Treasury for the purpose of reclaiming the arid lands of the West by irrigation and other methods, so that American homes might be found there for American men and women. In fact, the Federal Government has for many years been gradually increasing and extending its assistance to the people in all kinds o:f enterprises for their betterment and for making this Nation more happy and mor~ prosperous. Our activities along these lines have included such subjects as health, agriculture, science, navigation, aviation, irrigation, transportation, conservation, and other kindred subjects which bear upon the consh·uctive development of our country. Realizing that there is no more serious agricultural or economic question now confronting the American people, Congress and the Democratic Party now propose to recognize the relationship between the farmer and commerce, between the good road and the problem of transportation everywhere, and to assist in this most worthy enterprise. .And in this connection it may in the beginning be wise to limit our cooperation to those roads which are used by the United States in carrying the mails; and as rural routes are gradually increased, as we hope they will be, and the experiment proves valuable, we may branch out further in the direction of other constitutivnal aids to the people in helping to solve their great problems.

While we in the United States have many things of which to boast, and of which we do boast, we must admit that in the construction and maintenance of our public roads we are fat behind many of the other nations of the world. This may in part be explained by reason of the fact that they are so old and we are so new, and by the fact that we have been somewhat dazzled by our own unlimited possibilities, in the way of accumulating wealth, developing rapidly the natqral resources of the country, and many other economic factors which I do not desire to discuss at this time. But it is a notorious fact that in many portions of the United States the roads are about the most unpromising feature of the country. This comes about in some measure by reason of local conditions and the laws governing the different States. In some of the States aid is given direct by State taxation from the State treasury, the State bearing half the expense and the local community bearing the other half. But in many of the States the burden of road building and road improvement is borne wholly by the local community. By reason of the limitations placed on the amount of taxes that may be raised by any county or other subdivision of the State, it is a financial impossibility to secure enough money by taxation to build a system of permanent roads. It is about all the average county can do to raise enough money to keep its roads and bridges in reasonable repair, with little left for building permanent roads. So that, if the people who have heretofore borne the full burden of these taxes and these expenses are to be rewarded with a system of highways which will be permanent and adequate, it is plain to me that some aid must come from the outside. Where else can or ought we to go except to the Government of the United States, which is the Government of all the people, big and little, high and low, rich and poor, farmer, merchant, lawyer, laboring man, and all other vocations which might be enumerated?

It is stated by those who have made a study of the question, and I have no doubt of its truthfulness, that in England, France, and Germany, where the roads are perhaps more universally improved than anywhere else, the average cost of transporting farm products from the farm to the market is from 9 to 12 cents per ton per mile, and in the United States, where our roads are not improved to any great extent, it costs about 28 cents per ton per mile to haul the farmer's products from his farm to the market. In other words, in France, England, or Germany, where their roads are practically all improved, it costs a farmer about 90 cents to haul a ton of farm products a distance of 9 miles, but in the United States it costs him about $2.50 to haul the same amount of produce the same distance. This is accounted for in the length of time lost, wear and tear upon the teams, wagons, and other implements, and other elements that must be accounted in estimating the value of a man's time and the depreciation in his property.

We have heard much complaint in recent years on account of the high cost of living. It might be well for our economists to account for this difference in the cost of transportation in the United States in estimating and arriving at the reason for the high cost of living. Though this, of course, is only an element

1914. CONGRESS! ON AL RECORD-HOUSE. 3087 of that cost, among many others, it is of sufficient importance to arouse our attention and can for our best efforts in solving tlle question.

Mr. LEWIS of Maryland. Has the gentleman :from Kentucky any information as to the average haul in those countries compared with the average haul here?

!Jr. BARKLEY. l\Iy information is that in the old countries the average haul is about 9i miles.

l\Ir. LEWIS of Maryland. What is it here? Mr. BARKLEY. It is the same. The cost per ton-mile is

predicated upon the same mileage in this country as compared with tbe other countries. This difference in the United States by reason of the 'loss of time, wear and tear upon farm machinery and implements and teams, and depreciation, and other items which must be taken into accotmt, amounts to a loss to the American farmers of anY\there from $250,000,000 to $500,-000,000 every year, by reason <>f the unimproved ~ondition of our roads.

So, l\Ir. Chairman, as an economic proposition, appealing ~o Cong1Tess from its economic and commercial standpoint alone, it is in the interest of lowering the cost ot living, of promoting more efficiency and better conditions of agriculture throughout the country for the United States Government to appropriate the money provided in this bill, wbieh is a mere pittance com_pared with the total of its other expenditures.

Mr. Chairman, there are three things which, in my opinion, add to and promote very materially the civilization and impro"\"ement of our rural population. One is the country church, to which the man in the country takes his family to worship th~ God of his fathers according to the dictates of his conscience. Another is the countrY' schoolhouse, to which the man in the country sends his children to obtain that knowledge which will enable them in future years to attain success in life. The other is the country road, over which the people must travel, not only to church and to school, but to the market with their produds, and in that social and neighborly communication which adds .so much to the attractiveness .and purity of country li:ta. And I might add, as a fourth element, the free rural mail delivery, which brings the daily paper, the magazine, and other sources of communication and education to the door ot the farmer every morning. There can be no denial of the true importance af these institutions-the church, the school, the road, and the free delivery of mail-in bringing about higher standards of morali.ty, higher standards of education, and better standards of living throughout the expanse ot this great land. .A.nd anything that Congress may do that will aid the ,farmer nnd his boy and girl in elevating morality, education, .and civilization is a worthy and economical woTk and one iii which we may be proud to engage. [Applause.]

Mr. MURRAY of Oklahoma. Will the gentleman yield there for a question?

Mr. BARKLEY. I will, if I have the time. Mr. MURR_'\.Y of Oklahoma. I wanted to ask the gentleman

if he believed in the system of roads provided for in this bill thnt would lead from the country to the town market, or did he believe in another system that has been proposed of crosscountry roads?

1\!r. BARKLEY. 1\lr. Chairman, I know what is in the gentleman's mind. There are two schools of advocates <>f Government aid for roads in this country. One school believes that the Government ought to appropriate large sums of money tor the purpose of building great national highways, or a few of them, from one ocean to the oth-er, or from one great city to the other, not because such roads would aid in solving the problem of transportation for the average farmer, but because such a road upon which the Government had expended a l:lrge .sum would then afford a boulevard for the enjoyment of those who were seeh.;ng p1easure. The other school believes that 1f the G<>vernment goes down into the people's Treastli'y and appropriates money for roads, that money ought to be spent where the people, the common people, if you please, who bear the burden of the Government in time of peace and win its battles in time of war, may receh·e some benefit from the expenditure of their money. I belong to the latter school. I believe that ·trllcn the Goyernrnent spends its money in enterprises of this l.."ind it ought to be spent where it will benefit all the people as neariy as possible and not for the benefit of a few. I look Ul)()ll a public rand ... s a public necessity and not an a venue of pleasure or luxury merely. If all our roads were improved, the man who wnnts to use them for pleasure can do so as well as the man who wants to haul his corn or his wheat or his tobacco to the market. But if we spend all our money on one great h.jgl!way fi'om ocean to ocean, while it won1d be valuable to those who bppened to live upon it, it would afford no benefit to

the great masses of om people who need good roads and ~ed them now. [Applause.] If that answers the gentlema.n's question, I hope he will stand

with me on that question. The money appropriated for a public road is appTopri.a.ted because of the necessity of traveling over it, to enable the farmer to tr~ort more easily and more swiftly and more cheaply his products from farm to market. If somebody who has the time to enjoy them :finds pleasure in traveling o\er them for the sake of pleasul"e, all well and good. Let him enjoy them. But let us provide for the necessities of life before we try to capture the luxuries. The improvement of our country roads will benefit not only the farmer but the man in the city by lessening the cost of transpoTtation and the cost of living and add to the convenience and happi-ness of every citizen. [Applause.] ·

We have heard much, 1\ir. Chairman, of late years concerning the tendency of the people, and especially of the young men of the country, to leave the country and go to the city. We have seen conventions of bankers, of lawmakers, of social economists, and eminent men in all walks of life trying to find the reason for this migration from country and to :find some remedy for it. In my opinion one of the reasons why so many young men prefer to lea"\"e the country and go to the city has been on account of the hat'dsbips that in many sections of the country hnve heretofore existed m farm life; the inconveniences and the disadTantages -and other elements entering into the causes of discontent which haye led many a young man awny from the farm. Many <>f your bright, stslwart, vigorous, and 'hrmest young men upon the fa1·m have been lured to the city by reason of what seemed to be a brighter prospect, greater opporttmity, o1fered in the city. Some have been lured by the love of comfort nnd their unwillingness to undergo the hardships wllich tlley thought existed on the farm, forgetting tllat their fathers and grandfathers had undergone hardships and privations and sacrifices never dreamed of in 'OUr generation. But whatever may be the <·ause, I believe it to be our duty here to aid and encourage better conditions of farm life, more scientific methods of agriculture, and thus aid the farmer in solving the great problem of feeding and elothing the world. Thei'e is no greater calling than that of tilling the soil.

The man who keeps close to nature and listens to her yoice i~ t:J:e morning as th~ snn comes up and hears the drowsy, tinklmg of the cowbell 111 the e-vening ought to be a happy man. The boy who is raised out in the country, with the fresh air. the sunshine, and the pure ideals that are cherished in a Christian h'Ome where the love of God and home nnd country

1 Jllls the human heart, ought to be a happy boy. '.rhe girl who tosses her gold~n locks among the apple blossoms as she climbs the apple tree and sings the sweet melodies she has heard her mother sing ought to be a happy girl. And any legislation which we may enact here that may by its results encourage these boys ,and these girls to remain in the country and bring about conditions where farm life wiU be comfortable, attrnctive. and profitable to them even more than it is to-day \vill be bene-. ficial to the country at large and add to the sum total of Otll.'\ greatness. [Applause.]

We cnn not, Mr. Chairman, overlook our duty in this Congress to the farmer . . As I suggested awhile ago, the farmer feeds and clothes the world; and as the years go by and population increases each acre of land mnst feed and clothe more people than it dld the year before. It is beginning to be necessary, to reClaim and rejuvenate the old worn-out land that our grandfathers cleared up, wore out, and then abandoned, in order that' it may be utilized in this great problem of agriculture. The Government is aiding in this somewhat, bnt it has only been of recent years that the Government has enlarged its efforts to aid the farmer. It :first established the Department of Agriculture, which has grown and will continue to grow and become the most important branch of the Federal Government. A department of agriculture is usually more beneficial and more in keeping with the principles of our Government than n department of war, though that department, too, is sometimes necessary. More recently the farmer has been given the free delivery of his mails, which has been a great boon to him 'in every way. Later the parcel post has been provided for him, which enables him to utilize the United States mail in transporting that which he has to the city and that which he wnnts from the city. We arc now seeking to provide for him a better road over which that mail will travel and over which he may. travel himself in his dally .communications with the world. Let us hope also that before this Congress shall have adjom·ned we may provide for him a law that will make it easier for him to secure that credit which he may neBd to finance ms farm and build his home at rates of 'interest th1t will ))~ ~t once fair and reasonable.


If we shall be able at this session of Congress to enact, in addition to what we are now trying to do, a really constructive and adequate rural credits bill, which will afford facilities for borr.owing money on terms at least equal to that of others in this and other countries, we will have performed a duty the result of which can not be measured in a year or a generation. I am confident that under the wise leadership of our great Democratic President, Woodrow Wilson, we shall be able to accomplish this task, as we have accomplished others since the 4th of last March. [Applause on the Democratic side.]

In conclusion, .Mr. Chairman, let me say that I hope this bill will pass this House almost with a unanimous voice. I believe that it will receiYe more votes in its favor in proportion to the membership than any bill of similar importance during this session. 'Vhen that is accomplished, we will have gone far in convincing tlle people of our country that we are honestly seeking to enlarge their opportunities, to enhance their welfare, and cause them to feel a close personal interest in the conduct of their Government. Under the provisions of this bill each State will receive that portion of the fund to which its population nnd rural post-road mileage will entitle it. For instance, Kentucky will receive about $583,000 each year, which will iu turn go to each of the counties in such proportion as may be provided by law, thus supplementing the amount that can be raised by local taxation for the purpose of improving roads. Who is able to predict what a revolution in the building and improvement of our roads 10 years will bring, by reason of this encouragement from the National Government? Let us hope that the people of all the States will gladly take advantage of this cooperation and reap its benefits a hundredfold in aU that goes to make life happier, communic.."l.tion easier, and the people more contented in the enjoyment of a genuine and permanent prosperity. [Applause.]

Mr. SHACKLEFORD. Mr. Chairman, I yield five minutes to the gentleman from Indiana [Mr. ADAm].

[Mr. A..J?AIR addressed the committee. See A_ppendix.] Mr. SHACKLEFORD. I yield five minutes to my colleague

from Missouri [Mr. RuCKER]. [Applause.] [Mr. RUCKER addressed the committee. See Appendix.] Mr. SHACKLEFORD. Mr. Chairman, I yield five minutes to

the gentleman from Kentucky [Mr. FIELDS].

Mr. FIELDS. Mr. Chairman, I am in hearty accord with the bill now under consideration, known as the good roads bill, and shall give it my earnest support. I do not support this bill because I believe it is absolutely correct in every detail, but because the principle upon which it rests is both sound and correct, and because in doing so I exercise the dictates of my own judgment and reflect the sentiment of the constituency which I represent.

The bill is not an that I would have it be. If left to me to frame, coming from that class of districts that have been so long neglected by the Federal Government, namely, an agricultural district, I would make the general appropriation larger and increase the sum per mile to be expended in the improvement of both dirt and macadamized roads. In fact, the greatest objection to the bill is that it does not appropriate as much money as it should; but it is a step in the right direction, which will ultimately lead to more extensive improvements in our public highways, and by so doing will carry the support of the GoYernment to every section of the country, which will benefit the farmer, because it will lighten his burdens of getting his products to market. It wil' benefit the city dweller who consumes those products, because it will lessen the cost of trans-portation, which he must ultimately pay. .

This . bill, Mr. Chairman, if it becomes a law-and I have no doubt that it will-will mark the beginning of a new epoch in the legislative history of our country. It will of itself be evidence that the National Congress bas at last turned its att'.!ntion to the rural sections and the farmers, upon whom the Nation as a whole must depend for its food, its wealth, and its prosperity for the future. The cause of Federal aid for public highways has been advocated in this body and on this £oor for many years by a few who came from the farm and were in touch with the rural life; but their contentions have repeatedly been met with the theory that legislation of this character was unconstitutional and that it would conflict with State rights, and the further arguments that such expenditures of the public funds were unwarranted from an economic standpoint, all of which contributed to the defeat of the legislation. But those objections have been repudiated by public sentiment, and the proponents of these measures haT"e pressed forward and battled onward and have been encouraged by the people back home with the blessed assurance that their course and their efforts

had been approved. Other sections of the country likewise encom·aged them by electing to Congress men fresh from the farm and men thoroughly in touch and in full sympathy with th3 farmers' needs, until to-day the farmer and producer, who constitute the bulwark of the Nation, hold the balance of power in this body.

Only a few years ago, Mr. Chairman, the farmer knocked in vain for admittance to this Chamber. That he is here now, and in control of his rights, is evidenced by this and other legislation passed by this Congress. He asserted his rights in the writing of the tariff law by eliminating from it that feature of taxation which had lain so heavily upon him through tariff-protected fence wire, farming implements, harness, and lumber, the prime necessities in fencing and tilling his soil and building his home .. In writing the currenc:;y bill into law we opened a new aT"enue of credit to the farmer by permittmg the national banks to make five-year loans on farm lands, a privilege hitherto denied him; and to-day, Mr. Chairman, we are opening a new avenue of commerce to him through the rural sections by uppropriating money with which to improve the roads over which he must haul his products, and I trust that it may not be long until Federal aid will be extended to our institutions of learning until there will be an industrial, vocational, and agricultural school within reach of every community. When we shall have accom·plished these reforms we can then realize in its fullness the beauty and truthfulness of the doctrine that the soil is the greatest asset, and the sons and daughters the greatest heritage of the race.

I referred a while ago to the objections to this legislation on the grounds that the principles embodied in it were in confiict with State rights, and the same objection is urged by those opposed to Federal aid for education. In answer to these objections I want to say that I stand as ready_ and as willing to defend my State against Federal invasion of her sovereign rights as does any man in this body. But I am unwilling to agree that Federal legislation which will improve local conditions in any State and bring prosperity and happiness to its people is an invasion of its sovereign rights. I was taught in my school days that in the science of government for every right there was a corresponding duty. And that principle applies with reference to the attitude of the Federal Government toward the States. The Federal Government in admitting the States to statehood reserved to itself the right to construct military roads, post roads, and routes of interstate commerce; and it is its duty to maintain these highways in such a way as will render them suitable and adequate for the purpose for which they were intended. And, on the other hand, it is the duty of each State to contribute its just proportion to the life and maintenance of the Federal Government, and with that duty there is the corresponding right of each State to demand of the Federal Government its just proportion of public improvements constructed by the Government. Has this been done in the past? I answer "No."

Those who believe that this Government is composed only of cities, seacoasts, and navigable streams, as was evidenced here in the passage of the last public-buildings bill, would differ with me on this question; and I shall digress for a moment to refer to what. occurred then. When the public-buildings bill was under discussion some of the gentlemen from the large cities, '"trith their magnificent Federal buildings that had cost millions of dollars from the public funds, threw up their hands in holy horror when it was proposed to construct post-office buildings in several of the small cities of the country; and others from the coast and navigable rivers, where almost countless millions of the Federal Treasury have been spent for the construction and maintenance of ports and harbors and the canalization of streams, contended most vociferously that it was a waste of public funds. But notwithstanding their protest the bill was passed, which was evidence that the spirit that had so long diverted the attention of Congress from the smaller cities, the villages, and rural sections was no longer in control. Mr. Chairman, I trust that I may not be misunderstood in my reference to the Federal improvements in t;he great cities, on the coasts, and in the navigable streams. The public business in the_ cities necessitated the construction of public buildings. Our coastwise trade with foreign nations and national safety against foreign invasion necessitated the construction of ports of entry and harbors of defense. Our interstate traffic necessitated the improvement of our navigable streams. And just as these interests demand Federal aid, so do our interstate relations between man and man, between city and countty, between societies of the different sections, demancl it, alike in proportion to their contributions to the Federal Goyernment. Why, Mr. Chairman, one who was not familiar with country life would almost be convinced by some of the gentlemen from the cities that the rural sections do not constitute a part of the Federal Govern-

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3089 ment and are not entitled to recognition by or aid from the Government. But let me remind them that the farmer in the field, the woodman in the forest, the teamster and rural carrier on the road, the merchant at the cross-roads store, and the village dweUer pay their taxes and contribute to the revenues of the Federal Government the same as the man in the city, on the coast, or the navigable strea;n, and bas the same rights as a citizen and is entitled to the same recognition by the Government.

Mr. Chairman, there is another phase of the subject which I wish to discuss priefly, and that is the benefits to be deriyed through this legislation aside from the money that it appropria tes, which is the knowledge of road building that it will diffuse among the people of the country. This will result in a revival of their interest in public roads; it will lead to a better knowledge of how and of what material to construct roads; it will bring them in sympathy with the good-roads m01ement; it will give the people of every section an opportunity to ascertain the difference between good and bad roads, which will ultimately result in the improvement of all the roads. In speaking of the difference between good and bad roads I do not speak from hearsay or draw on my imagination. I speak from actual knowledge, acquired from the district which I represent, which is composed of 19 counties, 8 of which are blue-grass counties with macadamized roads. The others are mountain counties, 1 of which has turnpikes and the other 10 have dirt roads. I have traveled e1ery section of that dist:.-ict and most of it time and time again by every character or kind of conveyance in use there, which has made me thoroughly familiar with the hardships and disadvantages attendant to bad roads and the advantages to be derived from good roads, and, being a farmer myself, I naturally paid particular attention to the work being carried on by the farmers, the prices of land, and the cost of transportation of farm products. I find that the land lying near the pikes in the blue-grass regions sells for from 25 to 50 per cent more than land of similar surface and equal fertility which lies inconyenient or inaccessible to the turnpikes, and in one mountain county that has pikes the land st::lls for twice and often three times as much as land of simila!· surface and equal fertility in other counties where the roads are dirt roads and in bad repair. I have seen the farmers haul their products to market on both the pikes and dirt roads. 0!! thJ average pike one team will haul from 1t to 2 tons of tobacco and make an average trip ot 20 miles and return in one ds.y. On the dirt roads one team will haul on an average rond from one-half to tbree-foul'ths of a ton of tobacco and make an average trip of 10 miles and return in one day. Therefore on this calculation, which is a fair one, it costs the man on the dirt roat1 four times what it costs the man on the pike to market his products, which is conclusive proof that the mud tax is the greatest, most excessive, and most burdensome tax that the farmer pays. So, in view of the fact that the life of the Nation is dependent upon the success of the farm, can any man in reason contend that it is not economical and that it is not profitable for the Government to expend money in the construction and maintenance of roads into and through the farming sections? The man who would make such contention is ignorant of the interest that even the city has, or should have, in the success of the farm.

1\fr. Chairman, there is another phase of the subject upon which I will touch if time will permit me, and that is the educational advantages deriYed through good roads. In one of the counties of my district where they ba1e macadamized roads leading to every adjoining county they have organized their several public schools into groups and merged each group into a central school. The children are conveyed to and from school in elegantly equipped wagons built for that purpose. These wagons are covered, which gives protection to the little ones from the scorchmg heat of the summer sun and the chilling blast of the winter's storm. This system insures the regular attendance of the children and their continuous interest in the school; and I am advised by the superintendent of public schools of that county that the system has proven a marvelous success from the standpoint of both interest in the schools and economy in the school funds. I attended an educational association in that county not long since, and the success of the system was evidenced by the presence of 3,000 bright school children of the county and a most magnificent display of live stock, agricultural products, fancy needlework, and artistic paintings and drawings, all of which was produced by the boys and girls of the school; a display of which any county or State fair might well be proud. And, Mr. Chairman, the basic principle upon which and through which this marvelous success was attained was good roads. That county has splendid roads, which enables the people to coosol\date theiT schools and bring their children

together in school capacity and educational conventions-an advantage that. the good people of several of the counties of my district and my State do not enjoy, for the reason that their roads are rugged and their streams are unbridged. But while my heart goes out to the hundreds, yea, the thousands, of bright boys and girls of my district and State who are so handicapped in attending school, especially through the winter season, because of the inadequate roads and unbridged streams over which many of them must travel, I am still optimistic on the subject. In the language of the immortal Adams, " Through tlie gloom of the present I see the brightness of the future." I hear in the not far distant future the voice of the Federal Government speaking, as it were, in tones of thunder, that these disadlantages, these barriers, shall be removed; that e\ery section of this Union of States shaH share equally with every other section at the hands of tile Government; that the farmer who feeds the Nation shall share the blessings to which he is justly entitled; and that his posterity shall have e1ery advantage necessary to prepare them for their future responsibilities. And when this shall come even those who oppose this bill will sing anew the glory of our Nation and the honor of its flag. [Applause.]

Mr. SHACKLEFORD. Mr. Chairman, I yield five minutes to the gentleman from Oklahoma [Mr. MuRRAY].

Mr. MURRAY of Oklahoma. 1\Ir. Chairman, in the discussion of tllis bill, known as the bill for Federal aid for roads, by Mr. SHACKLEFORD of Missouri, I might be pardoned in referring to my discussion of this question on the stump in my State in 1910, and which I repeat here. I then said:

"Good roads and bridges and facilities for ·~ravel; the transportation of vehicles, farm products, and passengers are more important to an advancing civilization than any other element of progress-laws in aid of the same are those in which every citizen in the State is interested and directly benefited. Good roads increase the motor power of the fan~1e1 's team, shorten his distance to market, increase the freight facilities, make possible rural free delivery and the parcel post, aid in education, and make easy the building of rural high schools; they build towns, cities, and marts of trade, increase the sales of the merchant, improve the condition of society, make more attractiYe the home, and exhilarate the march of civilization and human progress."

I have always declared that too much money could not be spent for public roads and for schools if honestly managed and economically applied, but it is unnecessary here to discuss the necessity for good roads. The question is, first, should the Federal Government enter upon this policy; and if so, what should that policy be? To these two questions I shall briefly address myself. To the first I answer that the demand is so tremendous for Federal aid that it is useless to resist this demand longer. It partakes of the nature of the contest prior to the Civil War over the policy of "internal improvements," which finaUy came, as appropriations for road legislation must inevitably follow. A.s to the constitutionality of such legislation, there can be no doubt under the Constitution of the United States of the power of the Federal Government to make roads for the following purposes :

First. Military roads for the transportation of troops nnd military supplies.

Second. In aid of interstate commerce. Third. To facilitate the transportation of the mails. Since we haYe built up throughout the country n very elab

orate system of railways and waterways, there is no need ot interstate roads-roads that run across one State into another State or crossing boundary lines of different States-unless it should be the policy of the Government to construct ronds either in competition with the railroads or to facilitate automobile travel; and, in my opinion, it should attempt neither, and I would oppose any legislation or appropriation for either of these purposes. And since the Government has the right to use the railroads for the transportation of troops and military supplies, there is no need of entering upon road building for military purposes.

This leaves only one other constituUonal power. and that is to construct post roads; and since post roads, for the lm·ge part, and especially rural free delivery routes, run from the town to the farm and from the farm back to town or the market, it would appear that it would be wholesome to exercise this constitutional power; and hence it answers the question as to the policy that should be pursued, and brings us directly to the issue of whether the House bill by Representative SH.ACKLEFORD, of Missouri, or Senate bill 3545, introduced by Senator OoBE, of Oklahoma, should be the policy. Or, to place the question in other language, whether Federal aid should be given to the State as an aid and encouragement, the fgnds given to be under the control of the State authorities, subject only to the

3090 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE~ FEBRUARY 6,

conditiOns of the law as provided in the Shackleford bill, or whether the Federal Government itself should enter into the policy of road builamg, having a great department of ro-ads i'n Washington and the con-struction maintained under the control of ille Federal Government through tfie Department o-f Agriculture, as provided by the Senate bill'. To this provision of the Senate bill I am opposed, whether the ttppronriatfon be small or large, because I am oppo-sed to the policy or the attempt of the Federal Government ta do anything which tlle States can do for- themselves, because Federal building of roads would ultimately mean interstnte "cross-the-country" roads, or ... peacock boulevards,<> whi~h wotrld be used for~ the most part !ar automobile' to·urists. I am not particrrfarly opiJoserl to automobiles, but wl'lile in that connection r am of the. ODirrfon th-at there should be pr-ovided regular automobile roa-ds just mae enough for an automobile, and take tliem off of tlie public highwny, so that they would not interfere. with travel by horses ana woufd not at the same time so quickly wear orrt tn:e ro-ads. It is demonstrated not only in the various States of the East but through t~ Department of Agncu!ture of the Federa.l Government that an automobile' will tear UIJ a macadamized road or a cement road a11li that no storre or other material is hard enangh to prevent mpict deterioration. under a beavy automobile traffic-; that about the only roa-d, according ta a: bulletin of the Department of Agriculture, that will stand the traffic- is a road mad'e whoTiy of oiJl, when the on is forced int& sand roads sufficient to nm.ke a compact. fie-x:il'>le surface, otherwise it ""in wear i:nto ruts and blow away with tli~ winds.

Let us a-nalyze· me difference' between the Senate hilT and the HouBe' bm. Under the Senate bill tliere is $1,000,000 appropriated, with a strong discretionary powet~ as to the use of the money in the hands of the Secretary of Agrfc~lture, and because of the· smallness of the amorurt it woufd be ~arc'e~y sufficient to bnUd one road' across n State, leaTI:ng tire ather portions ot the State to wait, irr some insblnce:s, 50 ye::trs: llefore they worrlcl get this Federar aid. r sa:v tills would follow by reason of· the very smallness of the appropria-tion, ru.1d that the advocates of thts policy; who defea-teu the, Shackleford bill after-- ft passed the House' fn the last" Congress, the author of the Senate bill I am now referring to voting against it; and we furtJ:'Ier know that th~ automobile eompanfes wfro mn.ke and place upon the market a:ntomebiies boast tfint the)~ defe::tted this bi-ll in the Senate~ rt seems= tllat" while the l\lembers of Congress understand the contest and1 tJie issues growing out of tfie defeat. o:t thnt bill in the last Congress that tile- country does not reaTize the issue. To make a more concrete iUustra:tion o:f these- two bi.Ifs permit me· to apply these two bills tts they would at!ect my State-Oklu.Iloma. Unae.r the Slla:cfdeford Dilf Okl'alioma would receive- one half of the total appropriation proportioned to the population that Oklahoma bears to the ot1'ler States; and tile other halt' apportioned to tile mail routes, which hasc been figured by the experts' of the> department to amouut tCY $572,506 for Oklahoma. 'l'llis sum t1ius R'pproprfated to Oklalloma to be divided among all tlle cuunties in tile State fir like> proportion, under the bil1, conditioned upon the Stai:e, cunnty, or road district putting up an equal amount, which worrl{t mean the expenditure in the whole State year after year- of. $1.,145,000, one-half of which is paid by the people of· Okiahoma, the other half by the Federal Government. This money could be used on a given post road to fill UIJ ffi:e bog holes or tem-· down the hills and lessen the grade, and then the foiiowfug year a like· sum would be used to continue, to improve the same road8, so that each and every year every con:nty in the State, as wonid ev·ery county in every other State, would receive its p-t•o ratn: share, ::tnd b.r a continuation of the policy for a period of 10 or-15 yea-rs all tlle roads would, by degrees, without bonds, for future generations and scarcely without being felt, become- fmpr(}Ted to· a to lerable condition. Whereas, under the S'enate bill before referred to, introduced by the Senator from Oklahoma, Oklahoma -would get $105,000, about, which would be- so infi-nitesimnlTy slilllll, even with an equnl amount by the State, that in the very n r.. ture- of the practical use it could not serve any beneficial purpose by prorating it among all the" countie , and in fact no provision is made therefor, and hence it would ha.ve to be applied on some' cross-the-State highways. Great project, indeed, but of little benefit to the people. It would be in the end nothing more than an automobile route.

'1"11e- real limitations of the Q()re bill are contained in tile first section by this provision:

Highway work may be inaugurated in each State through the. co.operation of the United States Department- of Agricrrltme- and the hfghway department of the several States. S"ueh cooperation shall embrace p~:actlcal demonstration in road construction and maintenanee upon highways to be S(!tectcd bJl the Secretary of Agriculture and the State highway department, and" all such work· shall be carried orr in such

manner as may be ngreed upon by· the Secretary of .Agriculttrre and the representative o!.. the! several State highw.a'Y departments.

It is easfly foretold in my State what will be-come ot this money. It would be fil'st used to- construct a: roadway a:cross the State· of Oklahoma from Kansas to Denjson, Tex. It is true this road would run tllrough my eounty, but what woUld become ?f' the ceunties east and west of it? No appropriation will be Just that does not take care of every county in the State.

Hence I plant my position upon tlie policy that the Government of the United ~tates o-ught not to enter into road bullding, but that an npiJroprmtion should be prorated among the Stutes una should J.l>e n~ed soiely upon the post roads so as to create roads· from tlie fa-rm to the market and from Ute market to tile ta;m. _ ~.fy convictfon of a wise governmental policy is that thls wrJr md the· merchant, the market or marts of trade and will aid the- f:Irmer, and that it links together both llie i~terest of tlle city· and the· rountry, so that neither· need feel that he fs unneeessarily burdened or taxed: either- by tl'le State or the Federal' Government for improvements that he does not recerre.

Tbe am~mnt. of thJs nppt'"opria1.fou seems· large~ it is true. but we ::rppl"O"priated· la~ year for t'he Nttvy Departm~nt $105,-214',94&.53. and to build battleships $35,525-,695'-this: does not include the \Var Department-and a:re now called npan to build a rail'road in Alaska that will amount to $40,000,000. This a·ppropriai:ion of $25,000,000· for the· whole United States under the Sb·rrckieford bf!T, tllat wilT be.appropriated· to alF the Stntes and to rul the counties of the States,. is ins-ignificant wfl'ell com._ pnredi wittl this for-war appropriation ..

To recapitulate: Firs~. I am opposed to the Government's attempt to: build " cross-the-country peacock boulevards," whieh can onTy De nse:d for a-utomobile trame, until we ha1e good road-s in e1ery county throughout the United States, whlcfi wi11 take man'Y, many yettrs to- aceomplish.

Seeono, I a-m opposed to exerdsfng the- constitutional power for bu'iJmng· road's for military purposes exeept witltin and around tlie mflif:t,ry posts.

Tlli'rd, I am opposed to the: G<Jvernmenf itself entering upon tlie policy of ro!:rd &niidingr but I am fn fttvor of an a-pp:roprfation to the States fn: afd of road brrr1'ding, &ut te be controTied by the States, lli~ States to. determine what materia:! to use in each section within the State, and that soch appropria:tion in ::tid of roads by the Federal Government shall be used exclU>sivefy unde· the one constitutional power to :t'ac:ilitafe the· carI·ying of mails, beca:ttSe the m:tils in every State are earriecl along the s:tme roads that th~ farmer, travel's to go to the mal"ket. Of all of the three constitutional poweL"s, this is- the only one tlml: ought to· be used· i'n this policy. Tllerefore I am rn favor of the Ho·nse bill by SHACKJ'..F.FORD, which passed the House· two years ago but wa:s defeated in the Senate, and ram opposed to the- Sena:te bill before refert·ed to.

1\fl.~. SHA.CKLEFORD. Mr. Chairman, I yield to the- gentle-. man from Missouri rMr . ..A..LE:YANDER].

lUx:. ALEXANDER. Mr. Chafrmnn, some of the speake-rs apparently do not take this bill seriuusly. At the' same time, I tllink they reganl the proposition pending before the committee a-s· one of the most important presented to Congress for consideration in many· years. This bill' pl'ovides· that the United States shall in certain eases aid tile States and certain subdivisions thereof in the care and maintenance of rural post roads, :md" is justified unuer· section 8, Article r, of the Constitution~ which provides that " Congress shall' have power to establish post offices and post roads.'" I have always entermined tlle opinion that · tile primury duty rested with the States and the eivil subdivisi-ons thereof to provide the fo-nds with wfiiclr to construct and maintain· prrblic roads. Many of the States in the Uniorr have, at large expense and' the imposition of local taxation, provided splendid systems of highways. In the S:tate ot Missouri much has been done along this line In years past. With the. establishment of rural tree deHvery greater ill'terest is taken than ever before in goon roads.

'1'1'le automobile is eoming into general use, and tile demand is beeoming more insistent e1ery day for good roads~ I represent one of the best agricultmal districts in the United States. I have an intelligent and progressive constituency. 'l'he:y appreciate the. need for better ro!lds and are making great efforts to secure same. I have. n.ot a town or city in my district of more tll.an 5',000 inhabitants. The population for the most part is a. rm·al population, and the provisions of this bill will apiJeal to tfiem strongTy. One of the soutliernmost counties of" my di. ~ ttict-Ciay lies just across the river from Kansas Citr. one of the b~st markets in the West for the products of the fn.rms of my district. St. Joseph, Mo., also is in easy rea:ch from all parts of the district. Then, lines of railroad traverse th-e district, ha ing- terminals in these thriving cities; hence the farmers of my district are deeply interested in the marntenanee of

1914 ... CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3091 good roads from the farms to the towns in the district and to the shipping points on these railroads, that they may have ready access to the markets. During the decade from 1900 to 1910 my district lost 25,000 in population. 1\Iany reasons have been assigned for this loss of population. I attribute it in part to what has been regarded by the rural population as the unattractiveness of farm life. The tendency has been for young men and young women to leave the farm and go to the cities. One of the principal factors, however, contributing to this result has been the very great increase in farm values and the disposition on the part of farmers having small tracts of land to take adYantage of the high price and dispose of their land and go farther West, in the hope that they might secure more and cheaper land for themselves and their families; but in many instances, as I have stated, it was on account o:t what was regarded as the unattractiveness of farm life. The fact that better school privileges might be enjoyed and better opportunities for self-culture has induced many ambitious young men and women to leave the farm; but with the coming of the telephone and the rural carrier service and the parcel post and the many conyeniences that our farmers now enjoy and with which they are surrounding themselves in the home, I ha're eYery reason to believe this condition will not continue, and I am quite sure that nothing will contribute more to the attracti>eness and charm of farm life than good roads and better schools. In my State at the session of the le!?islature in 1913 an act was passed providing that rural schools may be grouped, that we may have central high schools in the different townships instead of a great number of rural schools, as in the past. Provision may be made for the transportation of pupils to and from school, the expense of these schools to be maintained in part by the State and in part by local taxation.

As I have stated, the fact that the country schools have not been up to the sta:.. dard of the town an(;. city schools was on~ reason wlly the youth were leaving the farm. It is the wish of the farmer to give his children the best educational advantages, so they may lla ve an equal chance in the race of life. The steps taken in Missouri to reorganize and consolidate school districts for the purpose of maintaining elementary schools and lligh schools are wise, and should have the hearty support of the farmers. If we could only have roads, specifications for which are set out in classes A, B, and C of this bill, it will increase farm values. It will be of distinct value to the farms lying more remote from the towu, because they will be brought nearer the market. Much time will be saved to the farmer and much expense. The time when it may not be seasonable to work on the farm can be utilized in hauling the products of the farm to the market. There are months in the year now, particularly the months of March and April, when the roads in some localities are :mpassable. At the same time little can be done on the f arm and much time is lost to the farmer. If we can have good roads for the year round, then the farmer can utilize the roads at his con>enience and at such times as his labor can not be used profitably on the farm. Good roads will bring him not only nearer to tht! schools but nearer to the country church, as well as to the town. It will save much in the way of wear and tear on his equipment, and one team can render the service now required of two during many months of the year when the roads are bad. My hope is that with better rural schools and better roads added to our Rural Delivery Service and the parcel post and the many comforts and conveniences in the home with which our farmers are now surrounding themselves, this exodus from the farm will cease, and that at the end of the next decade the census will show a healthy increase :.n our rural population. The demand for farm products is becoming greater every year. Consumption has overtaken production, and already much of our food supply is being drawn from foreign markets. I have taken deep interest in scientific agriculture. I have spared no pains to bring to the farmers in my district the latest and best information in the way of farmers' bulletins, yearbooks, horse and cattle books issued by th~ Agriculture Department.

So far as tlle provisions of this bill are concerned I am inclined to agree with my colleague from Missouri, Judge RucKER, that the provision made in the bill for roads in class Cis too small. The bill provides that roads of class C shall embrace roads upon which no incline is steeper than is reasonably necessary in view of the natural topography of the locality, with adequate drainage and ample side ditches, with a roadway constructed so as to quickly shed water into the side ditclles and kept crowned and compacted by dragging or other adequate means, so that it shall be reasonably passable for wheeled vehicles. In other words, roads of class C are what we call dirt roads, while roads of class A are to be composed of macadam or- other material of equal utility and cost, constructed and maintained in such manner that it shall have a smooth, firm surface, and

roads o:t class B shall embrace roads composed of shells, gravel, or a proper combination of sand and clay or other material of equal utility but less expensive than macadam constructed and maintained in such manner that it shall have a smooth, firm surface. I will be glad before this debate closes i:t some member of the committee will explain why it is that $60 per mile may be expended on roads of class A and $30 per mile on roads of class B and only ·$15 per mile on roads of class C, or the dirt roads. There are portions of my district where rock is abundant and we may have macadam roads at a reasonable cost, but there are other portions of my district where the lands are rich and attractive and the rock for road construction is not available, and by reason of the depth of soil these roads are very bad in certain seasons of the year and will require a large expenditure ot money to properly construct and maintain them.

Mr. SHACKLEFORD. Is not that an answer as to why we should pay more for the macadam road than for the dirt roadto encourage the people to build the more expensive and useful road in those sections where you are annoyed by the mud. While a dil~t road must answer in many places, in the richE::st land the gentleman speaks of the people have wealth and disposition enough to step from the dirt road to the higher class of road.

Mr. ALEXANDER. It is no lack of interest on the part of the farmer that he will not have the best class of road. They want the best kind of road, and they would undoubtedly prefer the macadam road, but in many sections the rock is not available, unless hauled great distances and at great cost.

Mr. Chairman, it is not my purpose to speak at length with reference to the provisions of this bill. The bill has my hearty approval. While the aggregate sum, $25,000,000, is large, yet when it is distributed to the several States the amount that may be used per mile in the construction and maintenance of roads is very inconsiderable. The duty will still rest with the States and the subdivisions of the States to provide by far the greater part of the funds with which to construct public roads. I believe the passage of this bill will stimulate greater fnterest in good roads and that for every dollar appropriated by this bill to be expended for good roads many dollars will be raised by taxation and by voluntary contributions in the different States for good-road purposes. The farmers are not the only ones to be benefited by the improvement of our rural post roads. The people in our cities and towns and villages will share equally with them in benefits that may accrue from good roads. I am a firm believer in good roads. Years ago, as a member of the General Assembly of Missouri, I ga-ve a large part of my time to public-highway legislation. I wish to congratulate my colleague from Missouri, Judge SHACKLEFORD, upon his indefatigable labor in promoting this legislation. I shall heartily support the bill.

Mr. PROUTY. Mr. Chairman, I yield to the gentleman from Pennsylvania [Mr. SHREVE].

Mr. SHREVE. Mr. Chairman, I desire to giv") my unqualified indorsement to the bill now pending before the House. It has already received practically the unanimous approval of the Committee on Roads, of which I have the honor to be a member.

The entire country is deeply interested in this legislation. This bill not only provides for the construction and maintenance of macadam, concrete, and brick roads, but also includes the dirt road, the road after all that is most used. Under this bill it will be possible for the National Government to aid in the construction and maintenance of the dirt road which enables the farmer to deliver his products to the railway station or market town-roads that lead everywhere, over whicl: are transported the products of the Nation.

Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. Would it be agreeable to the gentleman to yield there?

Mr. SHREVE. Yes. .Mr. GARRETT of Tennessee. How does thin bill provide for

aid in construction or maintenance of any of those roads? It provides it shall be paid after the roads have been constructed ..

Mr. SHREVE. Section 3 covers it. I firmly believe that Government assistance, as far as prac

ticable, should be extended to the many rather than the few; by that I mean that assistance sllouJd be rendered to the int~ rior and remote parts of the country where the travel is sufficient to warrant. Such a system of assistance once established, soon the roads that are more extensively traveled will naturally receive assistance according to their needs and requirements.

As the dirt roads are improved each year and the communities thro~h which they pass are developed the main thorough'fares will be converted into macadam or other form of roads under the bill designated as class A roads. There will be a rapid transition from one class to another.

.3092 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. FEBRUARY 6,

If we properly connect the farm with the town, the town with the city, we wm add materially to the successful progress of our people, bringing denied privileges to the many toilers and tillers of the soil. We can thus elevate the noble calling of agriculture by attracting many city dwellers back to the soil, and by placing the producer in close relation to the consumer we will materially reduce the high cost of living.

Under this bill the National Government and various States will be able to work out a general coordinate system of highways extending through the length and breadth of our land ..

The Secretary of Agriculture, on behalf of the United States, may aid the States and the subdivisions thereof in the construction and maintenance of rural roads in an amount not exceeding $25,000,000 in any fiscal year; and the portion thereof which may be expended in any State in any fiscal year being determined upon the basis of one-half in the proportion which the total population of such State bears to the total population of all of the States, as shown by the next preceding Federal census; and one-half in the proportion which the total number of miles of rural post reads in use in such State bears to the total number of miles of rural post roads in use in all of the States is fair and reasonable.

The bill provides ample elasticity to meet the wants of any State, whether in construction of macadam or other high-grade t·oad or the ordinary dirt road provided for in Class B of section 4 of the bill. It also safeguards the Federal funds, and under section 3 requires that-

The Secreta-ry o:t Agriculture and the officer or officers o:t each State having lawful power to act for the Sta,te and jointly consider and determine the roads in such State which, under the provisions ot this section, may be constructed :md maintn.ined during the next fiscal year, and the material, chnracter, and manner o:t such construction and maintenance; that such construction and maintenance shall be conducted under such supervision as shall have been previously agreed upon by the Secretary of Agriculture and said officer or officers ol said State; that i.n no case shall the United States bear more than onehalf of the cost o:t the construction o:t any road under the provisions o:t this section ; that the Secretary o:t Agriculture shall not commence such joint <'Onstruction of any road in any State until the portion of the cost thereof which is to be provided otherwise than by the United States bas been made available.

Mr. MOORE. Will my colleague yield? Mr. SHREVE. Certainly. Mr. MOORE. Does the gentleman think these sums ot $60,

$30, and $15 per mile, respectively, will be of material benefit in the construction of these roads? · 1\fr. SHREVE. It will be a material benefit in the maintenance of the roads and will tend to encourage the building of a better class of roads.

Under this bill three different classes of highways are recognized which will cover the requirements of every community. Under its operation it will be possible to open the great highways of comm.erce so they will reach out to the farm. Never before has the demand for farm labor been so great and the requirements of farmers so pronounced as now. Let us begin to increase our supply of wealth at its source. Good roads wm equalize the disproportion that now exists between the producer and the consumer. Increasing the city population on the one hand and decreasing farm population on the other has brought about a condition which demands our consideration.

The establishment of parcel post has created a new condition of affairs. The rural mail carrier now has to provide himself .with a different equipment for handling the mail, the capital invested in horses, wagons, harness, and so forth, and the expenses of the upkeep are considerable. The Government is asking greater efficiency and more strenuous effort without material advance in pay. It therefore seems opportune that the Government should inaugurate a great and just policy of Federal aid in the construction and maintenance of post roads. The farmer and rural mail carrier are not the only persons interested in good roads. It is a problem that is demanding the attention of all our people. !l'be producer, the consumer are alike interested. It is not a political proposition, but appeals to nil who desire to see all sections of our great country develop. It is a great problem and should be solved in the interest of the whole people.

Good roads from every railroad town to every country home will soon solve the problem of the high cost of living and permit many city toilers to enjoy the fresh air and sunshine which the great Creator of the Universe intended we should all share.

They will improve the social and econorrJc welfare of our people and mark an epoch in our educational and intellectual advancement.

The guidepost pointing to the land of greatest opportunity will be ttu"Led toward the centers of rural life. · Farm va!ues will be increased -and the cost of transportation reduc&l. '£he business man in the city can enjoy the beauties of the country and the farmer come in closer touch with the every-day acti-vities of life.

The State which I have the honor in part to represent has established a highway department and under the estimates included in the report on the bill will receive over $1,600,000. I sincerely hope the bill will become a law. [Applause.]

I\fr. PROUTY. Mr. Chairman, I yield to the gentleman from Ohio [.Mr. FEss]. [Applause.]

Mr. FESS. Mr. Chairman, I am in favor of Federal road building, and I can state briefly why I take this position. First I believe it is a proper function of the Federal Government t~ better the road conditions of the country, or at least to assist in bettering them. In the second place, I believe that the initiation of this sort of a proposition will stimulate better road building on the part of the State. Over in my State Ohio, we have been trying to work out a system of road build: 1

ing, and I am sure that what the Federal Government is about to do will be a great stimulus to our State to go on and further its plans. In the third place, I believe that when we stimulate road building on the part of the Federal Government, associ!lted with the same kind of work on the part of the State government, we will also stimulate private efforts that will build great highways ultimately, such as are being proposed in some sections of the country now.

In the fourth place, I think our greatest problem just now is to find a better material out of which to build roads. Really, I think it is the most serious problem we have; and, when we start the Government to doing this, there is not a doubt but it will find better material out of which to build the roads and ultimately we will have a better system by far than we would have if our Government did not stimulate an interest in it.

And, fifth, as the gentleman from Missouri [Mr. ALExANDER] said, I think that the great movement of the country to-day is the centralization of schools-not to build the centralized school in the little village, but to build it outside of the village-in the country-and establish what in many States we are establishing, the township high school, which is one of the great movements of the country. [Applause.]

Therefore I am strongly in favor of F~eral aid in the building of roads, because it will stimulate State enterprise and, at the same time, it will stimulate individual entet·prise and, at the same time, discover the better material out of which to build roads and to insure a great deal better condition for our rural communities in every way. And for that reason I believe it a legitimate function of our Government, as our past history shows it to be. [Applause.]

Mr. Chairman, better methods of transportation, whether by water, rail, or pike, have always appealed to our country as a rational function of government.

From the very beginning routes of trade were interesting topics with our makers of history. Canal building was one of the chief concerns of Gen. Washington, whose writings are filled with allusions to inspection trips looking to canal building to unite the East with what was then the unknown West.

Perhaps the most significant recommendation upon the subject was made by Gen. Washington at the meeting at Alexandria looking to the building of a. canal from the headwaters of the Potomac to the headwaters of the Monongahela. It was this suggestion that led to the famous Annapolis meeting in 1786, the precursor of the more famous Federal convention of 1787. .

This idea of internal improvements took such deep hold upon the early leaders that it almost became a campaign slogan in some cases. Jefferson, a stickler for strict construction when out of office, became the first builder of the famous Cumberland Road when be came into office. The work was furthered by another strict constructionist-Monroe.

At this time, under Monroe, the proposal to build the Erie Canal-nicknamed "Clinton's Big Ditch," because of the interest of the governor of the Empire State-became an acute issue. Here the matter of ''internal improvements" on a national issue became prominent. The strict construction statesmen succeeded in defeating the proposal to the Government by the New York commissioners to undertake the building of the canal. The old issue between local and Federal construction was bitterly fought out. The same contention is frequently made in river and harbor improvements. In most of these contentions the issue resulted in the triumph of national improvements.

So it will be with this movement for better roads. In none of these previous enterprises were the country folk to be so much benefited as is proposed in this bill. Great highways, by water or rail or national road, are beneficial in a large sense; but a system of good roads that looks to the modernizing of the counh·y sections, so much in need of better thoroughfares, will redound to the welfare of the producer in the rural communities, a people too apt to be overlooked by the legislator.

<'

1914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3093 · ·1 the editor of the Better Roads Magazine, there is evidently somet'hing This bill, although not Ideal, attempts to rec?nc1 e any ~os- the matter with our system of road construction or with the enforce-

Bible conflict between Nation and State by makmg road build- ment of the laws to protect the roads after we ha-ve made them. inoo mutualiy beneficial by requiring cooperation between Na- · You remembe! that two or three year.s ago we had cons-t:ructed oM

• b • r of the finest pieces of macadam road m the State of Ohio bt;tween tional and State md. . . . . . Xenia and Jamestown, and yet within a ·smgl~ year much of :~.t was

It is also written w1th a view of not only g1vmg to each de- allowed .to be cut up by unlawfully heavy hauling, so that right away sired authority butitTesnects the ))robable character of the road extensive repa1r.s bad to be made. . ti d th t G

'

4

t · ~, f d b ild' m· the locality As to the matter of .road construction, we no ce a our oes determined upon by the ma er1c.u or ro~ u mg correspondent a few days since made a just criticism of a matteL' of the construction by providing .for three classes of .r.oads .and that has long been a grievous blunder in this respect. He alluded the ratio of aid by Federal authority to each class. I am in to the loose manner allowed in cases w}lere pers~ms are permitted ~o

· lildi b •t · fun tion f work out their road tax under townsh1p superVIsion. He says that faT"or of Fooeral rud t? road bt ng . eca.use I IS a c 0 so-called gravel is put upon the ~oa.ds whkh is _often on~-half or three-the Government to asSist the rural sections of the country, where I'ourths -sand, which has no reslStrng or wearmg quallty; that such without such assistance improvements would be lacking-to the material is only a nuisance in either very dry or real wet weather,

· · · · ~ t st 11 t th when dust or mud is the result-the dust for those who have to for-perpetual hurt of the commuruties ~ m ere as we .as 0 e low the automobiles in summer, the mud fo1· all who have to travel Nation at large. In our country to Improve a .part will benefit In wet weather. th .1-.ol We suppose it is the duty of t'he road supervisors to see that good

e W..u e. . . · · · k · 1 materiaJ only is used, but we all know that this duty is not always I am in favor o:f this proposed rud because It lS m e~mg . well performed and that teamsters working out road tax are allowed

with our national policy throughout the .past. M-ost certainly 1 -sometimes to pot in the time in a . way that is of little or no advantage a believer in Hamiltonian policies would favor it, and it is a to the road. This shows that there ~s a s.crew loose somewhere in our source of comfort to see how this Democr~c House, followers ro~~~frnBirhit in a general way, it is the duty of the count~ co~of Jefferson can so easily adopt the political theoxy of Mr. misSioners to 'have an {)Versight of the roads, but their manifold duties fHrunilton w'hich is done not only here but in the case of rail- .are such that they can not possibly see that every road supervisor tn road bunthng in Alaska, as well as in the currency legislation of ~~f? wi~~; t~ g~~~~d~~isdu~s?~;;ourp~~~~~~{y ~:Jrc~~C:Sa.i the special session. I superintendent.

I am in favor of this proposed legislation bec!iu~e lt .goes upon , When the National Government sets out upon a campaign oil the basis that our country rests upon the prmci_ple that each 1 better road building, which is e-vident will continue for some must be for all and all for each. To improve a part of the years, new interest will set the expert t~ work in his la~oratory country benefits the ·whole country, and should a,ppeal to the tor the disco-very of a material that will be proof agamst the old as well as the new State, the rich as well as the po~r State, ravages of the automobile. There is no doubt that such a matethe well-improved as well as unimproved, ~e Sta~es W.l~ good · rial will be found and at such price as to be usable. roads as well as those with bad roads. In thiS, ~ m all life, the rt will also stimulate authorities to regulate the use of the strong must help the weak, the rich must be willmg to llelp the roads not only the speed of the motorist but also the weight of poor, however this bill attempt an equitable benefit based upon the ~affi.e man. Mr. Chairman, for these and other reasons I population and road mileage of postal roads. . shall vote ·for this bill.

I am for fhis 'bill because Federal initiative in this matter M:r. SHACKLEFORD. Mr. -chairman, I yield to the geutle-.will prove a wonderful stimulus to all the State, both those in man from California [Mr. OH'lJBCH]. [Applause.] the vanguard of road improvement, as well .as those laggard on . . the subject. In Ohio road building has become a slogan before [Mr. CHURCH addressed the (!Omnnttee. See AppendiX.] our people. We are on the way to have in the near future one of Mr. PROUTY. Mr. Chairman, I yield to my colleague {Mr. the best systems of roads in aU the States. This Federal move- ScoTT]. ment will give my own State a millio~ and a quarter of dollars The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman 'from Iowa [Mr. ScoTT) annually to complete our system. Who can estlmate tlill results 1s .recognized. _ of such ~;timn1us upon the State·? Mr. SCOTT. Mr. Chairman. I feel that all the people of this

This dual .stimulus of Nation .and State will have a cumulative country ought to be greatly felicitated upon the "fact that their effect upon individual .and organized effort for great highways. Representati-ves are ·gathered here engaged in framing a measure It is certainly true that we may Jook to the time when our coun- so greatly calculated to tnrtber their welfare. try will be as prominent in !oad building for ~ll .the country as I 'believe that all the ~ople ,of ~ co~ntry would be ~ .. MYas the famous Roman period of highway building. pressed with a deep feeling of gratitude it they knew therr

I am in favor of this beginning as proposed in this bill because Representatives were here, staying until near1y midnight, to proof the general effect it will have upon our people .as a whole. It mote this great measure. .And, if I mistake not, before the year ,will make farm life much more desirable. ~twill tend :to keep upon which we ha-ve just entered draws to a close a great 1Upon the farm those who would prefer the farm to the city it an many ~f the eonstituents of the gentlemen who are here t(}oo easy way of reaching the city were possible. It makes possible night will hear :of it, .and, of course, I hope they will. [APthe success of the rural mail with less efforts to the Go-vernment plause.] and greater convenience to the farmer. It renders the farm the This is an important measure, in my opinion, not merely be-

, ·choice place of residence, because it gives him the advantage of cause it is calculated to benefit the farmer, but because it is ' access to the town without suffering the disadvantage of resi- calculated to benefit the country .as a whole. In one respect &nee in t.he town. . in particular it is calculated to benefit the farmer, because it

It makes possible the success of the modern movement of cen- is ealculated to equip the farms of this country. There was tralizing our country schools by enabling a township to erect at a time that we nsed to think that it took only 160 acres to a convenient point a modern high school, w?-ere all the advan- make a good 'farm; but we ha-ve come to the conclusion that tages of a modern city school can be had with none of the dis- it takes a good deal more than that, Mr.. Chairman. It takes tracting elements so deleterious to habits of study such as are not only 160 acres, well equipped and well improved, to make a lnevit::Ible in all the towns. good farm, but it takes good roads ; good roads to the local

From the standpoints of social and economical as well as station· good railroads and good railroad facilities to the homely virtues this is a movement in the right direction. I greater' markets; good facilities to carry the products of the am in favor of the bill for another very important reason, and farm to the ultimate consumer. :r wish we might be able to take steps at onco to make sure of Not only do these things help the farmers and those who re.this result. This bill, or any Federal movement to const~ct side in rural communities, but they give stability to the whole good roads, will stimulate our experts in the. sc~ence of materml country. w ·e live in a country where the stability ?f the to discover the proper material for road b~di,?g that will not farming community, the stability of the great rural sections of so easily wear out. On the o~er han~, 1t will tend to more the country, is the ·foundation of the whole fabric. Whenever :effectively execute the regulations agamst the abuse of the those who live in the agricultural sections are unprosperous roads when once built. In the mat!-er of material ~t is notorious the whole country is unprosperous. Whenever they meet adthat we have not yet found what IS necessary to msure a good versity that ad-versity is deflected not only to their local towns 'road after it is built. In my own district we ha-ve strips of but to' every city of the land. It should be one of the :first road which were built as types of good roads. One stre~ch of considerations of the Congress of the United States to legislate 12 miles, from Xenia to Jamestown-:-the latter place Is the not only upon this but upon every great question and policy residence of Hon. Jesse Taylor, ~e editor of Better Roads and in such a way as to fo~ter, conserve, and build up the agriculan expert on the subject-was built as a mo~el road. I append tural sections of the country. We should not overlook the fact a portion of an editorial taken from the Xema Gazette, a. state- that when we build and conserve and protect those interests we ment that can be applied to almost any road, even though 1t was are conserving and protecting the interests of every citizen built as a model piece of road construction. within the length and breadth of the land. No man or woman

In one of the very best agricultural and stock-raising .counties in can be prosperous in this country when the farm~rs and th:ose the glorious State of Ohio, where a large amount of ID;oney is i!pent intimately connected with the products of the farm are not annually for road making and for road improvement, m the county .where lives one 9! the foremost advocates for good roads. .who ~ prosperous. ,[Applause.!

3094 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. · ~· FEBRUARY 6,

1\Ir. PROUTY. 1\Ir. Chairman, I yield to the gentleman from Nebraska (1\Ir. LOBECK).

The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman from Nebraska [Mr. LoDECK] is recognized.

l\lr. LOBECK. Mr. Chairman, I wish to thank the · gentleman from Iowa [Mr. PROUTY] for giving me the opportunity · to make a few remarks on the good-roads bill now before the Honse.

I did not intend to speak on this subject this evening, but with the great interest I have in good roads I tl1erefore feel constrained to do so, and I am pleased to see that the Members present are interested in having good roads constructed throughout the land. I shall favor the bill because it is a step in the right direction. [Applause.] I have had personal experience with the roads in the Sta.tes of Iowa and Nebraska.

I formerly lived in the district which the gentleman from Iowa [Mr. PROUTY] so ably represents. My first experience was along the Government military roads on both sides of the Des Moines River. These were the only roads we had that were good in the early days. Later, when the country was surveyed, settlers fenced their lands and the section lines were followed. It seemed that we struck every mudhole and every slough in that district. Therefore improvements on the :roads were necessary.

Tlle early settlers did as well as could be expected in the pioneer days of improving the roads, and they have been constantly improving the roads since in Iowa and Nebraska, and at the present time the roadways compare favorably with any of the middle Western States.

But we are in better shape to improve the roads than we have been heretofore in the country's history. We have now improved road machinery, graders, crushers, mixers, rollers-for great improvements have been made in road-building machinery in the last 10 or 20 years. Quite different from our fore· fathers, who only had the pick and shovel and a strong back to do the arduous work of road building in their time.

We are also living in a "cement age," which has helped so materially to make good roads. for cement culverts and bridges are taking the place of wood culverts and bridges which rapidly wear arid wash out. We know more in this twentieth century about road construction, and understand the value of proper drainage. ·

Iu our State of Nebraska we have an inheritance tax that is applied for the benefit of good roads, and the sums so derived arc used for the construction and building of country roads.

Mr. 1\IURR.AY of Oklahoma. 1\Ir. Chairman, will the gentle-man yield?

The CHAIRMAN. Does the gentleman from Nebraska yield? Mr. LOBECK. Yes; with pleasure. Mr. MURRAY of Oklahoma. I heard the gentleman say

something a bout rnudholes. I want to ask him if those mudholes came by reason of irrigation in Nebraska. [Laughter.]

Mr. LOBECK. I will tell the gentleman what is his trouble. The gentleman has probably only lived in one State; therefore his question is pardonable. I am cosmopolitan and have lived in three States and ha \e had experience with mud roads.

.Mr. MURRAY of Oklahom-a. I know there are some places in Oklahoma and in Kansas, together with Texas and Nebraska, where tlley would give a great deal for a mndhole. [Laughter.]

Ir. LOBECK. Well, I understand the gentleman represents that kind of a district. [Renewed laughter.]

Before the gentleman from Oklahoma [Mr. MURRAY] interrupted me, I was speaking of what we have in our own State.

We have an inheritance tax that goes to the benefit of public roads in the country districts. In my district we have as good roads to-day as there are in any district anywhere, and .it is \ery profitable in that it helps the farmer and gardeners in bringing their produce to market.

We lt~ve constructed macadam roads and brick roads, and we find that a brick road is much more durable, and my opinion is that a brick-paved roadway is cheaper in the end than macadam and needs yery little repair. We have some brickpa\ed roads that have been used for over 20 years and the repair cost is nominal, but the macadam constantly needs repairing.

Mr. COX. How much do your macadam roads cost you per mi;e:

.:\Jr. LOBECK. I do not know exactly, but will endeavor to get tile :fignres for the RECORD.

JUr. COX. What do the brick roads cost? 1\Ir. LOBECK. The first cost is considerably more than

macadam. [Laughter.] Mr COX. I was asking the gentleman for information.

Mr. LOBECK. I will be glad to put the figures in the RECORD. But a good brick road will stand lleavy travel witll very little wear for a lifetime.

The total nnmbet• of miles of paved roads in Douglas County, Nebr., is 44.06, subdivided as follows:

Length. Width. Cost. ,.

}.facadam .••................•.••.• Brick ......................•...... Colorado sandstone .............. . Concrete ..•...........•.•.•.......

Miles. 36.92 2.61 2.36 2.17

Tot.al....................... · 44. 06

Ftet. 16 Sl (l,OOO to $12,000 n~r mile. 16 ~2.~LI per square yard. 16 Not available. 16 $12,000 per mile.

The total amount of inheritance taxes collected since the enactment of the law amounts to $411,404.82, and expended on country roads in my county.

We hear much talk about the good roads in foreign countries. For the length of time this country has been developing the people of the United States have done \ery well, and our people should not be criticized. We have been busy developing the resources of a new country, and good roads will follow.

The Europeans built great military roads and had to haYe them to move their armies, and they have been centuries in building them.

We have a new country freighted with possibilities beyond our comprehension. In the older settlements and St~tes there are better roads than in the new West, but the Western States are coming rapidly to the front in good-road construction, and this appropriation will be helpful.

The people of to-day have a better knowledge of the construction of roads, culverts, and bridges, knowledge of soils, drainage, and paving.

There is a uni>ersal demand by the people for better ronds, so that the products of agriculture can be brought to the consumer rapidly and at less cost to the producer. And there is no more opportune time for Congress to assist by appropriation of funds in good substantial road building than at this moment. I favor the bill and shall vote for it. [Applause.]

Mr. PROUTY. Mr. Chairman, I yield to the gentleman from Oregon [Mr. LAFFEBTY].

Mr. LAFFERTY. Mr. Chairman, it would be very difficult to enumerate all the benefits of good roads. They are so manifold and so well known that it is only necessary to call attention to the fact that good roads are one of the greatest adYantnges to any nation, and then I can pass on to other subjects relating to the bill.

This question of appropriating $25,000,000 a year out of the Federal Treasury for the uplift of rural communities is merely a matter that reduces itself down to the question whether it is good or bad business judgment. '.rhis is not taking money fro!D any foreign people and giving it to another people. It is simply spending the money of all our people for the benefit of all of our people-that is, if we spend it wisely.

I happen to represent at this time a city district, the city of Portland, having 260,000 population. When I cast my vote upon this bill I believe I shall cast it in accordance with the wishes of nine-tenths of the voters of my district, and I shall cast my vote in favor of this appropriation. [Applause.]

The people of the United States contribute this money that we are going to spend. The farmers conh·ibnte their share when they buy sugar, when they buy tobacco, when they buy any article that pays either an internal-revenue tax or an external customs duty. Those who pay income taxes will help to contribute to the Federal Treasury. Some of those live in the country and some in the cities. But the building of good roads is of such benefit to the Nation as a whole, both to the producer and the consumer, that it would be difficult to tell whether it would be the producer or the consumer, the farmer or tlle city dweller, who will get the greater benefit out of the passage of this measure. The lligh cost of living will undoubtedly be redu\!ed by tlle building of good roadB, by tlle encouragement of men and women to remain in the rural dis· tricts, to remain on the farms, by reducing the cost of transporting farm products to the city home, by extending our parcel post, by extending rural free deliYery.

No doubt it seems strange to many of us here to-night that this question has been delayed so long. I wish especial\y to congratulate tl1e gentleman from Missouri [Mr. SHACKLEFORD] for his untiring efforts in bringing this bill before the American House of Representati>es. [Applause.] It bas been difficult to bring it to final determination and a final vote, because of its

[914. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-ROUSE ..

no1elty. The .American .people, who come fllom English, -scotch, •German, and other Enropeun stock, are naturally conservative. .For that reason they .have been slow to start in ithis great work, but now the time is coming. [Applause.] '

The CHAIRMAN. The time of the gentleman ..has :expired. Mr. SHACKLEFORD. I yield to the gentlem:an 'from Missis

sippi [lli• . .HARRIS<h~]. l\Ir. HABRISO:N. Mr. Chairman, I ~m in heaxty sympathy

rwith the provJsions of this bill. I know of .no appropriation that we can .ma.k:e that ·wlll 'bring

.greater benefit to all ·the peqpl~ o:f this country .than ±his appropriation for ogood roads.

The degree ·of development .of every ·country <has rdepended ·on the progreEs of transportation -facilities.

It would be highly .foolish for any person -to pronuc:e ·-or manufacture a surplus of anything if he -were cut off from -:a means rof conveying his products to the maxket. Ann just as convenient and perfect as are his .means ·<If tta:nsporti:ng .his products -to "the market 'Will :his J)r.Ofits depend.

Good roads to ·the ·fai.:Iller ·who mnst ..caxry the proancts of his ln.bor to the ..rail1:oad ·station ·wfll.:mean a sa-ring io him 1n ·ma:ny

"WUy.s. He can convey heavier loads at 1ess exwense; i:he Jack of -sh·ain .on the ·part of his Etock will insnr.e .them a .J.onger Jife, .the vehicles less wear; .and the time .for '1lln.king 'tbe trip :materially 1decreased.

.In n.tb:er worCls, Mr. Chatrmnn, ·e-very element .that enters into good :roads reflects itself.m "W irrcrea.secl profit and !benefit to the

:farmer. If it he1ps the fUTmer, then certainly it wm help· the merchant

nnil cunsumer in the .city, because it will not only enable liim -to get his products more quickly .from ·the farm, but ne •will be '}>ermitted to ·share in the refiueed expense of transportation.

The progress of a section depends on the ·prosperity of the farmer, and the roads of any community are the best index to the character 'Of its people.

There is a wrong -imrn:essien, in m_y opinion, amon-g some of the Members he:re-that ·the-people' in the ctties are not favorab1e to thi.s legislntiun, and that it is solely in the interest of the country ~olks. Do "llot be deceived. 'The people in ·the towns and cttie:s .are in sympathy -with ·"the _good-roads .movement and believe ·in good .roads as.much as ille ,peop1e in the country. 'I know in thei:owns of IllY district -.thel"e is -a wonderful ·sentiment for good roads. I .receive .from :their l!ommercial 'bo.dies ..Inn:I\Y Tequests for ttata, ·and "they a-re constantlY requesting experts ·to be sent i:here :to ·construct ·experimental go·od roads 'in order .to stimulate sentiment .and educate "fire ,people in this movement.

·Mr. 'FERRIS. ·wm the gentleman yield for a question? Mr. HARRISON. 'Yes. 1\Ir. FERRIS. I wunt to inquire df -the gentlemun what he

thinks about the desirability of a road bill along' ·the lines of the bill before us or ·one of these ·schemes or an international highway clear a-cross the country?

Mr. 'HARRISON. I am not in favnr .of an .international hlghway across tbe country. [ApPlause.]

'1\fr. FER'IUS. I um glad to hear .the .gentleman ..say that, because that is an nutomobile game and this is the ·people's game.

J\1r. :HARRISON. I believ.e that the ..best way to encourage the peOJ)le of each loca1ity to have good roaas is 'by aiding them, even with as small a:moimt as thi.s bill .carries, for U iB Jn that way we will have good roads in the various communities of this country. ~lr. RUCKER. Will the gentleman yield? Mr . .HA.RRISON. I yield. .Mr. B-UCKER. In the 1ine of the n:rgumerrt the ,gentleman

has just made, he speaks of the -s:entiment in 1the tow.ns in .his district in .behalf of good roads. .I -suggest to .the gentlBman that I believe it .is almost universally true .nowadays, in the smaller towns particulm·ly, that the commercial hollies tax ,fuemseJ.ves by voluntary contributions to go out and improve their roads, all around the inland town.s. I say that as .a suggestion .in support of the gentleman's argument.

Mr . .HARRISON. I think -that is true, and they are doing a wonderful service .for the people.

l\1r. Chairman, I can not understand why the Federal Government should not appropriate money to be expended in ·maintain-, ing tile post.al roads in thi.s country. The Government uses --them ; -have the constitutional authority 'for it; and it certainly brings a great benefit to a large number of people.

1\:Ir. MOORE. Will the gentleman yield? : l\Ir. HARRISON. .I wlll. 1

Mr. MOORE. Considering the large amounts o'f money ·ap--propriated in l:rrrge cities for ~the improvements of· highways ·nnd ...such sums :as -n.re appropriated in the ;small communities, does1

the gentleman .think .that ·$60 ·and -$30 and .$15 will .be of an:y great benefit to the rural ·community?

1\Ir. HARRISON. I rthink it will .be of some benefit, ·anil it certainly will 'be an incentive and an -encouragement to tim people to uo .mare in ·the .futw:e than they have ·in the :past. I do not know that it .has ~ver come to me so 'forcibly-the desirability of hav.ing good roads--as it did six weeks ago, when the .President of the United States spent his vacation at Pass Christian. We thought that along the coast of MissisBip_pi for twenty-odd miles we had the best ~shell .road in the eou:nb:y. 1 ~o painted it to the President. But when we drav.e over it. the first day after he arrived there it seemed to me that -eve1;.y

.slight depression in it was a gull_y :and :every pool of water was ,a Jake, and for the first ·time .it .dawn-ed upon the ·peaple .of that locality that it was not a really geod road. Tlte P.r:esident~s visit aroused ·the _people and started a movement for better .roads, and now all the towns on the Mississippi coast .are cooperating together. Only the other day :I received .a letter from them to have the Public Raads De_partment 'Send them certain data on ·tb,e JSUbject and putting in -a requisition for e~er.ts to be sent !there. mhat wa-s the ·sentiment created by that one 1ncident in ·my di:strict, and I beli-eve it is ·strong ~ll ov.er the State of Mississippi.

I stated Jn .the beginning that Ithe progress of any locality, section, or country dep-ends ·on transportation iacilities, !Whether it be water, railw_ay, or road tra:nspo:utation . -B~lim!:jng, therefore, in eheap -wa-ter transportation and in

good-road building, I am always glad .to nse .my ~ver-y -effort in assisting in _passing ·srrch legislation. .I ·want to say, .Mr. rQhairm.an, jn this e.onnecti.on, that -there Js one .other transportation facility that .has :been the forerunner of dovelQ}lDl.ent in -every age-railroads.

Jt is on that theory-.:.beeause I .have not 'hatl .and shall not have an opportunity of expressing m3!'s.elf ·dn the discussion 'in the House-that I desire to .say ;that .I expect to vote •for tile Ala'skan Ta:ilroad tbill. JApplause.] !I hav.e .listened attentively to the vezy elaborate discussion '011 -that .subject, lllld ~.at ·first I wa:s inclined -to _appose Jts passage, lrot the arguments in favar of it .and the -reasons ·ass.ignea in its behalf ha:v:e heen so .eonovincing that [ am now ·most .hearlily .in :favor of .its passage. Alaska belongs to the United States. We are in duty bound ·either to .lease the natural "Tesources :there ar develop :them. It is .nat :denied "that 'the undev.eloped .Tesonrces of Ala:ska.lll'e mo.st wonderful. iYuu _ha:ve rdecide'd on rholdi:ng .them, d:hen !Why ·not uevelop i.h:em! .The Government:neetls the11.'ich deposits of min:erals there, ·especially :the ~al. The -.development of :the 'West. the growing importance of the nu.:tion-s on i:he other side o:f the oglob.e, makes it necessm'Y rthat this Government ~all maintain a large .fleet in "the Pacific ·waters.

ilf :this he tme, it will :he necessary to use unlimited tons of coal -:for rfuel purposes. .The .only rather section to get coal ftom -will :be rtlmt ..aection .around West 'Vir.ginia and Pennsylvania. 'IT'he :cost nf this coal -there is high, .nnd ±he transportation expense in .getting it .trom tlte Atlantic sea.b.o:rrds ·to :the Pacific .waters will .be great. The -saving .in !the ooal :resources Of Alaska alone WJ.'TI within .a :.:few "Years pay .-for the cost of the -raih·oad. I need not mentt011 th-e other developments :that will 'follow its constr.uetion. "Whenever and wher:-ev.er a .::railrond has touch-ed .a.n .undeveloped r:o.untry its jlands lhave lncneased .in value, cities ba'Ye •sprung np, and resnur.ces .have :become developed.

I am not :one of those who l>elie'le .that :the -principle of Government ownership of xa.ilroa:ds i.s interwoven . in this question. The Govel!n.ment for aver half a century donated laxge tracts of Government la::nds :fOJ." ·.railroad consi:Tnction. My ·State followed 1:hat _p.rin.eipJe .for many years, not.because it believed in Gov.ernm:ent ownership of .railroads as a policy but because it believed in the development of the .cmmtry .and ..knew that the best way i:o develop it rwa:s . tlu:ough -the building ·of railroads and .highways. ·

In the fifties, when the Illinois Central Railroad was planned ·to traverse my -state, the legislature of it instructed its ·Senators, ·one of whom -was Jefferson Davis, to vote for a grant of thousand.s of acres of her richest and best ·lands to this railroail to aid it in its constr:uction, ·and he carried out their instructions.

.Now, a'S n 'business Government, a-cting within constitutional limits, here is the question : Alaska is -the property of this Government, nnlike a State. It has ·such resources as the Goverrunent needs. 'They are now worthl-ess, but through an .expenditure of some money those needed -resources, especially coal, ·which the .Government now -pays hi-gh ptices.:.for, .can be developed and large sums of money can be saved to ilre Gov•emment. 1 ask you is it best, 'therefore, tor the Government to :lease tnese resources to private capitalists, to be cexploited antl large .tprofits maae by 1 them, or 'for 'the ~Government to do

309.6 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOuSE. FEBHUARY 6 '

it and conserve its resources, develop a wonderful country, and in time save money for its ta:Arpayers?

For my part I expect to vote ·for the bill and assist in unlocking the richest storehouse of the Nation. [Applause.]

Mr. HOWARD. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen of the House, for over 20 years-in fact, before I became of age-l ha-ve been a strong ad-vocate iu my home State for the improvement of our highways. I expect that I was one of the few men in this House to incorporate in my platform when I ran for Congress the advocacy of Federal aid for public highways. In conformity with my preelection pledges to my constituents the first act of mine as a Member of the Sixty-second Congress was to introduce a bill almost identical with the bill now under consideration, which expresses the views of the most able gentlemen who constitute the Committee on Roads.

Tlie gentleman from Missouri [Mr. SHACKLEFORD] and one or two others and myself constituted the "advance guard" for this legislation. No man on this floor will rejoice more than I will when the roll is called and the vote cast passing this bill through this Democratic House, for the reason, Mr. Chairman, no one bill will ever pass this House again committing this Goyernment to a policy that will ha-ve a more wholesome effect upon the prosperity of this Nation.

Since the ye..·u 1900 the people of the entire United States have entered into a movement for the establishment throughout the country of good roads. Since this date the wealthy States of the Union have made great strides toward the improvement of their public highways.

The question of transportation has been paramount to all otller questions since the dawn of civilization, and the evolution in the method and modes of transportation has been most wonderful.

Until the end of time there will be three methods of transportation, namely, railroads, water, and wagon. These methods are absolutely dependent upon one another. The railroad can not live without the wagon, and neither the railroad nor tile wagon would perform its full function in the development of our Nation if it were not for the great trans-Atlantic steamships entering and leaving our ports. Each has a very important and independent function to perform in intrastate, interstate, and foreign commerce.

Two of our great systems of transportation, namely, railroads and steamship lines, have been taken over by private corporations and are operated for pecuniary gain; the third, transportation by wagon over public highways, has been taken over by the several States of the Union, and their · common use is accoi·ded to all of the people free of charge.

Those of us who have failed to give the question of transportation and its consequential tax upon the people some degree of study do not realize bow great the burden carried by the people from this source is. For the convenience of this discussion we will call it a transportation tax, and we will divide the methods of transporting our commerce into three subdivisions, namely, rail; water, and wagon; and by comparison we will see whether or not the question of transportation is of more vital interest to the American peovle than all other questions, including the taritf and other burdens carried by direct taxation in the several States. For an . understanding of the discussion of this subject we should first look into the different systems by whicu the people are called upon to pay tribute by way of direct and indirect taxation for the maintenance of the General Government, Federal, State, county, and munic1pal.

The Federal Government imposes an import, internal-revenue, and corporation tax, which in all instances is added necessarily to the cost of the imported article and the article upon which the internal revenue is imposed, and in fixed charges for the operation of the corporation paying the tax.

The State, the county, and the municipal governments leVY an nd valorem tax upon the citizen according to what he possesses.

Any certnin and fixed charge against the people from which they can not escape, and which is necessarily essential to their liYelihood and existence, may be justly termed a tax. It will be seen further on in this discussion that the import, inte!'nalreYenue, State, county, and municipal taxes sink into utter insignificance when compared with the per capita tax imvo~ed by railroad, water, and wagon transportation. Transportation lays its heavy hand upon all we eat, upon all Wf' wear, upon the fuel we burn, u_pon the oil in tile poor man's lamp, upon the lumber in our humble homes, upou the implements of the farms, upon all that is animate and inanimate moving from one place to another.

'.rhe railroads in our country .have. grown in magnitude and efficiency until we ha-ve perfected in America the greatest railtoad system upon the habitable globe. Our navigable streams

and Great Lakes are teeming with vessels, great and small engaged in interstate traffic. Rivers and hr.rbors are lleing generously dealt with by our Government in lavish appropriations for their de-velopment.

We now come to a question with which this Government has miserly dealt, practically closing its purse strings to this great need of the Nation. There is no country in tile world having as many miles of public highways as the United States· there is no country upon the habitable globe making any p~etense at civilization, having any roads at all, which has not more improved roads than the United States. The great retardinn- influence in the healthy growth of our country is tile great :rmy of unemployed in the large cities and the movement from the rural districts to the cities, which is perfectly natural as a consequence of the prevailing conditions in the country districts of our Nation. I firmly belie-ve that the time is upon us, if this Nation expects to retain the balance of trade in its favor with the other nations of the world, that slle must lend her powerful aid in the construction of good roads throughout the land.

The gentleman from Missouri [Mr. BoRLAND] seems to think that we who represent southern constituencies would !ear this bill as an invasion of State rights. As far as the invasion of State rights is concerned, I hope that none of my colleagues will be unduly alarmed about the provisions of this measure. So far as I am informed, in the past the Southern States especially have been strict in their views upon the question of State rights, but I do not think that when the Government seeks to lend its beneficent aid for the upbuilding of the States they need have any fear that the States of the Union will interpose an objection to the Government appropriating money for the construction and maintenance of public highways. It is only when the Government seeks to take something away from, instead of donate something to, that the States interpose their objection to an invasion of State rights.

It will be stated that it will bankrupt the Nation to lend its aid in the construction of highways, but before thi.s attack shall be made upon the measure let me call the attention of my colleagues to the fact that one of the most beneficent branches of our departmental service, namely, the Rural Delivecy Service, is to-day traversing 42,000 different highways of the Nation and coming in daily contact with 20,000,000 of our people living iu the rural districts of our country. Let me further admonish those who may have in mind an attack upon this measure on the ground that it is paternal legislation that this Government has been placed upon record completely when in the early struggles of our railroads it donated to their aid in the construction of these great arteries of transportation millions of acres of our public lands, valued at over $1,000,000,000; that we have appropriated for ri-vers and harbors since 1875, $592,&>5,000; we have appropriated for building levees upon the Mississippi River. to June 30, 1902, $16,582,000; we have appropriated for public buildings, to June 30, 1911, $213,376,000; estimated appropriations for the Panama Canal, $400,000,000; appropriations for road building in Porto Rico, the Philippines, the Canal Zone. and Alaska, $8,300,00{}-f9r public highways during the period of the making of these appropriations in the United States not one dollar.

We ha~e in the United States 2,199,645 miles of public highways, of which only 190,679 miles, or 8.66 per cent of the totnl, are improved. When this statement is made as to the number of miles of public highways, Congress immediately associates with the statement the bankruptcy of the Nation if it undertakes to lend its aid to their improvement. It is estimated by the Office of Public Roads tl;tat 90 per cent of the travel over our public highways is confined to 30 per cent of our roads, and that the improvement of 440,000 miles of public roads would practically meet the present demands throughout the country. So, after all, it is nothing like as gigantic a proposition to construct good roads as Federal pensions, the maintenance of the Army and Navy, nor would the annual appropriation ever reach a sum as large as was added to the Federal pension roll a few days ago by this House without a tremor in the voice of a man who advocated it or who voted for it.

Mr. Chairman, to prove the absolute inability of the poorer and sparsely settled States of the Union to cope with the question of road improvement, the States of Indiana, Ohio, New York, Wisconsin, Kentucky, Illinois, California, and Massachusett!!l, out of a total of 190,G79 mHes of improved roads, llave within their confines 108,093 miles of this total. Therefore, I mention these facts for the purpose of giving oourage to this House that they may give this measure the consideration which it justly deserves at the hands of the representatives of the American people.

Mr. Chairman, the sooner we, as Members o! Congref\.3, realize the fact that the money in the Treasury Building at the other

entl' of t'he ' A"v~ue ooeg- noit fielorrg"" to.,. us to disii' out-: t<J" the j hlmil: in"" 1831 tHe ... rni.Ji<oa~ cliarge-d' 7I cen~ pe to111 per·m11~; favored departments of this Government as . w.e- see' the · pulltliml' and to-day: the cost of hauling by rail is..f about+ tliree"'foUrtlls ' oft~ exigencies dem:and, rbut. that we are liere ·· only-holding:"tlie crun- l R" cenf"pei' ' tbn, pel!' mile, ornal:Hmt•orre-tentfi: oftliet originall rate. mission o"f' oui!' Q.eopie as rt'heir· agentB; to1 distriJjute• tlieir:: moue~ iPreviumFt<P1825, .w11en• the~ lDi;,ie ~anall wa:s •completed ' tlie ·"Cos fov' tlie main~nanel! and upbuildihg-of."this Nation" as tliey-think~ jof transporting a ton of men:!liantll8e·· betw~en Buffulo ~ and ~w.1 best- and' wisest1; the sooner we- will cunftn;nr.toJ tfie•trutr-measure: l York:. waa $10m Tli&rate• 007 transportation ovet~· the Eiie •Ca:nal placed upon· us· Uy t11e peop1e.wlimr they· eieeted us-ami; sent'"us .. a: its-op-elliilg'rangedl.ftom1$(f.fo·$15 pel"'tonJ outJ aboutl257year.sliere as tlieir dfrect" agents. jlater the• RNm"ttgEP mte-· waH $'3 to- $r'" per--tom The a venxge cos-t

There is hardly a day passing, over the liead' ot a · s1trg1e Mem-· 1 ot· transpo:rthtloiP on1 the Greatt Laltes~and' inland! waterways lis

ber of this House that we cuuld' not··urge, and rightfully so, iestimated1 at from; one:-tliihl" to• one~fuurtti • ofi~ a, centr pe~ · ton constitutional!. objeetions to' appr.o-priati0n.Sctliat1 are•made- bee:mse l per' mile-: In other~ w-o-rdS; it: islfoumf. that' for $1 it is possibHP !it is expedient· to: the welfaoo o-t'"tbe G.ov.er.nment that1 they.r tie• ; to· haul1 l! tom 4 miTes · on· tlie ~ aver<age· country road:·, abeutt 10~ ma.de. Now, :Mr. Chairman;. just_ because' the farming- el.emen~ 1 mile. on; a· grrodJ higliw.ay; 140·· miles by.• mil, 350 to ,4001 miles' by· of the Nation does not happen..to: live upon a navigable stream, j iakes . mYinland~ watevwa-ys; and about ~300 ; miles>omthe l opem or does not happen to• have. at for.t .on1 their. plantations, or hap-

1sea! In short; tiefi re· tlie' farmen. can avail himself of.: thes&

.pen to have; a liarbor ih fi·ont· ot:tliei:r.. homes, or a militacy. po..st , cheaper· means· ot' t~anspertati~. he· must' ov-ercome· the, great. 1n- their back yards is no reason wliy·tliey-shoulef.notHiave- mone:,y

1Harrier between· his- ftbld ' and the nearest railroad station, Ol'

appropriated which~redounds-to tiler benefit of e~errman; woman; lwharf. . amfcl1ild' living-in the interior.·portions·ot·our ·f;reat-countJ:y:- At the- present time: it costs~ the· a11erag American farmer

Tlie report of · the Secretary off the Ti·easury- for 1910i -shows- I about li.6' peri· centrmtroEr tn haul! a-;. bushel ofr wheat a distance:· of 'that tlie tarii:I' revenues ' aggregated' $333;683;440. Tli.ere are- !9.;4' IIIileSi f-r<lm1• his. fariiP to the., rmighboring. rail±ond' station; 18,400,000 families in the United States, ac'Cording- to the· last" ' tharu it d.o~ totshipl it:L from New· York to · lliver.nool;, a · distance~ census, and the tariff tax apportioned among these families 1 o~3;l.O.O • mii~ •· ;would amount to $18.13·per family: . j l:t..we:had-:. wsy.stem;o:fl good.roads throughout the · co~mtry the ·

The Interstate Commerce Connnission reports that the gross fiu:mers>-would; snverm{ the cost · of: wagon transportation of! the earnings• of the railroads from~ transnortation alone- for• the !cotton: crop, ann.uall:yJr$5',076,183-; _of; the.·.~heatr crop~ . $10,256,.058·; same period· aggregated, $2;787,266;136 , If this amoun:t is> di- 1of:: the co . Cl'<JP, $12;'709;278'; · whereusd.tl now costs forr wa~on• ,vided by the number of families iru the. United States it will jt'ranspoutationl to. get these~ thr.ee• great. crops to• market . tWJ.ce1 be found~ that the• transportation· tax trom· the- nrilroads •thiS. sum-amounted to: $151~48 per fa.mil~, and fur.ther pursuing the..-prolJ~ l TRliJ Eli'FECTS' Oii'-GOOD •BOADS UPON FARM VALUES,

I em: it this amount is divided by the number of. inhabitantt~ in· Itl is4 estimated; tliat· g.ood• roads wouldt add' from r $2~ ta, $10 r j)er the· United.Stntes1 ib will be found thau this tax:.equals.~$30- pe:r· !a:-cre-to•landlvaiues. The · total. area~. o:t'farml lunds.i tlie Ui:lited. caniful per-annum~. oc $2.50 per monthl upon. every• man; . w-oman1• ' States . ink 1900· was r 850,000,000: acres. · I't is' estimated an in"and child. In additioru to· the railroad transportation-tax, . it is; :crease•ofi $0-per. acre-; l>yctl:ie ~ constr.uc.tion - orgoBd roa:ds;. wouldL estimated that water transportation for the. flscal ye-a~1906-:-7 !adi:I to,our,taxatila:v.alues $11~250jQO{);OOO · per. annum: amounted' to $550,000,000, or $5.98· per• capita. For the same l One of tlia: gr,e-atestr dra.wbacks·1 to• the filrme.r Hn the 'i'act- thnt. period1it is ,estimatedJ that wagon: transportation taxed the·p_eople !und!ll' the-·present-condltlom ofr the roadsdllroughDut ~country;. : oil the U"nitedtStates $1:,600;000,000, or $1..7 39 per.-capitn:. he is practibally:isolb.ted,from;ma.rlret dm~lng..t:b.e wmten·months •.

In1 all probability the question· will be askedr how the· cost oft ;Tills is espeeiall~- true-in1 the South; . where, we• do • not- have the · :wagon transportation. can be estimated' with anr deg~ee+of ac- \Continuous hard freezes incident to the• climate-• of· the· States• curacy. To1be perfectly. frank with you; it can not. be estimated; !fP.rther north~ . No· matter what prices, cotton, corn., wheat,. or ,wi~h mathematical certainty a~ to the· annual cost,_ but it is 1

1 othe~~ farm products-· are·qu?ted· at: on . a; giNen day, if the roads estimated· by, the Office of' Publlc Roads that the· average' dfs...-. are·unpassable•the· farmer Is · helpless ttJ take ad;vanmge of the tance to market in• the United States.is 9.4- miles, and: that the 'high· prices; theruwhen·. the roads are·in; passable condition• and~ average cost for wagon transportation in this . countny is 25• I the great bulk of> the staple. cr.ops is' stilL in1 the hands of. the• cents per ton• per mile. The. total amount o:t freight handled~ ;farmer- a ·. general· movement to market. necessarily follows and) by rail and: water fon the fiscal! yean 1906-7 was1 in· round' depresses prices, and; the tfamer is ... tb.e · loser.- thereby; numbers; 1,100i000,000t tons. I Another great item of cost and: losSJ to the country ' is in the ·

It· is estimated that more- than• half of this~ tonnage was· fact that the· very time the.• farmen should be doing:. his. hauling, hauled. to and from the railway and waterway by. wago~ and. is• when the ground-. is- toe r wet and· the weather too bad. to , till' it would be fair to estimate-that .as much as .one-third' more·wa:s· ' the. soil and1 w.ovk his crons,- bub at.. that time the roads· are also finally hau1edlto the ,consumenby wagon. on· what we may tet!m ' impassable; thereforeohe will neeessar,ily. be-compelled to take· a second handling, making a . total of 800;000,000 tons hauled ;good weathe1• to market his . crops-and~do · hi.s · hauling, . when.he by wagon. In addition to this, a. large bulk of the·cotton.crop; .. couldib&de.voting·his .time·to hia·pursuits at home . . which, amounts appr<>ximata.ly to 3,000,000 tons annually, ia1 ! Mr~ Chairman, far the· last few. years· we· have bean\ continuhauled from• the farm, to · the ginl thence back. to the faxm, and~ tally-h.earing-the·cry frolllievelj"'source.·o:t) "Back to the farm." "finally to the railroad or wharf"_ The· cost ot this extra. hauL is, The brainy boys- and girls;ofi om~ rnral districts are contlnuauy~ not included in the above estimate. It should also be stated seeking to •escape the social• conditions . prevalent: in., the country · that large quantities_ of agricultural, forest, and.. miscellaneous during the< long; . dreary, win ten months of. the year, attributable products are first-hauled· in their crude state over ·the common' almosu enti:rely·to•ba{lr roads. The dr:ift of. our. population :from· roads before they reach the rffilroads and waterways, thus the· rural~ distriats • to the cities is really becoming alarming .. necessitating a rehauling of these- products. So it is perfeetly Much:o:.: the·sociaLisolationlhas been ameliorated by tlie extenfair to estimate that the per capita transpo.J.'!tation:; tax:. on the · sion· of!" telephone-- lines in• the· country and. rural free delivery, people of this country, amountsfto; $53.37 as against a tari:ffi tar but tHese great conveniences do • not yet satisfy those who liYe.· of $18.13: 1 upon. the· farm. Instead ot the winter months in the rural dis-

It is estimated by the Director o~ the Office- of Public Roads, 'tricts being~ the most pleasant and• profitable of· the year; they Mr. Logan Waller Page, w.b.o, in. my opinion,, is the greatest" mean• absolute• social isolation. Had: roads prevent attendance expert on road building and· wagon transportation• in· the · world at school and church; they make literary societies, social gathto-day, that after a very careful study of.· this question. by him erings, club and .. lodge meetings . practically impossible during he has discovered that the cost of transportation over the the bad weathen of tlie. winter. magnificent roads of England, Germany, and France by wagon Mr. Chairman, I beJieve that I: know. tli~people who live upon. is only 10 cents per ton,per mile, But'; eillninating any doubt as the farms o.t this country as w.ell.as .any.one. They. are the most' to the cost in. these countries of· transporting a ton a mile. by sociable• people. on. the . face of~ the eal±h. They love to go to ,wagon, we will say that it. amounts to l.2i cents per ton· pe1~ chnr.ch.; they. are ambitious . to. send- theii: children.: to schooL . mile. If by the construction of good roads in the Uhite.d States . They love to. visit. one t another::· and· exchange ideas; they love ~e can reduce the cost ot wagon transpor.tation from. 25-cents to visit the . sick; and1 w.hen the week. end:. comes thev want to per ton pel' mile to 12! cents per--tOIL.pel' mile, we will sa.ve the. go . to . the nearest village, store. The. Representatives· in this . people of this country, on this item alone, at the vecy least HOuse who-li:Ve in. the large cities, .eitlier in.an apar..tment house .calculation, $500~00,000 per annuiru ov in a nrivate dwelling,. can not appmeiate · tliese people. IT a

In 1817 the wagoners using the old Ciunherland:. Road only newcomer moves; into· the. comm11.Ui:cy, all tlie. neighbors go and: charged 18 cents per ton per mile fOr hauling upon tliis.hi.gh.way;. visit him and welcome• him- in.. thein midst; . tint we can. Wve in· and. it is. said that this. allowed. a. pro.fi.t t<l. the-w-agoner. T.O-day the large cities-in. an; apartment house.or next door to a family tha average . cost of wagon· transportation per· ton. per mile is fon 10' year.s and n~vec.: know: t'heir· rrameB: So· the· cry of' back more than it was 90 years ago on. this.. road;. wlille, . on· the otfie to the farm wnr not be' met; irr my opirtiorr, until something , ist

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3098 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE._ FEBRUARY 6,

done to make country life more attractive and the development of the farm more rapid.

In 1850, 12.5 per cent of the population of the United Sb;l.tes were living in cities of 2,500 or over; in 1890, 35 per cent; in 1900, 40 per cent; in 1910, 46 per cent. · . Mr. Chairman, the United States is the only powerful nation on earth that does not lend its aid in the construction of highways, and to-day, by the failure of this Government to do its part in the upbuilding of the Nation, it is suffering, from a commercial standpoint, the loss of millions upon millions of dollars. Just to think, the exports and imports of Germany, Belgium, and Holland, three little countries of Europe no larger than our own State of Texas, were three times as much as the exports and imports of the United States in the year 1910, and in these countries you find as fine systems of public highways as there are in the world, penetrating every section of the country, placing the farmer and producer in easy access of the market by quick and cheap transportation.

It is to be hoped that this Democratic administration will deal more liberally with the farmer than he has been dealt with in the past. It is to be hoped that this great Government will lend its ear to the demands of that class of our people who produced upon the farms in the year 1910, $8,926,000,000 worth of farm products. We can not be too liberal in dealing with our farmers and rural population. We must extend the work of agricultural education. We must encourage the building up of our farms. We must not be unmindful of the fact that the farmer has always been found ready to do his part in the maintenance of this Government. In times of peace he has aided in our commercial strength more than any other citizen ; in times of war he has willingly laid down his hoe to shoulder his musket in defense of his counh·y. It is stated as a historical fact that at the Battle of Gettysburg the First Minnesota Regiment went into that battle and in 35 minutes lost 83 per cent of its men in killed and wounded; the Twenty-sixth North Carolina nt the same time went in with 77 strong and at the end of three days' figh ting only one man out of that company was left. Mr. Chairman, these two regiments were composed entirely of farmers, and the bravery displayed by these farmer soldiers in this great, decisive, and bloody battle of the Civil War has never been excelled by any soldiers in the history of the world.

These facts are only mentioned to call the attention of this House to the fact that the farming element of this country are not mendicants and beggars. They do not make unreasonable demands upon their country. They do not complain and grumble when they do not get everything they want; but they are making a demand of their Representatives for relief from a condition in this country which amounts to a national shame. They do not ask it solely as a contribution; they see the great economic importance· of direct and immediate legislation upon this subject.

The constitutional objections that were interposed in the early history of our counh·y by President Monroe and other strict adherents to constitutional technicalities have all been overridden and cast to the four winds- of the earth by subsequent acts of Congress. It is my humble opinion that in this modern day and time no Member would seriously argue that it was unconstitutional, under Article I, section 8, of the Constitution, that Congress shall have the power to " establish post offices and post roads"; that this Congress could not appropriat~ money for the improvement and maintenance of roads over which this Government daily carries its mail. If the word "establish" means simply, as has been argued by great constitutional lawyers in the early history of this country, to "point out," then the Constitution, if that be the true meaning of this section, has been violated hundreds of times by the building of post offices. Surely it will not be argued that to establish post offices means to erect buildings and to establish post roads means only to point them out.

In conclusion, Mr. Chairman, it may be proper to say that at this moment 95 per cent of the people of this country will applaud every single Member of this House who casts ·his vote in favor of the improvement of our national highways, and that for one time you will not be met by your constituents with the ·frown with which you are usually greeted after a general -appropriation bill has been passed, appropriating millions of dollars for purposes in which the farmer can see no benefit. Let a Democratic House pass this bill for the appropriation of money by the Federal Government for the construction of good roads and it will receive the plaudits of that great class of our citizens who reside in the rural districts of this great counh·y, " .Well done, good and faithful servants."

By unanimous consent leave was granted to Mr. LoBECK and to 1\fr. BROWNE of Wisconsin to revise and extend their remarks in the RECORD.

Mr. SHACKLEFORD. Mr. Chairman, I move that the committee do now rise.

The motion was agreed to. Accordingly the committee rose; and Mr. RAINEY having

resumed the chair as Speaker pro tempore, l\fr. RUBEY, Chairman of the Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union, reported that that committee had had under consideration the bill H. R. 11686, the good-roads bill, and bad come to no conclusion thereon.

.ADJOURNMENT. Then (at 10 o'clock and 34 minutes p.m.), on motion of Mr.

SHACKLEFORD, the House adjourned until to-morrow, Saturday, February 7, 1914, at 12 o'clock noon.

EXECUTIVE CO~lliUNICATIONS. Under clause 2 of Rule XXIV, a letter from the chairman of

the Public Utilities Commission of the District of Columbia, transmitting a report of an examination of the accounts, books. and records of the Washington Railway & Electric Co., was taken from the Speaker's table and referred to the Committee on the District of Columbia.

REPORTS OF COMMITTEES ON PUBLIC BILLS Al\T)) RESOLUTIONS.

Under clause 2 of Rule XIII, bills and resolutions were severally reported from committees, deli>ered to the Clerk, and referred to the several calendars therein named, as follows: -

:Mr. O'LEARY, from the Committee on the District of Columbia, to which was referred the bill ( S. 1294) to regulate the hours of employment and safeguard the health of females employed in the District of Columbia, reported the same without amendment, accompanied by a report (No. 224), which said bill and report were referred to the House Calendar.

Mr. O'HAIR, from the Committee on Military Affairs, to which was referred the bill (H. R. 6750) granting to the city of New Orleans right of way for a street across the Jackson Barracks Military Reservation, in the parish of Orleans, State of Louisiana, reported the same with amendment, accompanied by a report (No. 228). which said biJl and report were referred to the Committee of the "\"i'hole House on the State of the Union.

He also, from the same committee, to which was referred the bill (H. R. 12806) authorizing the Secretary of War to grant the use of the Fort McHenry Military Reservation, in the State of Maryland, to the mayor and city council of Baltimore, making certain provisions in connection therewith, providing access to and from the site of the new immigration station heretofore set aside, and appropriating certain money, reported the same with amendment, accompanied by a report (No. 229), which said bill and report were referred to the Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union.

l\1r. MOON, from the Committee on the Post Office and PoRt Roads, to which was referred the bill (H. R. 12928) to amend the postal and civil-ser>ice laws, and for other purpo es reported the same with amendment, accompanied by a report (No. 231), which said bill and report were referred to the Committeeof the Whole House on the state of the Union.

REPORTS OF COMMITTEES ON PRIVATE BILLS AND RESOLUTIONS.

Under clause 2 of Rule XIII, Mr. GOEKE, from the Committee on Inter tate and Foreign

Commerce, to which was referred the bill ( S. 3192) wniving the age limit for appointment as cadet engineer in the RevenueCutter Service of the United States in the case of John S. McKinney, reported the same without amendment, accomp:mied by a report (No. 230) ; which said bill and report were referred to the Private Calendar.

CHANGE OF REFERENCE.

Under clause 2 of Rule XXII, committees were discharged from the consideration of the following bills, which were referred as follows :

A bill (H. R. 6359) granting a pension to Catherine E. McDonald; Committee on Pensions discharged, and referred to the Committee on Invalid PensioLs.

A. bill (H. R. 12912) granting a pension to Edson P. Howes; Committee on Invalid Pensions discharged, and referred to the Committee on Pensions.

A bill (H. R. 7559) granting an increase of pension to Gustav Shultz; Con:u:illttee _on Pensions discharged~ and referred to theCommittee on InvaHd Pensions.

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-1914 .. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 3099

A bill (H. R. 10819) granting an increase of pension to Theodore Walker; Committee on Pensions discharged, and referred to the Committee on Invalid Pensions. .

A bill (H. R. 10159) granting a pension to Mary A. Elderkin; Committee on Pensions discharged, and referred to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

A bill (H. R. 11466) granting a pension to Charles C. Abernathy; Committee on Invalid Pensions discharge~, and referred to the Committee on Pensions.

A bill (H. R. 12819) granting a pension to Mary T. Houston; Committee on Invalid Pensions discharged, and referred to the Committee on Pensions.

A bill (H. R. 436) granting a pension to James F. Pryor; Committee on Invalid Pensions discharged, and referred to the Committee on Pensions.

A bill (H. R. 2023) for the relief of Joseph A. Stevenson; Committee on Invalid Pensions discharged, and referred to the Committee on Military Affairs.

PUBLIO BILLS, RESOLUTIONS, AI\TD MEMORIALS. Under clause 3 of Rule XXII, bills, resolutions, and memorials

were introduced and severally referred as follows: By Mr. KITCHIN: A bill (H. R. 13041) providing for the

establishment of a term of the District Court for the .Eastern District of North Carolina at Wilson, N. 0.; to the Committee on the Judiciary.

By Mr. WILSON of Florida: A bill (H. R. 13042) releasing claim of the United States to lot No. 306 in the old city of Pensacola, Fla. ; to the Committee on the Public Lands.

By Mr. SHREVE: A bill (H. R. 13043) providing for the appointment of a board for the purpose of selecting a suitable site for a naval-armor plant on the Great Lakes, at the harbor of Erie, and to submit a report on the cost and availability of said plant· to the Committee on Naval Affairs . .

By 'Mr. KEY of Ohio: A bill (H. R. 13044) to pension widow and minor children of any officer or enlisted man who served in the War with Spain or Philippine insurrection; to the Committee on Pensions.

By Mr. BUCHANAN of Texas: A bill (H. R. 13045) to pro4

vide for more equitable and effective means of distribution of topographic and hydrographic surveys and other work of the United States Geological Survey among the several States, and to make such work more effective and serviceable to the several States in the work of improvement · and development; to the Committee on Mines and .Mining.

By Mr. GUERNSEY: A bill (H. R. 13046) authorizing the Secretary of War to deliver to Old Glory Camp, No. 16, of Houlton, Me., one condemned cannon; to the Committee on Military Affairs.

By Mr. ANSBERRY: A bill (H. R. 13047) providing for the erection of a public build~ng at Wauseon, in the State of Ohio; to the Committee on Public Buildings and Grounds. . By Mr. GARNER: A bill (H. R. 13048) to reimburse the State of Texas for defense of the frontier against Mexican marauders and Indian depredations; to the Committee on Appropriations.

By Mr. DALE: Resolution (H. Res. 401) for the establishment of a bureau of information in the main corridor of the House wing of the Capitol; to the Committee on Accounts. · By Mr. ALEXANDER: Resolution (H. Res. 402) authorizing the Committee on the Merchant Marine and Fisheries to ha.ve printed 4,540 copies of volume 4 of the Proceedings of the Committee on the Merchant Marine and Fisheries under House resolution 587 of the Sixty-second Congress, second session; to the Committee on Printing.

PRIVATE BILLS AND RESOLUTIONS. Under clause 1 of Rule XXII, private bills and resolutions

were introduced and severally referred as follows: By Mr. ADAIR: A bill (H. R. 13049) granting an increase of

pension to Edwin S. Palmer; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

By Mr. CAMPBELL: A bill (H. R. 13050) for the relief of William T. Grady; to the Committee on Military Affairs.

By Mr. DIFENDERFER: A bill (H. R. 13051) for the relief of Franklin W. Hilt, alias Franklin T. Righter; to the Committee on Military Affairs.

By Mr. FRENCH: A bill (H. R. 13052) granting a pension to Richard King; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions. .

By Mr. GARDNER: A bill (H. R. 13053) granting a pension · to Annette B. Wonson; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

By Mr. HENSLEY: A bill (H. R. 13054) granting an increase of pension to William G. Reppy; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

By Mr. HOWARD: A bill (H. R. 13055) granting a pension to Thomas J. Roberts; to the Committee on Pensions.

Also, a bill (H. R. 13056) for the relief of the heirs of William H. Harvill, deceased; to the Committee on War Claims.

By Mr. KIESS of Pennsylvania: A bill (H. R. 13057) granting an increase of pension to George Vandergrift; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

By Mr. KIRKPATRICK: A bill (.H. R. 13058) granting a pension to Helen V. Doring; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

By Mr. SELLS: A bill (H. R. 13059) granting a pension to Callaway Williams; to the Committee on Pensions.

Also, a bill (H. R. 13060) granting an increase of pension to David F. Leach; to the Committee on Pensions.

Also, a bill (H. R. 13061) granting an increase of pension to Jackson Stansbury; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

Also, a bill (H. R. 13062) granting an increase of pension to John 0. White; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

By Mr. SHREVE: A bill (H. R. 13063) granting an incrense of pension to Horace Greeley; to the Committee on Invnlid Pensions.

Also, a bill (H. R. 13064) granting an increase of pension to Martha Gage ; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

Also, a bill (H. R. 13065) to correct the military record of James Tweed; to the Committee on Military Affairs.

By Mr. SMALL: A bill (H. R. 13066) for the relief of Mary Bailey Pratt; to the Committee on Claims.

By Mr. SMITH of Minnesota: A bill (H. R. 1B067) to authorize the appointment of L. A. Grant, late a brigadier and brevet major general of Volunteers, to be a brigadier general in the Army on the retired list; to the Committee on Military Affairs.

By Mr. SAMUEL W. SMITH: A bill (H. R. 13068) granting an increase of pension to Absalom 0. Halliwill; to the Commit-tee on Invalid Pensions. ·

Also, a bill (H. R. 13069) to correct the military record ot C. P. Miller, alias Perry; to the Committee on Military Affairs.

By Mr. TAGGART: A bill (H. R. 13070) granting a pension to Albert D. Lewis; to the Committee on Pensions. ·

Also, a bill (H. R. 13071) granting an increase of pension to Adam C. Brown ; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

Also, a bill (H. R. 13072) to place the name of Lieut. William Henry Myers on the retired list of the Regular Army; to the Committee on Military Affairs.

By Mr. TAVENNER: A bill (H. R. 13073) granting an increase of pension to Henry Tomer; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

By Mr. THACHER: A bill (H. R. 13074) granting an increase of pension to William Johnson; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

By Mr. WILLIAMS: A bill (H. R. 13075) granting a pension to Edward B. Hughes; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

Also, a bill (H. R. 1.3076) granting an increase of pension to Watson Goodrich; to the Committee on Invalid Pensions.

By Mr. WINGO: A bill (H. R. 13077) for the relief of the legal representatives of Thomas H. Rogers, deceased; to the Committee on Claims.

Also, a bill (H. R. 13078) for the relief of Benjamin F. Reams ;· to the Committee on Military Affairs.

By Mr. FESS: A bill (H. R. 13079) to correct the military record of Vfilliam P. Dodd for the relief of Nancy Dodd; to the Committee on Military Affairs.

Also, a bill (H. R. 13080) to correct the m~litary record of itobert Wise ; to the Committee on Military Affairs.

By Mr. POWERS: A bill (H. R. 13081) for the relief of Thomas J. Smith; to the Committee on War Claims. ·

Also, a bill (H. R. 13082) for the relief of Henry ·Frederick; to the Committee on War Claims.

Also, a bill (H. R. 13083) granting a pension to William Pace; to the Committee on Pensions.

Also, a bill (H. R. 13084) granting a pension to William G. Pennington ; to the Committee on Pensions.

PETITIONS, ETC.

Under clause 1 of Rule XXII, petitions and papers were laid on the Clerk's desk and referred as follows:

By the SPEAKER (by request) : Petition of the Francis Scott Key Branch American Continental League, of Brooklyn, N. Y., protesting against the "One hundred years of peace celebration " ; to the Committee on Foreign Affairs.

Also (by request), petition of Achille Starace, of New York City, N. Y., favoring the "One hundred years of peace celebration " ; to the Committee on Foreign Affairs.

By Mr. ASHBROOK: Petitions of C. N. Vogelnulde and 70 others, of Newark, Ohio, protesting against Federal prohibition; to the Committee on the Judiciary.

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~100 .CONGRE8SION AL RECORD-HOUSE .. FEBRUARY 6, 19-14.

· Aiso petition of Sti..tzei &; Ullman and ll otber merclianta: ot · A.isa, petrtiOIIi of'"tlie Iiltematronai Seamen"s. Union.ot:America tLou~ville Ohio, favormg the.. passage· of House. bill 6308', · fitvoring tlie: passage of' the: seamen'&:: hi1I. (S: !:l6};; to tii.e G"omrelatfve to inaJI-or.der houses;:. to tbe Committee. oa WaySJ and mittee on the Merchant Mirrine. arr<I Ffsllerie.s. Menna. AlSo, petilimnro:t:Independent..OrUerB'titfi. A:bt'nliam Societies,..

By ~fr~ BATES: Petition. of· r.esfdentS' of:Ashle]", ~ fayOI'ing ot' New York C'rty; protestirrg against tlie passage, or llilla r.e-•Rouse bill 5308 · to the Committee on.. Ways. and Means. stricting immigJ:ation.;. to the Committee OIL Immigration ana

By Mr. BRYAN~ Petition. of the George Washlngtou Bran.eh, Natw:aiiza..tlon~ Al:nerican. C'.ontinental LeagUe,. ot Leany, Wasfi-w a:gamst c:ele- By Mr. GRAIIAM of" Pennsylvania: Petition: of tlie. Nationa1 tu:atron. of u One hundred: years of peace among Englis:h-speak- Associai:i<m of Clothiers-at New York CitY., protesting: agai-nst the ing peoples"; to the Committee on Foreign Affairs~ passage of tile Bar.tlet&Hacon: an~injunetion bills; to the: Com-.7

Also, petition: of residents. a!. Ilillyar<f, Wasll., against· Sahootii.. mitte.e- on the Jhdiciary. · oosetvance bill; to tile Committee on the District o.t:"Columb-ia. By Mr. H.A.XES • 1\femarlal of. the Associated. Cliambe:rs· of

.Also, petition of" tl'le Seattle Chamber or Commerc.e, fayoling Commerce oftlie:Eaciffc. Coast, of San E'l>.ancisco, Cal., favoring, use by Marconi Wireless TeJegr.apb C<>~ o:Cnecessaey,- stations on ' appropriation for Alaslmn exhibit at Panamll=Pacific Ex:po..sition, property now included. in public. reservations-; -m. the Committee to the Committee- on Appropriations.. on the Territories. Also, memorial of tli.e. Amerfcan Federation of Labor, of: San

Mr. BURKE of: Wisconsin·:. Petition of citizens of· Herman, Francisco, Cal., favoring the passage of the. seamen's bill Dodge County, Wis., protesting aga:inst the passage ot natrona! (S.136); to the Committee on the Merchant Marine and Fish-proliibition bills; to the Committee on the J"udiciary. eries ..

Also, petition of the Wi..scons:in. State U.nion, American. Society B-y Mr. HENSLEY: Petition o:f. sundr~ citizens of Washington of Equity, protesting against including cooperative organizations- County, Mo., :prote&ting-against the passage ot House ioint resoof farmers and consumers ill the antitrust bills; to :the Com- lution 168, relative to Eederni r:>roli:ibition:; to the Committee on mitte~ on the Judiciary:. . the J"udictary.

By Mr. CARY: Memo:tial of tp.e exec~ve boar<t ~f the W1s- Also~ petition ot tli&-Bay. View- (Federated) Club, favoring-the. consin State Union of the AmeriCan. Society ot: EX}mty,_ protest- passage- of amendl:nerrt rel-ative to national prohl:oition; to" the ing against all bills wllich strive to define more clearly the . Committee on the Judiciar;y. Sherman: Act; to the <:Jommittee on the Judiciary. _ By Mr; LONERGAN: Petition oftlie National Association of

Also petition of the German.-American Alliance, a!. Ea.u Clafre Cfot1iiers, of New York City, protesting- against the passage, of; ·county Wis.., re:present:ing 106 American citi.zens~ protesting the Bartlett:.Bacon antl-injuncti.on:- bills· to the Comm.ittee on a:ga.inst House joint resolution ~68 and Senate joint resolutions the. Judiciary: ' 88 a~ 50, or. any. othe~ similar prohibition. measures~ to. the. By M"r. MOORE":- Memorial ot Joseph. CI'i:rfst, Leonard Kfng, .Committee on the Judlcutry. Cl:iristian Pfister. and otfiers; and the: German,.American Re-· ~so, petitio~ of the Ge~an-.A.!D.erican Alli~ce. of ~pencer, publican Clutr, oi Philadelpl:if~, Pa., :protesting a~gainst nationaL

;w1s:.,. representing .3? Amer~ Citizens, protesting. a~nst the prohibition; to the Committee on. the Judicill.ry. n.assage of Ho~se JOlnt resolution. 1~ and S'enate.. JOint resolu- By b-fr:. PAYNE:- E'etitions:- of: citizens of the counties of ti?ns· 8& and 50, or. a,ny other prohibition. measlll"es • to. the Com- Cayuga, Wayne, ancr Ontario, State.. of New York~ favoring_ na-mlttee on t;h_e Judicrary. r • . ~ tional proliibition ;- to the Committee" on the Judiciary .

.Also, ~etitiOJ?- _of the Germ~n-Amet;-ca.n. Alliance': represen~ng By Mr.. REILLY of Connecticut: Petitions of U.mberto 2d 50 American Cl~~s, protest~g agamst Rouse jomt resolution Society, of New· Ha-verr, Conn., pro.testing: against the passage 168 and Senate JOmt- resolutions- 88 and 50 or ~~l" other. x:>roof' bills- restricting immigration· to. the Committee on Immi!rra-

·Jrmitfon measures; to the Committee on the Judiciary. tion and Naturalization. ' o

By Mr. DALE: Petition of th~ Order of Railroad Te:egra- Also, petition of: the Wallingford. Brand of the American phers, of ~:f:!r~oltly~, N. Y.: :ra~o-rmg th~ passage of BafJ:U: Continental League, of WaiTing:for<f,. COnn., protesting. against Bacon anti:n;tJUllction: bills • ~o Jie Committee on the Jud q. the "One hundred years of peace cerebration "· to the- Com-. Also, p~tition of. the FranCJ..S. Scott Key Branch of .the. Am_eri- mi.ttee on Foreign. Affairs. ' ~ .?'ontmental. League, of Broold~ N. !--·• R:otesting ag_a:ID:st By Mr. SCULLY: Memorlai of the- Kebrew Progressive Astlie One h~dred ~ears of peace cetebratwn , to the Comrmt- sociation. and. Congregation Shaarey Tphillo, both of Perth . Am·

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tee. on Foreign Affa1rs ,._,... J t t• · t th t b·n t · Hn,.,. •

G. A -n1\.rm-o p~ . trti 411 ttl ai . d ':ti.Zens- ot boy, .~.-,. ., pro es mg agams e passage o 1 s res r1c~ Im-By Mr. :A.n.J.'I.rlu.": e 1. ons OJ.. ca e- r sers an cr migration· to the QQmmittee on Immigration ana Nhtnrali:?Ja·

San Angelo,. Tex-., protestirrg against the repeal of the quaran- ti ' · tine law relative to the sh:i-:pment of cattle from the Soutii.; to on. . . r . . the Committee on Interstate and Foreign Commerce~ By Mr. J. M: G. SMITH. Petition .of J~es. B. Br::une~d Pos4

Also petitions of business men of the State of Texas. :fltvotiilg . No. 111, G~ Army of the ~~nuhlic, agamst changes m flag; ' · ru 59£\8 1 ttv t n "' ho • to the Committee on the Judicmry the passage of Honse b1 ov , rea e o ma -oru.eJ: uses, AI ti~· 411 citiz. . ·"" M:. },;,., . t 8 .:In b

to the Committee on Ways and Meansr so, pe .won. 0,1_ ~ns O..L lC~a_n a~ms unuu.~ 0 serv·

By Mr. GOLD FOGLE: Petitions of the N. r;~ Carpenter co., ance law; to the Committe: on the D1str1ct of Columbm. . of New York City; Jacob G .. Bernlleimer, of New York City; By Mr. SUTHE~ · PaJ?ers to accompany House hill and Dunston Lithograph Co.,. of Dunkirk, N. Y., favoring the 9107; to the Committee ~I?- Pensw~. . . passage of the Ransdell:Humphrey bills relative to flood control; By Mr. WINGO:. ~etltlo~ of Citizens ~f Barlin_g, Sebastian to the Committee on Rivers and Harbors. County, AJ:k.o, protesting agamst the :pass~6e of the Sa~bat:Jl ob-

Also, petition of the woman's Republican Club of New York servanc~ bill _(H .. R. 9674.) ; to the Comm1ttee on the District of ·city, favoring the passa-ge of bills- restricting immigration;. to Columbia. . .. tne Committee on Immigration and Naturalization. By Mr .. YOUNG of. North Daketa: Eetiti?n of M;ichnel Stern

Also, petition of J. W. Doolittle, o! N.ew- York City, protest- and 44: others,. of Sykeston, N.Dak., protesting agamst the pasing against the passage of the seamen's bill in its present- form; sage of the Sabb.ath. observance d~y (H. R. 9674) ; to the Com-to the Committee on the Merchant Marine and Fisheries. mittee on the D1str1ct of Columb1a.

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